New TC G System guitar rig

[guittarzzan]

Ok, I heard about this unit and like all things new, they sound great at first. I checked out the video on line and it looks like they put a lot of thought into it as far as flexibility and connectivity features.
I have two concerns and welcome anyone to set me straight if I'm wrong. First of all the brain of the thing looks a lot like the G-Force I once had. I thought the G-Force was a total tone sucker and seriously degraded my amps (VHT) tone while adding mediocre effects at best. I hope it's a new design.
Secondly, unless I'm mistaken, you plug your guitar directly into the pedalboard where your signal goes a-d/d-a at 96k before it ever makes it to the amp. Now I don't want to get into a how-good-96k-is debate, but to me, it seems like a fatal design plan to send your signal through a conversion before it even makes it to the amp.

Other than those two things, it looks like an awesome tool for gigging guitarists. It just turns my stomach to think about spending over $2k for an amp then send it anything but a pure, untouched signal from my guitar.

Am I not getting my facts right or did they overlook some critical areas with this unit?

steve

[guittarzzan]

...almost 70 views and no comments? Is someone gonna come out of the bushes and say something or am I just gonna have to stand here on stage alone in my thong and tube top?

[Broken]

It will be cool but only worth half what ever the final rrp will be...If that

[Tibbon]

Don't most (all?) digital effect pedals do a crappy A/D to D/A converstion before you get to the amp? Delay pedals, digital filters, octave pedals, etc?

[jjdpro]

thumbsup This is the unit that all of us pros have been "really" looking for. NO AMP MODLELING!!!!

Pros already have great amps that we like..We just want good Fx with great programablitiy, True Bypass, and integration with the amp channel switching. As well as, the ability to add you own fx into the fray..

I have been pleading the companies like Digitech and Line 6 to make a model of their Floor units that does not have AMP Modeling and TRUE BYPASS...They told me to just purchase their pedals.???? !!!!

Difitechs Genx3&4 are nice units, but sound like pure !@#$ when playing thru your amp( even with amp and SP models off!!!)..

So, now we have what we want...Albeit, more expensive, but, look whats offered..

Way to go TC..!!!!!

[TravisK]

I love TC in the studio and the old stomp boxes, but G force was a tone killer and I don't read anything that says they are looking to change that.

[Mario-C.]

I actually like the g-force ... I agree it sounds a little cold but if used in an FX loop it's ok, I'm looking forward to trying those new TC fx, the overdrive stomp box looks cool too

[guittarzzan]

Well, I got a reply from TC yesterday regarding the G system.
The bad: My hunch was right. It's "brains" etc is basically a G force reconfigured for this unit.

The good: He said the entire a/d d/a conversion section is all new and way better than the original G Force. He went on to say that a "pro" player that tested the thing for TC said he actually liked the sound of his amp better when running through the TC unit first. Hmmmm, as good as...maybe, but I can't imagine how it would sound better.

I'm gonna have to demo one of these because, for the most part, it looks fairly well thought out. The G Force, to me, just sounded so uninspiring and just sounded "cheap" as well as making a nice amp sound like a crap amp. Maybe it was the converters and this new unit will be the bomb, but I just have such a bad taste left from buying that g force.

The other gripe I have is that if you want to have the cpu unit back in your rack, there are no jacks on the actual floorboard, which means running additional cables for volume pedal, continuous controllers etc. That part could have been better designed.

My gut says, I'll be purchasing a digital music corp gcx and ground control instead. No effects, but super versital and a great price...and they put the 1/4" jacks for pedals right on the board itself...now that's using your noodle.

cheers,
steve

[cdog]

The guitar MUST be plugged directly into the AMP.

The FX loop is used for inserting FX. My favorites are the Kurzweil Mangler and the Eventide Eclipse. TC is, as they say in Italian, garbaggio. Or was that Carpaccio?

Any AD/DA in front of your amp is utter tone sucking crap, don't believe anything else for a nanosecond. Don't put anything in front of that amp, unless its a wah or line driver - e.g., a Real McCoy wah or a Zvex Super Hard On.

