Lexicon PCM96 Surround

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by elambo

That makes absolutely no sense. NS has been one of the most forthcoming members of GS, even to the point of admitting details and insider info that he may have later regretted. What you're asking is very easy to prove or disprove - why would he lie? To sell product, right? Maybe, but I don't buy it for a second. The explanation is logical.

Don't like the 96, fine -- take a pass on it. But your insults are out of place.

I guess I have to respond to this...First off I like the pcm96 second I never called him a liar personally so where did that come from?, Please work on your English so you can understand a post. I'll say it In blue collar terms "this unit should do more in this day and age with all the DSP it should have in it". I was told the pcm96 was going to replace the 960 by lexicon but its falling far short in terms of functionality..

It says many time in the manual that it can uses 4 machines but not mentioning its mono only...I'm sure NS is a lovely person but his responses fall way short to his customers...I don't understand why people loose focus about being a customer and how you should be heard and not blown off...I have NOT insulted anyone so DON'T TELL ME I'M OUT OF line...If I cant talk here what does one do?.. I called tech support and all I heard was silence on the phone...Now if NS told me it would be down the line in a OS update that would make sense but I can only run 2 machines in series on DSP's capable of Monolithic Tandem.. someone is pulling back on the leash.. I dont care If NS is gearslut of the year I will get to the bottom of this...I was the one who got short changed... I dont think
you should have to buy 2 pcm96 surrounds to run 4 stereo presets in series or is this a great money maker...Wake up elambo and stop kissing ass...

[elambo]

Calm down hothead. Here's what you've said:

"That's a total copout"

"Your response is BS"

"This comment makes me ill"

Etc.

I can understand why you're upset but you're insulting NS, plain and simple, and yes you've unfairly called him a liar. From your perspective, my personal appreciation for a high-level tech's willingness to post on GS probably does seem like ass-kissing. From my perspective, it's me trying to prevent these techs from getting pissed off at GS then ducking out of here permanently. That would be a shame. I've watched others come and go and they leave because they're treated this way. This is not their job after all, their responses are a courtesy.

It's 100% within your right to be pissed if you think you've been confused by Lexicon, and this is a good place to post about it, but I think you might consider the intensity of your tone. I don't see them being manipulative in this case.

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by elambo

Calm down hothead. Here's what you've said:

"That's a total copout"

"Your response is BS"

"This comment makes me ill"

Etc.

I can understand why you're upset but you're insulting NS, plain and simple, and yes you've unfairly called him a liar. From your perspective, my personal appreciation for a high-level tech's willingness to post on GS probably does seem like ass-kissing. From my perspective, it's me trying to prevent these techs from getting pissed off at GS then ducking out of here permanently. That would be a shame. I've watched others come and go and they leave because they're treated this way. This is not their job after all, their responses are a courtesy.

It's 100% within your right to be pissed if you think you've been confused by Lexicon, and this is a good place to post about it, but I think you might consider the intensity of your tone. I don't see them being manipulative in this case.

Yes those statements are all true . Its a matter of opinion if they are disrespectful.
I dont know this guy that well only as a lex employee. I dont care how high he sits on his chair. so maybe let him respond...Do you really think he will leave because of me? well thats his problem then. maybe he doesn't want to be here in the first place to answer HARD questions...So I apologize to him and you and lets see if I can get some clear answers... Not take what you get and shut up

[Mastering101]

The PCM96 Surround can be divided into four virtual machines, each of which can run its own algorithm. This allows the signal from each input to be routed through a variety of algorithm combinations. Following in the tradition of the PCM60, PCM70 and PCM96 signal processors, the PCM96 Surround delivers the versatility and rich sound that is unmistakably Lexicon.

This statement above is from the link on the front page of the lex pro audio site
which goes directly to the new pcm 96 surround.. I'm not posting this to throw wood in the fire I just want to show how easy it is to interpret this as 4 stereo machines.

I know it doesn't say stereo but one could easily assume that being the Quote" Big Brother of the PCM96" unquote that it would have this capability.
Looking at the routing you see stereo cascade machine one and two. I thought for sure after reading the above statements that pushing on the machine button there would be machine 3 and 4 in stereo cascade or series. I dont see my complaint unjust. I know i came on strong but this just doesn't make sense to me.
The about statement will excite you to think the machine is up to industry standard. This will be my final post because it wont do me any good

[elambo]

Every reverb I've bought or been interested in refers to each mono block as a machine, perhaps using different terminology like "channel", but the concept is the same. SSL sells the Duende as capable of 32 channels, but those are mono channels. A Digi card offers 32 channels per DSP (or whatever it is) but it's 32 mono channels. For reverb, a machine is mono. A channel is mono. Stereo takes two machines.

I do agree - they should change it to say 4 "mono" algorithms. I doubt you're the first to make this assumption.

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by elambo

Every reverb I've bought or been interested in refers to each mono block as a machine, perhaps using different terminology like "channel", but the concept is the same. SSL sells the Duende as capable of 32 channels, but those are mono channels. A Digi card offers 32 channels per DSP (or whatever it is) but it's 32 mono channels. For reverb, a machine is mono. A channel is mono. Stereo takes two machines.

