Alicia Keys Piano

[Animus]

Originally Posted by Anntastic

Hey All....Its Ann Mincieli here....I just wanted to take the time to Thank everyone for the reviews! We worked so hard and long on this project....We focused so closely to make a unique and colorful Piano Tone....We had so many Mic Pre's and Microphones up and would test stuff for days....We came up with a method that would allow us to use our Tube Mics and Tube Mic Pre's as we used 2 plugins to eliminate any noise floor on the samples inherited from the tubes....ALOT of OTHER plugin companies that make the Piano Samples, they dont care about the TONE of the PIANO....They care about how CLEAN the SAMPLES come out, without researching how to get a GREAT TONE and what ways can help eliminate some of the Noise Factors in using TUBE GEAR....Alicia is a Gear Head herself and has been using Virtual Plugins for almost 8 years now....She has 2 Solid State Logic Rooms....If this goes well, we hope to do many more sounds with Native Instruments....Her collection of Old Basses and Old Drum Kits are Insane....She really puts alot of effort into making alot of the TONES on her ALBUM....So Thanks for the Positive Reviews and I hope you ENJOY OUR PRODUCT!!!!

The demos that are up now really don't show the tone flatteringly. Get better demos up that are more varied in style. The older demos from a year ago sounded way better.

[Dr.Innovation]

Originally Posted by riteup3

What about loading times?

On my system (after I let the system warm up) I found loading times
pretty fast, probably around 5-6 seconds.

Originally Posted by davedvdy

Ivory and Quantum Leap are the only ones I love out of the 3. I'm very impressed with the sound....so much depth, and I can hear much of the soundboard come through...very warm and rich. This piano plug is an EXCEPTIONAL value.
I really felt as if I was at a real piano, and I do believe that the resonances in this plug and overall sound character contribute to this.
The samples are clean WHILE retaining character, and this is the first time I've heard that come through.
Btw...the UI is seriously the classiest I've seen too.

Right on. I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks so
On a serious note it captures that true piano feeling and I love how the
different presets actually produce a different sound a la several key environmental characteristics such as mic'ing position, venue type and perspective. My only gripe is the pink hue. Not a huge deal but I'm not a Pink kind of guy, lol.

Originally Posted by Anntastic

Hey All....Its Ann Mincieli here....I just wanted to take the time to Thank everyone for the reviews! We worked so hard and long on this project....We focused so closely to make a unique and colorful Piano Tone....We had so many Mic Pre's and Microphones up and would test stuff for days....We came up with a method that would allow us to use our Tube Mics and Tube Mic Pre's as we used 2 plugins to eliminate any noise floor on the samples inherited from the tubes....ALOT of OTHER plugin companies that make the Piano Samples, they dont care about the TONE of the PIANO....They care about how CLEAN the SAMPLES come out, without researching how to get a GREAT TONE and what ways can help eliminate some of the Noise Factors in using TUBE GEAR....Alicia is a Gear Head herself and has been using Virtual Plugins for almost 8 years now....She has 2 Solid State Logic Rooms....If this goes well, we hope to do many more sounds with Native Instruments....Her collection of Old Basses and Old Drum Kits are Insane....She really puts alot of effort into making alot of the TONES on her ALBUM....So Thanks for the Positive Reviews and I hope you ENJOY OUR PRODUCT!!!!

Ann, thank you for taking the time to post your thoughts here at GS.
Further, I'm going to say *YOU BETTER* collaborate more with Mr. Scarbee, heck...please keep the same team, and create *more* VST pianos!!!

I am thoroughly impressed with the sound and overall product.
Whether its 17GB's or less, I would hope in the future you could come out with a business model akin to having the end user choose how dense your product could be, e.g; having a lite and Pro version perhaps???

Originally Posted by Mr.Scarbee

I'm glad you say the piano has a SOUND. It was important for us. there are many great pianos out there so our plan was not to try make the best in the world - but trying to make the best software version in the world of Alicia's piano.

