Is the 5.1 spec unnecessary?

[pethenis]

A phantom center doesn't sound anything like a dedicated center speaker. And imagine sitting in a - big -cinema theater, in the middle of the fourth row, LR speakers 25 feet either side and no center speaker?

[Nate Hoffman]

I have been in a theater where my 5.1 mix was down mixed to stereo playback at a film festival. It wasn't pretty. Given the choice between losing the surround speakers or the center speaker in a big theater, I'd lose the surrounds.

[minister]

Originally Posted by DrofDissonance

I know from experience that in a room with its first significant reflections dealt with (or the room is too big to matter) that having the same signal coming out of the left and right speakers makes it sound like the sound source is a phantom speaker in the middle.

This is not the case.

Indeed if you sit in the center of 2 speakers whose signals are identical, it will appear that the sound comes out of the space between them. Now, in a theater with a 25' or even 50' screen and speakers far apart, if you are sitting on the left side you will hear the sound as coming from the left side. Remember, the signal is identical but you moved so now you are closer to the left and farther from the right. One thing the center speaker does is anchor the sound in the center. Sit on the left, the sound is coming from the center. Sit on the right, same thing.

The other reason to have a LCR is for headroom. You can pack more into 3 speakers than 2. I am not talking about making loud, I am talking clean. Also, balance.

[DrofDissonance]

Thanks! they are all really great valid responses. I guess that I was more thinking about personal listening though, in a smaller room. I had presumed that cinemas have their own tricks to make the listening experience decent for as many people in the room as possible.

Thanks for your time guys

[minister]

Originally Posted by DrofDissonance

I guess that I was more thinking about personal listening though, in a smaller room. I had presumed that cinemas have their own tricks to make the listening experience decent for as many people in the room as possible.

The issues are the same. It is just more pronounced in a big room. You should test this in your smaller room to see. I have done this in a smaller room. I HATE going to stereo from 5.1, even in a small room.

Also, there are no "tricks"! You seem to be under the delusion that there is some super-secret fancy thing going on. The mixers (should) know what they are doing and (should be) hearing something that approximates the theater. Set up the equipment in the theater and physics takes over. No trick there.

[Smallbudgetguru]

Originally Posted by DrofDissonance

I had presumed that cinemas have their own tricks to make the listening experience decent for as many people in the room as possible.

Those "tricks" are called specifications and standards and should be taken very seriously in even the smallest of rooms. This is how we "ensure" translation and "decent listening experience for as many people in the room as possible."

[DrofDissonance]

Sorry, I should have been more clear. by tricks I just meant that they would design the theater room in such a way that would facilitate adequate audio quality even when sitting in far less than ideal places. like say any of the corners or right up against the wall

[DrofDissonance]

OK, well to put some more information out there.

I tried 5.1 and 4.1 and as far as gaming and listening went, I found 4.1 to be much more realistic and had less stereo image "smearing"

Using 5.1 for movies wasn't bad because it was great for dialog intelligibility