HELP - Film Mixing Automation

[Mute]

Hi all !!

First of all, sorry for my newbie questions... I will try to be accurate !
I am starting the mix of a film (short film, fiction) in 2 days, it is my first film project as a mixer. The film will be mixed in Nuendo. So I am digging this DAW software (that I already knew a bit) since few days, and now, comes the time when I dig automation : here is my problem : I have a some headach trying to find the best procedure to automate my parameters properly... So you masters can probably help me.

I try to remember few years ago, the guys mixing when I was working as an assistant in a studio equipped with a big Neve DFC, and here is what stays on my mind about how they proceed (but I might have forgotten steps) :

1/ They were watching the sequence, and listenning to what they had under faders
2/ They where setting their volume (faders), Pan, and EQ without writing anything - just trying things
3/ When they were ready, they wrote automation (1st pass)
4/ Then they passed in touch or latch mode to adjust or add parameters automation.
5/ When they were done, they went on to the next sequence - and every parameters were initialized to zero so that they can start the sequence from scratch...
So here is where I am : I try to find the best procedure to have a clean automation on my project.
How do you guys do ? How could I apply this on my Nuendo (I know it is not as powerful as DFC's "encore") ?
Thanks a million...
---------------
My procedure so far is (on Nuendo) :
1/ I set markers at the beginning and at the end of my sequence.
2/ I work on Preview mode to try things (no automation writes yet)
3/ When I am ready I push the "punch on play" button and Play/write automation for the range between my markers
-> 4/ Here is my Problem : when I apply for instance an EQ setting for the sequence, in the next sequence (after the markers), I still have my EQ settings - I would like the EQ to turn OFF automatically since I didn't write anything on that range...

I hope I was clear ?! Please do not hesitate to tell me if I am completely wrong, mad, or to give me some piece of information, or help =)
Thanks a lot !!

[Jesse Peterson]

Open the automation panel,

N5 - go to functions and select "set initial parameters" while everything is zero'd out. This will tell nuendo to always return to "x" value for everything when there is no automation present.

N4 - if you have to do it by hand and using you EQ example. Set the range around the whole project and go into Auto-Latch/to loop mode. Click it twice till you get the little lock symbol. Now press play in write mode and go ahead and set your eq to 0 and off. This will print this setting across the whole film.. and it will always return there - You can also use the pencil tool and do this while stopped. If you have already written automation that you like, do the same as above, but start from first scene that does not have automation written yet.

My 2 cents
I always do a first pass scene by scene using the locators and auto latch/loop. I quickly get everything to a nice starting point for the 2nd pass. Then later when it's time to get detailed, touch and trim using the punch in/out functions so I don't run over anything that's already there

good luck
have fun

[Jesse Peterson]

Also on the automation panel..

suspend read/write of solo/mute - that shit is annoying

[Mute]

Thanks a million for that clear answer/solution !!!!!!!
That is exactely what I was looking for, and it works like a charm...

-> Do you mean not using the "virgin territory" option ?

-> So here is my "procedure" (correct me if something is wrong - or if you have a better one) :

0/ Before all, "set initial parameters" to 0 to the whole project... Or on N4, write/set initial parameters thanks to the loop mode...
1/ "Preview" mode to try things, set my parameters...
2/ "Auto Latch" mode for the first pass (I write my parameters automation)
3/ "Touch" mode for the next passes to adjust my settings


-> By the way, I do not get everything about punch, it is not really clear in the manual... How do you use it ? What is it made for ? I understood it was made to save some parameters, but if you would have an example, it would be really helpful...

