Can I do theatrical Mixes or just DVD?

[sysyphus300021]

So I am new to sound design. But I have built a home studio that will allow me to do ADR, VO, some folex and fx. I am wondering about theatrical mixes. I am not asking about how to calibrate I have read the sticky. Im wondering can a small room be used to do a theatrical mix if using a x-curve compensation? Or will I have to do stem mixes then send those out to a studio with a theater/large room? The more I read on x-curve it seems like I can use my room? But do small room work well or should I plan on sending out for final mix?

[postprosound]

The short answer is no. While some things might work out ok, There is a big difference between large and small rooms. Since DVD's are generally listened to in living rooms, you may be able to mix in a smaller stage.

One other major reason for not being able to to final theatrical mixes is that you are not Dolby Certified. For you to make a Printmaster, you must mix on a certified stage, with dolby owned gear, and with a dolby tech on hand.

[Sonsey@mac.com]

IF you design,, set-up and know your room REALLY well, you can get 90% of the way there in your room, however as postprosound mentioned, you WILL need to go to a fully Dolby Approved/Qualified/Blessed room to do your final printmasters.

I might also add, that depending on your experience, taking your edit elsewhere to mix can be a very good learning experience. On my first theatrical, after a few years of cutting and mixing TV, I thought I had a good handle on things, but going to a full dub stage for a mix taught me I still had a LOT to learn, as well as skills that still serve me well to this day! (Pierre and Phillipe- if you're out there THANKS!). Plus an extra set of ears can be invaluable! Just because you CAN do it all, doesn't mean you SHOULD!

[sysyphus300021]

Thanks for the responses. I had a feeling the room would not work. I planned to have to send out for final mix on any feature film I do that need a theatrical mix. I have a pretty good size living room with 5.1 B&W speaker I plan to use to help with dvd mixes. Is there a list anywhere of the dolby certified studios here in America? I'm in Oklahoma so I don't think there are any in my state.

[dr.sound]

Originally Posted by sysyphus300021

Thanks for the responses. I had a feeling the room would not work. I planned to have to send out for final mix on any feature film I do that need a theatrical mix. I have a pretty good size living room with 5.1 B&W speaker I plan to use to help with dvd mixes. Is there a list anywhere of the dolby certified studios here in America? I'm in Oklahoma so I don't think there are any in my state.

Contact Minister:
undertone music, inc. | original music & sound design | minneapolis, MN

He has a great room and it's probably the closest to you.
Tell him I sent you.

[soundguydave]

Originally Posted by dr.sound

Contact Minister:
undertone music, inc. | original music & sound design | minneapolis, MN

He has a great room and it's probably the closest to you.
Tell him I sent you.

I second that, fantastic to work with.

[JoeMilner]

+1 for Tom at Undertone :)

[dr.sound]

Hey Minister (Tom),
That's 30% kicked back divided by 3, Joe, Dave and myself.
Now treat sysyphus300021 real good !

[JoeMilner]

LOL :)

[minister]

Thanks guys! Appreciate it.....

You guys should start an Agency.

Now, NO MORE recommendations or I won't make any money with all the points I am giving out.

[soundboy]

Joe, Dave, Marti, you now own 130% of "Prisoners Of Love"!

[thoogenakker]

+1 for Tom here too
good guy & great talent.

Hey, at least the directions from Oklahoma would be easy:
".. go north on I-35.. until you're really cold." ;)

[Jfriah]

And a little farther North from MN, you could keep driving across the border where we are just a few degrees warmer than -40 right now.

Good thing computers like cold work spaces.
Now what aboot the humans that use them...?


(aside: Minister, I may be in the Minn area in June -- once our ice roads thaw -- perhaps I'll darken your door. )


Jeff

[charles maynes]

Tom is fabulous.... (and I have worked with him). Y0u will not go wrong, and outside of SF LA or NY (or maybe Larry Blake in New Orleans) you will not find a better talent.