And for me the concept was simple - I just wanted to make Alicia happy. If she liked the sound and it felt "real" to her - I was happy. If other users are happy - it is just bonus for me. I think it was a nice way to treat the project as we could focus on capturing this particular sound.

personally I had not done any piano before - but as a strange coincident I decided - one week before being contacted by ann Mincielli and Alicia - that I finally had the guts to try doing a piano - it was time. Since many of my respected colleagues did pianos - i didn't want to go into their market for many years - but I could not resist this offer.

I spend time looking at competition - but not that much as I wanted to "learn from bottom" - and see if I could do it in another way. It was very interesting and I hope to do more pianos in future.

However right now i'm in a new project that is even a bigger challenge - and totally crazy...

Congratulations!!! You aced this one.
I'd like to also thank you for contribution to this product.
I've not had that *inspired* feeling for quite some time
(since my olden days playing real pianos) and my fingers felt so alive!

Anyway, please come out with more work, specifically:
A classical guitar or nylon
An Electric guitar that actually sounds real.

The Chis heinz Nylon is pretty close but (to me) not for $500+

One other thing, boss.
How does one learn scripting?

I only ask because I'm a tweak-head synth programmer myself and
enjoy Kontakts fluidity.

As an example of some programming please have a listen:
I'm wondering what you'd think?

Thanks in advance for all you've done!
Regards...

1.) Features an Eddie Van Halen Emulation
SoundClick artist: SecretSolace - Dream Sequence music that quantifies subconscious thoughts, feelings and emotion, finding an unknown

2.)This one features a nylon guitar
SoundClick artist: SecretSolace - Dream Sequence music that quantifies subconscious thoughts, feelings and emotion, finding an unknown

[davedvdy]

Originally Posted by riteup3

What about loading times?

Decent load time, esp. if you have loaded the library while keeping your hard drive on it seems to have a memory of it. In Demo mode it is longer for some reason, so you need to authorize the library. Similar to Galaxy ll load time, longer than Ivory, much shorter than Quantum Leap.

Regardless of the load time...it is worth the load time, and it doesn't take long, esp. considering the sound that results from it. I played it again this morning, and can't wait to play it again when I get home from work. The piano reminds me of a Bechstein more than a Yamaha C7, understandably, it isn't a C7, it's a C3 Neo, and it's got a gorgeous sound. Breed a Bechstein and a Yamaha grand together, and that's what this grand sounds like to my ears, at least.

[Protoolie]

Sounds Awesome davedvdy

Would you be so kind as to please put up a Phasescope correlation meter in your DAW and check the notes from middle C two octaves up and then down two octaves. This is where most of the problems occur.
Pro Tools comes with a free one as most Daws do.

Thank you

[riteup3]

Fast loading makes this piano even better then, just wow! I can't wait.

[Dr.Innovation]

Originally Posted by davedvdy

I played it again this morning, and can't wait to play it again when I get home from work. The piano reminds me of a Bechstein more than a Yamaha C7, understandably, it isn't a C7, it's a C3 Neo, and it's got a gorgeous sound. Breed a Bechstein and a Yamaha grand together, and that's what this grand sounds like to my ears, at least.

I completely agree.
The lower register seem to hit and resonate like the Bechstein
and I too played it the second I woke up...I haven't authorised it yet

[Protoolie]

Would someone be so kind as to please put up a Phasescope correlation meter in your DAW and check the notes from middle C two octaves up and then down two octaves. This is where most of the problems occur.

Pro Tools comes with a free one as most Daws do.

I would like to purchase this one but do not want to get stuck with
another Dud out phase sampled one.

Thank you

[jayman]

Originally Posted by Animus

The demos that are up now really don't show the tone flatteringly. Get better demos up that are more varied in style. The older demos from a year ago sounded way better.

I'll second that!