Or in my case, the Stephenson Stage Hog!!!! Muhahahahahahaha. hahahah.

Yes. I am a madman.

[morris]

Originally Posted by guittarzzan

The other gripe I have is that if you want to have the cpu unit back in your rack, there are no jacks on the actual floorboard, which means running additional cables for volume pedal, continuous controllers etc. That part could have been better designed.

cheers,
steve

There are jacks on the floorboard. With two on the rackunit, it's actually 4 in total.


Morris

[Threevolt]

The G system does not afect yout one at all. I used it for the first time last weekend and with no effects engaged, sounds just like my Bogner at full force. In addition I saw Alice In Chains recently and thought " God he must be going direct into his amp".. just HUGE sounding. Turns out he was running through the G System.
I called tech support yesterday to clarify an issue and the guy mentined that Steve Vai is using one (actually bought it) on his current tour. The ability to true bypass all of your pedals is huge.. and good enough for Vai and Cantrell, good enough for all of us.

Cheers

[amost]

It is what it is. You go through the front end of that things A/D_D/A & it's gonna be different than plugging straight in...for sure. The upside is it does alot of shit in a pretty small package....and programmable.

[Man_O_Music]

Originally Posted by amost

It is what it is. You go through the front end of that things A/D_D/A & it's gonna be different than plugging straight in...for sure. The upside is it does alot of shit in a pretty small package....and programmable.

FYI, It has true bypass. It has a separate section for sending to your amp in front and from within the fx loop. So what should go in front goes in front, and time based effects go to the loop where they should go, if u have a loop. Very clever design. I haven't noticed mine being a tone killer at all. But I did notice my TS 808 sucking some life outta my gear plugged into the front of the amp however. Any efx without a true bypass when not in use will. Just have to take a bit of time to get this puppy set up right. But it you're a plug into the front of the amp guy, then you're not using efx anyways. At least nothing that would go in the front of the amp...ie: dist pedals or compressors or pre-amps/boosters etc. So probably this box isn't for you. If all you want is some delay or reverb (coz your $3000 boutique amp doesn't have any) and u have an effects loop you're better off just buying individual pedals. But if u need a lot of efx, and would like a switching system on top of that to operate them with, this unit can't be beat. If you don't need that set up, don't bother.

It is a big improvement on the G-Force also. For the price there is nothing else out there that does what it does. Otherwise you're buying a lot of pedal;s and a switching system for much more money. The loops on this thing are awesome btw. I have a ZenDrive, my aforementioned TS 808 and a Full Drive 2 plugged into them. You leave the pedals on all the time and pypass or enable them through tht eFX loop buttons on the unit, which has true bypass so when they are off they are off and your signal isn't running through the boxes at all. And the TC can be programmed to place those boxes where you want them, pre-post delay etc. You can control efx parameters within the TC with an expression pedal (ie: length of delay etc), and also use a volume pedal. If your a tone guru who won't even put a volume pedal (albeit a good passive one) in front of your amp then I guess you just won't be happy with the TC. If all you do is play in a power trio for your friends weekend BBQ's then why buy it?

But what's good enough for Robben Ford and Larry Carlton (volume pedals and Zen drives or Full Drives), and Steve Vai et al is good enough for me. If there is some micro tonal loss of amp purity by using the TC it is more than made up for by what it does give you. If you need such things. Otherwise take a pass. I never tried the G-Force but it never appealed to me. The G-System does.

Oh and as far as removing the brain and putting it in a rack, all your floor pedals and volume/expressions etc still plug into the back of the floor unit itself. Which is then connected to the brain via a Cat-5 cable. So whoever asked about that thinking it would be a cabling nightmare was wrong. You all should check things out before you speculate. Go try it, read the specs, see if it's right for you. There's many products on the market, mostly of lesser quality. If you like Line 6 stuff, then buy that. But right now there is nothing better than this TC, other than buying boutique pedals and building a pedal board. Which I also have btw. And I'm not converting everything over to be run through the TC. That's how good I think it is. But make up your won minds about it. That's all I can say. But there's my 2 cents on the subject. Enjoy....