[sysyphus300021]

The movie I am asking about will not be shot for a month or two. But I'm looking for a place that I can do theatrical mixes. I do have one problem with this movie getting mixed there at Undertone, The Director. When I talked to him about this he said "O we are going to have it mixed in Hollywood". So my reply is Why? Are they better since they are in Hollywood? Is it worth the money to fly and get expensive hotel to do the mix in Hollywood? When I can just drive up to Undertone( I'm also very against flying so any way I can avoid it I will). I'm trying to convince the director that Hollywood is not always worth the money. They are convinced that we can get the crew and 90% of the post done with Oklahoma Crew. He just for some reason is not budging on the final mix. So thanks for the recommendation and I hope to be working with Undertone in a few months.

[dr.sound]

Originally Posted by sysyphus300021

The movie I am asking about will not be shot for a month or two. But I'm looking for a place that I can do theatrical mixes. I do have one problem with this movie getting mixed there at Undertone, The Director. When I talked to him about this he said "O we are going to have it mixed in Hollywood". So my reply is Why? Are they better since they are in Hollywood? Is it worth the money to fly and get expensive hotel to do the mix in Hollywood? When I can just drive up to Undertone( I'm also very against flying so any way I can avoid it I will). I'm trying to convince the director that Hollywood is not always worth the money. They are convinced that we can get the crew and 90% of the post done with Oklahoma Crew. He just for some reason is not budging on the final mix. So thanks for the recommendation and I hope to be working with Undertone in a few months.

I see a recipe for disaster coming. I don't know your level of expertise mixing since you start out this post staying “So I am new to sound design". If I understand correctly, you do need to go to Minister's place. That way you can set up a consulting service with Tom to review your Sound Editorial at every stage. I really think that you should do the Sound Editorial and let Tom mix it. You will learn quite a bit that way. If you mix it then bring it to Tom, he might have one hand tied behind his back. Sensing that this is a big movie for you, and what the director is looking for (he is willing to go to Hollywood to mix) if this movie wants to get the best bang for the buck and a very good learning experience for you go to Ministers place. I have heard his work and it is good. Anyone who knows me realizes that I don't recommend a person unless they are good.
Tom is GOOD! Work together with him, hear your editorial on a dub stage and apply what you have learned on future products. Your client will be MUCH HAPPIER that way!

[Jfriah]

Oh how I love to hear stories of people that just MUST spend money in a certain zip code...

Good luck derailing THAT train, Sys---

(been there...)

And, absolutely not meant as anything other than to scratch my head, but you say you are new and I assume that the director is not a seasoned vet? I'm always just keen on reasons certain clients feel they must mix a film in a certain locale. Mostly; I'd wager: for the networking and blackberry op's. Perhaps he's hoping to run into James Cameron at the coffee machine or something.

Get him a quote from Undertone. Then have him price out facilities in "Hollywood". Get him the one from Undertone FIRST. Then if he gasps at that, well...



Jeff

[sysyphus300021]

Originally Posted by dr.sound

I see a recipe for disaster coming. I don't know your level of expertise mixing since you start out this post staying “So I am new to sound design". If I understand correctly, you do need to go to Minister's place. That way you can set up a consulting service with Tom to review your Sound Editorial at every stage. I really think that you should do the Sound Editorial and let Tom mix it. You will learn quite a bit that way. If you mix it then bring it to Tom, he might have one hand tied behind his back. Sensing that this is a big movie for you, and what the director is looking for (he is willing to go to Hollywood to mix) if this movie wants to get the best bang for the buck and a very good learning experience for you go to Ministers place. I have heard his work and it is good. Anyone who knows me realizes that I don't recommend a person unless they are good.
Tom is GOOD! Work together with him, hear your editorial on a dub stage and apply what you have learned on future products. Your client will be MUCH HAPPIER that way!