I do agree - they should change it to say 4 "mono" algorithms. I doubt you're the first to make this assumption.

I couldn't disagree more.. a machine is always refereed to a DSP engine which can be stereo or mono Like "What a coincidence" The 960l calls the DSP engine a Machine which can be routed stereo or mono. see below I copy and paste it out of the 960 manual..

Programming Machines
Depending on the configuration (see below),
the 960L can be used as one, two, or four
processing machines. The number of machines
available in the current configuration is shown
on the Machine Strip in the System Status
Display. The machine whose settings you are
currently altering is highlighted. Machines that
are muted have a blinking red "M" superimposed
on their machine number.
You must program each machine individually.
To switch to a different machine, press and hold
the MACHINE key, then enter the desired
machine number on the Numeric Keypad.

So machine Is the word used by lexicon for a DPS engine stereo or mono.
Referring to a Dig card that offers 32 channels per DPS or machine "call it what you want" Its not a good analogy. its like saying 6 channels into a stereo machine on a 96 surround. Its just channels nothing to do with Lexicons Machine theory that has been short changed in this day and age of DPS power. Its their way of cutting cost. short changing the Power of the unit or keeping the 960 marketable " I know the power is in the pcm96s ". Especially at that cost...If lexicon will sell me a 960l that sounds this good as a pcm96 I would say I got my moneys worth...

[elambo]

I'm not sure whether or not the PCM96 could even handle 4 stereo algorithms simultaneously. It doesn't have the I/O, so there's that, but does it have the horsepower?

If so - if they're intentionally governing that potential functionality in order to keep the 960L as their flagship, even if only because it allows more I/O - then obviously you have a point. I doubt they'd ever admit to this if it were true. However, if it's untrue they'd be able to illustrate why that's the case.

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by elambo

I'm not sure whether or not the PCM96 could even handle 4 stereo algorithms simultaneously. It doesn't have the I/O, so there's that, but does it have the horsepower?

Do you realize I've been talking about the new PCM96 surround? 6 channels in and 6 channels out...Your asking me if it has the horse power? have you read any of my posts on this thread...LOL..No problem you must have a little problem with English? I dont know

[elambo]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

Do you realize I've been talking about the new PCM96 surround? 6 channels in and 6 channels out...Your asking me if it has the horse power? have you read any of my posts on this thread...LOL..No problem you must have a little problem with English? I dont know

Perhaps, but I have no trouble with math. 4 independent stereo algorithms would require 8 ins and outs, not 6.

Downward spiral. No amount of back-and-forth will provide these features, or the additional 2 channels of input and output.

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by elambo

Perhaps, but I have no trouble with math. 4 independent stereo algorithms would require 8 ins and outs, not 6.

Downward spiral. No amount of back-and-forth will provide these features, or the additional 2 channels of input and output.

Elambo, would you stop trying to pick a fight. I've been talking about running 4 stereo machines in series or cascade as lexicon calls it... so thats 2 ins and outs.
4 machines in a row or effects in a row.. the unit can do 1 stereo reverb 6 in and 6 out if needed for surround..look at the routing page for the PCM96 surround manual .goodnight

[elambo]

Then I apologize for missing the "cascade" element of this discussion, which accounts for the I/O limitations.

[_rd]

So the PCM96 surround offers as many simultaneous stereo algorithms over AES/EBU as the standard PCM96 does over firewire.
Why not three then - the I/O is there on the surround unit...

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by _rd

So the PCM96 surround offers as many simultaneous stereo algorithms over AES/EBU as the standard PCM96 does over firewire.
Why not three then - the I/O is there on the surround unit...

at this point theres not much difference in the algorithm department besides Monolithic Tandem stereo, surround reverb...just 6 ins and outs...hopefully there is an upgrade in the works or they cheeped out on the hardware. i haven't opened the unit yet to see whats in there for dsp...On the other hand I will say
Both units sound outstanding great reverb and delay. I just made the mistake
of assuming I could run more algorithms then the stereo box after reading the manual...

[JonesH]

Has anybody tried remote controlling the different parameters for the PCM96 with a Yamaha DM2000?? Can it be done?

[sctt_stone]

Wow, I do not own one of these yet but I am considering buying a used one and I just got off of the phone with Lexicon tech support. The model I am looking at is digital only and my conversation with him was crazy.

So they are not going to upgrade the firewire drivers, they have given up on it!

Also the unit is not modular in design and therefore analog inputs can not be added as an upgrade!

He did say that it works great with some systems but not others but had no clue if it would work with mine. He was unable to tell me anything about the variables involved in its functioning properly.

How very unprofessional.

[mixerguy]

Originally Posted by sctt_stone

..... I just got off of the phone with Lexicon tech support. The model I am looking at is digital only and my conversation with him was crazy.

So they are not going to upgrade the firewire drivers, they have given up on it!
.... How very unprofessional.

Frankly I'm not shocked at all.

Harmon (Lexicon) has a long history of abandoning products..... from what I have seen.