[Whitecat]

Crappy AD/DA is what makes classic pedals like the Boss DD2 so sought-after.

I'd say make no judgment until you hear it! You never know what will or won't help or hinder your tone until you've tried it.

[alexamk]

There isn't even any boutique pedals on the market. The only way you could come close to something like a G-system, is if youhad Bob Bradshaw build you your own custom rig.

[qtuner]

the trick to the g-force is not to use the boost. Turn it off by making the boost 0db.

[elambo]

Originally Posted by Man_O_Music

Oh and as far as removing the brain and putting it in a rack, all your floor pedals and volume/expressions etc still plug into the back of the floor unit itself. Which is then connected to the brain via a Cat-5 cable. So whoever asked about that thinking it would be a cabling nightmare was wrong. You all should check things out before you speculate.

That's not correct, making it bizarre that you'd tell others not to speculate. The RACK unit is where the pedals are connected, not the floor unit. The only connection leaving the floor unit, audio or control data, is the CAT-5 cable.

It's true that the rack unit can be screwed onto the floor unit, just as it comes from the factory, but then your other cables must run to the floor unit. Not (necessarily) ideal.

Cables to and from your additional 3rd party pedals have to be run from the floor, where the pedals will be, to the rack unit. For this reason I keep my floor unit relatively close to the floor.

[thheddman]

Do any of y'all understand signal flow...Or do you just read this forum and assume it's true????
You do realize that the controller is just a controller???
No sound passes through it.....
The sound goes through the processor!
And,also....the sound only gets converted if it's going through a digital effect...That is what the true bypass is all about...dur
And as far as the input to the amp.....
It does go to the amp.
Not that it would matter actually,it seems as though there is only one way to plug a guitar in....just like keith richards...with a 15ft curly whirly lol

See,I read these forums,and I can't for the life of me figure out how so many people could be so arrogant,and so wrong at the same time.

I'm confident that you all think you have it figured out....but,none of the things that read on this post are actually always positively accurate.
It's all a bunch of bogus theory,based on limited experience.

It's relative to many many factors that change everything,bit by bit...
I mean,there are resistance issues,buffering issues,conversion,actual instrument output..Amp input.....And that all changes again when you hook up a wireless..
And don;t start that "all wirelesses suck" crap......
Here in the real performing world...WE HAVE TO USE WIRELESS.
The frikkin stage is 40X40,and to interact and actually perform,that is without tangling up on your buddy and tripping and breaking your leg,it's a must do.
And btw...on that subject
Does anyone realize what running a 40ft cable straight from a magnetic pickup would sound like???? try it sometimes....
Now,that one guy.....You can plug directly in your amp all you want..I'm sure the 25 people at the club will enjoy your "pure" tone...
But,do you use an overdrive,clean boost,tuner????
Here's a wake up call....A true bypass only eliminates the buffer while the pedal is OFF...So,the second you turn it on...the buffer kicks in.There goes your "pure" tone...
And yes,that with every single pedal in the world...They have to have "op" amps to operate...get it?
Otherwise they wouldn't use batteries....or need voltage.....dur again


I'm not trying to be an arse...I just wish more people would actually know a little more about this stuff before they go and confuse people who are trying to learn,by having all the wrong answers,and being positive they are right....

[infopimpster]

I almost bought this yesterday at Guitar Center, then I searched and saw a lot of negative reviews.... which stopped me... it looked nice though, multiple loops, solid construction... but way too many people are calling it a "tone sucker"... boost or not.

Would love more first hand reviews.

-steve

[qtuner]

Originally Posted by infopimpster

I almost bought this yesterday at Guitar Center, then I searched and saw a lot of negative reviews.... which stopped me... it looked nice though, multiple loops, solid construction... but way too many people are calling it a "tone sucker"... boost or not.

Would love more first hand reviews.

-steve

because the boost is not actually a boost. it turns off a digital attenuator. By default with the boost off, the G-force attenuates -6db. That is why people say it is a tone sucker.