Thanks again

[Jesse Peterson]

Nuendo is one of those programs where there's a lot of different ways to do the same operation which makes it really flexible. Personally, I haven't really gotten into the virgin territory functions because I was already used to it before that was introduced.

whatever automation work flow works for you, go with it. I use about 40% of the possible functions regularly. the others only once in a while

The punch feature works like this:
locators around a scene an enable CYCLE so it loops
enable Preview
set your parameters levels and plugs to taste - stop
enable PUNCH ON PLAY and AUTOPUNCH/to LOOP

now when you hit play, your settings will be applied to the loop and automatically return to 0 at the 2nd locator. This function works in all the automation modes, very handy with trim as well. You can do this many times with the same scene and N5 will store your punches in a list.. after you've done a few.. you can then go back and audition each one to see which fits best. Directors love this

or, you can manually click punch and setting will be applied from where you clicked it till the end.. or the loop.. or the start.. however you want to use it.

Autopunch in TOUCH mode with start and stop writing at the locators.. you can grab a control early and start to fiddle with it and not worry about destroying what you already have.. it will PUNCH in ..

cross over mode is good for ramping up and down.. ramping up for example.. set the automation to play the sound at the loudest you want to hear it.. then on a 2nd pass in crossover.. ramp up.. it will automatically stop writing automation when you hit the existing level that you set before. this is great for extreme moves.

Touch assist button is a global function. Let's say you have an eq you're writing with. Touch assist will add automation points to ALL related automation lanes even if they're unchanged.

GLOBAL SNAPSHOT is similar to saving a new session. It can be smart to take a global snap shot before you start fiddling.. after long hours you may realize you've totally destroyed a mix.. just reapply the snapshot and all will go back to what you had.

Overall, there is a lot of flexibility and you can use it however you want. You don't have to worry about being right or wrong. Just worry about if it's the right mode for the current situation. Practice with all the modes.. get familiar with when and why you might want to use them. As you get faster with it, you'll see your mixing time decrease.. which is what your clients want

[danijel]

Great HOWTO Jesse thumbsup
I also never found a way to work consistently with virgin territories.... I have a feeling it's something made for short-form mixing, like music or ads.....

[Jesse Peterson]

Just read this one on the nuendo board
This how you can use global snapshot to copy and paste settings to scenes that repeat through out a project. I haven't tried it yet, but looks promising. I'm particularly interested in using this for reverb settings

before doing this.. it assumes that you've already automated settings for the 1st of the repeating scenes. Nav to that first scene so all levels are actively in place.. then
===============================

> 1 Store Global Snapshot (all settings (+parameters) of the whole mixer is stored).
> 2 Place your cursor at the desired new location
> 3 switch off "READ" for the whole mixer
> 4 switch on "Preview" in automation panel
> 5 Apply Global Snapshot
> 6 switch on "WRITE" for the whole mixer
> 7 switch on e.g. "Punch on Play"
> 8 PLAY
> 9 all settings stored in the Global snapshot will be written into the automation
(at the new position..)

or filling all your "kitchen" scenes with the same (settings) automation:
here just do the same with different steps 7-10:

> 7 place the L/R locators to the desired new scene (e.g. using cycle markers)
> 8 Switch on "Fill Loop"
> 9 Hit "Punch (preview)"
> 10 all settings stored in the Global snapshot will be written into the automation
(between the left and right locator = for your "kitchen" scene)

It also works with the additional options of the automation panel e.g. that you
only would apply the EQ automation for your scene by "Suspend Write" everything
than the EQ ...,or "copy" everything but not the level automation - as you like ...

Or you would apply your scene specific automation e.g. to the BG tracks only but
not to the location sound tracks by only setting your BG tracks to "Write" auto-
mation and not your other tracks etc...

[Mute]

I really really thank you for all of this precious information !!!
I am testing it right now, and it seems clear now...
I really need to practice again and again to get in depth with it !!
Snapshots seems to be also a very good tool !! It will be for the lesson 2... =)

Thanks a million !!

[Jesse Peterson]

Just ran some tests with the global snapshot step by step

TOTALLY WORKS!

and I've found that not only is this great for the repetitive scene thing.. but also great during a reconform. Some automation is not "attached" to the audio file.. like group panning etc.

I'm actually on a job right now where new picture is coming down the pipe every few days.. animated.. I've been holding off on trying out automation.. but now I'm just going to go for it