Dialogue track volume question

[showstopper168]

Hi everyone,
Two general novice questions to bring up. I had a dialogue track that was recorded in a low volume in the production set; I was just wondering what will be the ways to boost up the volume in Pro Tools. By the way, the dialogue volume was bouncing around -16 to -13 db ppm, but I know most of the mixer mix there dialogue around -20 db, but I feel that the track volume was really low even tho the meter is bouncing around -13 db. And the last question, does the dialogue editor has to deal with the dialogue track volume or the re-recording mixer? Thanks guys for the advise in advance!!

Will

[JoeMilner]

Hi Will,
What level are you monitoring at? If your track is averaging at -13 dB, that's actually pretty loud (ie, +7) already.

Be sure of your monitoring levels before you start cranking up the gain.

best,

Joe

[Jfriah]

You're laughin' ! I sometimes get stuff in the -30 to -35 range!
ENJOY your -13.

As for 'who deals with the volume', editor or mixer---it depends on the facility / agreement as to who does what.

For myself, it is assumed the DIA editor gets volumes in line with "where they should be"

but...as long as they are relative for the whole piece, the mixer can adjust accordingly fairly easily.

(extra gain stage via plugins, volume up on DIA master fader, etc.)

Jeff

[Sonsey@mac.com]

Those actually sound about right.

Production mixing is a dynamic challenge to say the least. Actors will literally go from a whisper to a scream - sometimes without warning! Good production mixers know that you can always gain things up (albeit with some additional noise), but once a signal has distorted, your options become far more limited (once upon a time they were nil...). Therefore they will always record conservatively. It's not uncommon for a mixer recording a single source, to record that source 6db down to a second channel, just to have a safety if something suddenly gets REALLY LOUD on set. Sadly there's no easy way to do that with your ears...

A number of times I've received unusable tracks from "novice" production mixers who recorded like they would an electric guitar or drum kit, and the track would distort every time an actor raised their voice. Followed of course by the director/producer saying "Can't you fix that?"

[showstopper168]

Hey guys! Thanks so much for the reply.

By the way, I mixed my project in stereo, so I don't think it is nesessary for the me to calibrate the SPL right? Generally during the time when I was mixing, I put my monitor level knob on to the 12 o'clock position (Mbox) and my speaker monitor also in the 12 o'clock position.

And after I finish mixing my project, I would compare my mix with the other commercial film. The level on my master track (after compression), the level is bouncing around -8 db, but comparing the other commerical film, my level is still pretty low (sometimes really low). I was thinking that maybe because the commerical film has the layback format with the calibrated SPL level, so their film is louder?

Thanks guys for taking time and answer my quesion, I am fairly new with post production, so I hope I can learn something from you guys and do my project RIGHT.

[Henchman]

Originally Posted by showstopper168

Hey guys! Thanks so much for the reply.

By the way, I mixed my project in stereo, so I don't think it is nesessary for the me to calibrate the SPL right?

WRONG!!!!

You have to calibrate your speakers no matter what.

[showstopper168]

Originally Posted by Henchman

WRONG!!!!

You have to calibrate your speakers no matter what.

Thanks, I see. So the monitor is usaully calibrate to 0 db ppm (in Pro Tools) as 80 db SPL (in the meter)?

[showstopper168]

Originally Posted by showstopper168

And after I finish mixing my project, I would compare my mix with the other commercial film. The level on my master track (after compression), the level is bouncing around -8 db, but comparing the other commerical film, my level is still pretty low (sometimes really low). I was thinking that maybe because the commerical film has the layback format with the calibrated SPL level, so their film is louder?
.

Anyone has comments on this? Thanks.

[FullFrequency]

Originally Posted by Sonsey@mac.com

It's not uncommon for a mixer recording a single source, to record that source 6db down to a second channel, just to have a safety if something suddenly gets REALLY LOUD on set.

Massive +1 on that.

I've noticed a lot though that I tend to get 1 channel boom, and the other channel in-built cam mic. That's what happens when runners / producers take care of recording :(

[Sonsey@mac.com]

Originally Posted by showstopper168

Hey guys! Thanks so much for the reply.

By the way, I mixed my project in stereo, so I don't think it is nesessary for the me to calibrate the SPL right? Generally during the time when I was mixing, I put my monitor level knob on to the 12 o'clock position (Mbox) and my speaker monitor also in the 12 o'clock position.

And after I finish mixing my project, I would compare my mix with the other commercial film. The level on my master track (after compression), the level is bouncing around -8 db, but comparing the other commerical film, my level is still pretty low (sometimes really low). I was thinking that maybe because the commerical film has the layback format with the calibrated SPL level, so their film is louder?

As Mark said you REALLY need to calibrate your room before you can make any sort of subjective level comparison. Also depending on how you got the "other commercial film" in there are any number of issues from DRC to level matching that might make the other seem "louder". Also realize that LOUDNESS and PEAK LEVEL are not the same thing at all. Compression and EQ amongst other things can make a much lower peak level seem much louder. That's one of the BEST reason to calibrate your room properly - you can then mix with your ears and not your meters.

I think your very first step should be to read this. Already read it? Read it again, and again as many times as it takes to become clear. Then read the levels sticky at the top of this forum. From there, you will find your mixes turn out much better. I can speak from experience on that!

Complete OT aside... that DUC Calibration sticky is just over seven years old! Good job Marti et al!

[dr.sound]

Read the top of the sticky:
NEW UPDATED Room Calibration for Film and TV Post - Digi User Conference

[Sonsey@mac.com]

Whoops! Linked to the wrong page! Thanks Marti! Fixed it in my original post.

[showstopper168]

Thanks guys for all the comments and advises. I am ganna to go ahead and read those wonderful info