Ordered mine today from Sweetwater. Can't wait to get it!

[Silver Sonya]

I like the Satie demo... although that is such an eternally lovely composition, hard not to get transported.

I am no Alicia Keys fan, but this is a nice piece of work.

- c

[feck]

For $100 this is an absolute no-brainer.

[elambo]

Originally Posted by Protoolie

I would like to purchase this one but do not want to get stuck with
another Dud out phase sampled one.

My hope is that it sounds like a well-recorded piano, whether that requires phase shifting that's natural to a recorded piano or not. If they have to cheat to make this plugin more phase coherent, and doing so makes it sound unnatural, I'm not into it.

I understand your point, and you certainly have the right to use that criteria for making your decision, but I'm going to decide to buy or not based upon what I hear, and what the mono button tells me, not what my phase scope tells me I should be hearing.

[Dr.Innovation]

Originally Posted by elambo

My hope is that it sounds like a well-recorded piano, whether that requires phase shifting that's natural to a recorded piano or not. If they have to cheat to make this plugin more phase coherent, and doing so makes it sound unnatural, I'm not into it.

I understand your point, and you certainly have the right to use that criteria for making your decision, but I'm going to decide to buy or not based upon what I hear, and what the mono button tells me, not what my phase scope tells me I should be hearing.

Good point.
I do not detect phasing but this is based on my hearing, not a quantifiable hardware/software tool that measures "phase."

Whether or not Protoolie chooses to buy or not I'm sure this product will be a huge hit once people actually sit down and begin playing it.

It's just so good.

[Shy]

Originally Posted by Protoolie

Would someone be so kind as to please put up a Phasescope correlation meter

They are all completely unreliable in telling you whether the mono summed signal sounds proper or not. In fact I've had perfect results "on paper/meter" that sounded horrible. Better just listen.

[Alxi]

I like A Keys and i like her sound... this piano makes no exeption, i think it sound very good. On my to buy list 4 sure

-Alxi

[markham]

Does the plugin allow you to make your own velocity curve for your keyboard controller? Does it come with some velocity presets?

I'm especially concerned with making custom curves, because my keyboard's velocity is totally screwy.

[popmann]

Has anyone tried this on an older PC?

I frankly think it's BS that NI keeps posting the min spec as 1.4ghz/1gb RAM...when every instrument will be completely different.

I would really like to buy this one--I have a real Yammy U3 for my "real" tracks, but I'd like a decent sounding demo piano...and $100 is a price I'm willing to pay...but, I'm on a P4 2.6ghz w/4gb under XP (w/3gb switch). The Scarbee Vintage Keys have done super well--no performance issues...but, I have to watch the MOJO Horns I bought like a hawk and freeze and unfreeze due to it's (I'm assuming) use of lots of layers and scripting...

I'll put my money down today if I knew it would play well...but...since all they're posting is the same 1.4/1gb req, which is BS...

[markham]

Originally Posted by markham

Does the plugin allow you to make your own velocity curve for your keyboard controller? Does it come with some velocity presets?

I'm especially concerned with making custom curves, because my keyboard's velocity is totally screwy.

OK, partly answering my own question here.
I read through the manual, and you cannot create your own custom velocity curve. There are 10 velocity presets, which will be cool for most users.

In my case, my keyboard is completely ridiculous. It's a Yamaha P-60, and the loudest velocity you can achieve out of it is a 105. Totally stupid "design."

So I don't know if this will work for me or not. I can always create a custom curve in Logic, but I'd like to be able to play this instrument as a standalone, not just within Logic. And I'd prefer to be able to do all velocity curves in the plugin itself.

Oh well. My keyboard plays well, but the velocity thing really ticks me off.

[Animus]

Originally Posted by markham

OK, partly answering my own question here.
I read through the manual, and you cannot create your own custom velocity curve. There are 10 velocity presets, which will be cool for most users.

In my case, my keyboard is completely ridiculous. It's a Yamaha P-60, and the loudest velocity you can achieve out of it is a 105. Totally stupid "design."

So I don't know if this will work for me or not. I can always create a custom curve in Logic, but I'd like to be able to play this instrument as a standalone, not just within Logic. And I'd prefer to be able to do all velocity curves in the plugin itself.

Oh well. My keyboard plays well, but the velocity thing really ticks me off.

Most keyboards can be edited to change the velocity curve. I know my Studiologic can.

[markham]

Originally Posted by Animus

Most keyboards can be edited to change the velocity curve. I know my Studiologic can.

Oh, believe me, I've read everything out there on this keyboard. There is no way to internally adjust the velocity. The velocity output is fixed, and it is a linear 1-105.

[Animus]

Originally Posted by markham

Oh, believe me, I've read everything out there on this keyboard. There is no way to internally adjust the velocity. The velocity output is fixed, and it is a linear 1-105.

Time for a new keyboard.

Depending on the host daw you use you could setup some midi transformers to shift the velocity for real time play.

[elambo]

Originally Posted by markham

In my case, my keyboard is completely ridiculous. It's a Yamaha P-60, and the loudest velocity you can achieve out of it is a 105. Totally stupid "design."

You're right, that is ridiculous. I have a Yamaha keyboard, too - I wonder if it also stops at 105...

Hopefully one of the velocity presets will allow the plugin to top out somewhere near 105 so you (or "we) can trigger the loudest samples.

[markham]

Originally Posted by Animus

Time for a new keyboard.

You're not kidding. It's unbelievably annoying. I mean, a real headache.

Originally Posted by Animus

Depending on the host daw you use you could setup some midi transformers to shift the velocity for real time play.

Yeah, I use Logic, and I have a transformer set up in the Environment with a custom velocity curve, but it becomes a real problem when I want to play standalone. Plus it's not easy to draw a smooth velocity curve in the Logic transformer.

I use Pianoteq now, and it allows you to draw your own custom curve from within the plugin interface. Much better.

You know what, though--I hadn't thought of this:
Maybe I could draw a linear custom "curve" in a transformer in Logic, going from 1-105, and then use one of the default curves in the AK plugin. It might just work.

[markham]

Originally Posted by elambo

You're right, that is ridiculous. I have a Yamaha keyboard, too - I wonder if it also stops at 105...

There are only certain Yamaha keyboards that exhibit this behavior. The P-60 is one, and I think some of the Clavinova models might, also. Not sure about that one, though. I've never been able to get confirmation about whether Yamaha fixed the problem starting with the P-70 (the successor to the P-60), or if it didn't get straightened out until later iterations of the "P" line. If yours is affected, it would probably be pretty obvious to you. At least, it would if you're playing a piano VI. Just check the incoming MIDI velocity in your DAW when you hit a key as hard as you can. I thought I was going to break either the keyboard or my finger, and I still couldn't get above a 105.

Originally Posted by elambo

Hopefully one of the velocity presets will allow the plugin to top out somewhere near 105 so you (or "we) can trigger the loudest samples.

In my experience with other plugs, there's no chance of this. It's just that no other keyboard has such a dumb design, so developers would never think to include a curve like this. If you want to trigger anything above 105, it's just not possible unless you can draw a new velocity curve on your own.

[davedvdy]

Originally Posted by Dr.Innovation

I completely agree.
The lower register seem to hit and resonate like the Bechstein
and I too played it the second I woke up...I haven't authorised it yet

I'm glad you agree, I wondered if I was just hearing things, lol.



For those wondering there are 10 velocity curves in the settings menu. It seems "Concave" favors the harder samples, and "Convex" the softer.

[Mr.Scarbee]

Originally Posted by Animus

Most keyboards can be edited to change the velocity curve. I know my Studiologic can.

When I came to NY I asked Alicia to try a Studiologic VMK88 and she really liked that with the piano. We used that for reference when we programmed. I also used Studiologic/Fatar for my Vintage keys.

We were very aware of the fact that all keyboards act differently. I had 2 88 weighted keyboards where the black keys could not play louder than 109 or so. We mapped to piano to be a mirror of the actual piano concerning action so Alicia would not have to change stryle of playing when using the plug - but at same time we analyzed several keybords to be sure we did not map to "blank" spots. Those blank velocity zones are no good if you can't play them, right?

I know Ann brought the Studiologic to Herbie Hancock when he tried the piano - and he was impressed by the action too.

I think it pays off to get a good "work horse" keyboard in the long term.

[screentan]

Originally Posted by riteup3

Ok not sampled, but what about Pianoteq?

I tried a Pianoteq demo a few versions back and my correlation meter was going into the red on some notes with just the piano playing and no external plugin effects or daw processing. It was a while back now and I can't remember if it was individual notes or chords that had phase issues. (No jibes about duff chord playing now please!) I found it beautifully responsive to play but somewhat souless in the way it sounds. I also had to work extra hard to get it to sit well in a mix. I do like their Rhodes and Wurly models however.

Alicia's Keys looks very enticing and is priced right so I'll probably get it at some point if it doesn't have any note phase issues. Unfortunately it is too big to demo so I'll have to wait until some kind soul hopefully tests it and posts the all clear.

[markham]

Originally Posted by Mr.Scarbee

When I came to NY I asked Alicia to try a Studiologic VMK88 and she really liked that with the piano. We used that for reference when we programmed. I also used Studiologic/Fatar for my Vintage keys.

We were very aware of the fact that all keyboards act differently. I had 2 88 weighted keyboards where the black keys could not play louder than 109 or so. We mapped to piano to be a mirror of the actual piano concerning action so Alicia would not have to change stryle of playing when using the plug - but at same time we analyzed several keybords to be sure we did not map to "blank" spots. Those blank velocity zones are no good if you can't play them, right?

I know Ann brought the Studiologic to Herbie Hancock when he tried the piano - and he was impressed by the action too.

I think it pays off to get a good "work horse" keyboard in the long term.

Thomas, are you sure it was the VMK88, and not the VMK188?
The VMK88 is only a semi-weighted action keyboard, I believe.

I totally agree that it pays to get a good "work horse" keyboard, though. I played probably 15 different keyboards for about 30 min. each before deciding on the Yamaha, because I really loved its action. It wasn't until several months later that I discovered the MIDI velocity problem, and it was too late then.

[Animus]

Originally Posted by Mr.Scarbee

When I came to NY I asked Alicia to try a Studiologic VMK88 and she really liked that with the piano. We used that for reference when we programmed. I also used Studiologic/Fatar for my Vintage keys.

We were very aware of the fact that all keyboards act differently. I had 2 88 weighted keyboards where the black keys could not play louder than 109 or so. We mapped to piano to be a mirror of the actual piano concerning action so Alicia would not have to change stryle of playing when using the plug - but at same time we analyzed several keybords to be sure we did not map to "blank" spots. Those blank velocity zones are no good if you can't play them, right?

I know Ann brought the Studiologic to Herbie Hancock when he tried the piano - and he was impressed by the action too.

I think it pays off to get a good "work horse" keyboard in the long term.

Very cool. I use the SL-880 Pro. They must have been phasing them out about 4 years ago since I bought it new for $200.

[popmann]

Oooh...Mr Scarbee's in da house...

See my post above--do you have any feel for what the actual system reqs are for the new VI?

PS-love your EPs. Somehow, I never got to hear them during my whole Gigastudio age...didn't catch them until the NI release. If they're looking for suggestions for an update? Add tremolo to the Rhodes...like the suitcase version had. That's the only thing I miss about the set.

[danika]

Shootout: Alicia's Keys vs. Synthogy Ivory