First who is Minister did I miss something sorry? But yes I am new in my mind. I have though been working and learning with at guy named Kini Kay. He did sound work out in LA for many year. He knows more then anyone here in my area and does know what he is doing. He has retired, so he has been teaching me more then anything. We are kind of working as a team now. I have done countless indie films and lots of commercials. I have been trying to get as much exp as I can get. The director I am working with is new kind of. He was the 1st AD for Million Dollar Baby and has directed smaller movies here in Oklahoma. He is usually 1st AD on any big feature that comes here too. He is good. I was the dialog editor, adr recorder/mixer, and a lot more of one of his film. He has allowed me though to be head of post sound for this next film. We get along great. No worries about any disasters. I just dont want to waist money on Hollywood when its not needed. When I start things with "I am new to sound" or something like that. Thats just me. BUT sound( I dont just mean film, its all good) is my world. Its what I do all day so I am putting my all into it and this director has let me have a chance to do his sound work. I think I can say for sure I have the best sound collection for a 08 Subaru WRX. I just record stuff all day.


p.s. I have been drinking and watching The Networks so grammar and spelling may suck sorry.

[charles maynes]

Minister is Tom Hambleton....

I will let our re-recording mixers cover the rest.....

[dr.sound]

Originally Posted by sysyphus300021

First who is Minister did I miss something sorry? But yes I am new in my mind. I have though been working and learning with at guy named Kini Kay. He did sound work out in LA for many year. He knows more then anyone here in my area and does know what he is doing. He has retired, so he has been teaching me more then anything. We are kind of working as a team now. I have done countless indie films and lots of commercials. I have been trying to get as much exp as I can get. The director I am working with is new kind of. He was the 1st AD for Million Dollar Baby and has directed smaller movies here in Oklahoma. He is usually 1st AD on any big feature that comes here too. He is good. I was the dialog editor, adr recorder/mixer, and a lot more of one of his film. He has allowed me though to be head of post sound for this next film. We get along great. No worries about any disasters. I just dont want to waist money on Hollywood when its not needed. When I start things with "I am new to sound" or something like that. Thats just me. BUT sound( I dont just mean film, its all good) is my world. Its what I do all day so I am putting my all into it and this director has let me have a chance to do his sound work. I think I can say for sure I have the best sound collection for a 08 Subaru WRX. I just record stuff all day.


p.s. I have been drinking and watching The Networks so grammar and spelling may suck sorry.

I looked up Kini Kay on IMDB:
Kini Kay

He looks like he would be a good mentor for the Sound Editing side of things.
I still think it best to have Minister (Tom) mix your movie.
Your B&W's speakers are good music speakers but not so great translating to a large room/ dubbing stage environment.
I know that Minister will mix the Feature better than you can because of his knowledge and experience. If you disagree with me that's fine. We all need to start somewhere.
If your Director would like to talk with someone in Hollywood, have him contact me.
Just click on the link below.

[sysyphus300021]

I never planned to do anything more then a basic mix for the movie. I know I need to learn. I was not trying to say I wanted to do the whole mix by myself. I planned to have my first few features send out to a finishing house for the final mixes. But with each that I do I learn more. I dont expect the B&W to be mixing speakers. They are just another set of speaker to check the mix on. They are good speakers too. O and they are not my studio speakers. I have JBL LSR 4328.

[minister]

Originally Posted by sysyphus300021

First who is Minister did I miss something sorry?

You know I wonder this myself sometimes....

Thank you for all the generous support from dr.sound, soundguydave, Charles, Joe, and Tim! I'm humbled.

To the OP, I think we have established that your room -- for one thing, you don't use the X-curve in a room that small -- and your experience are probably not up to doing this. I am surprised that Mr. Kay has not explained this to you, but I understand your enthusiasm of wanting to do sound. So you should take it somewhere, and you should rely on Mr. Kay and discussions with the Re-recording Mixer where you decide to take it to prepare the elements. Poorly prepared sound editorial can really tie a mixers hands. And then it won't matter where you take it, it will be severely compromised. Even in Hollywood.

Though I can understand the director wanting to take to somewhere that knows movies, like the entertainment capital of the U.S., but, good even great work can and does get done outside of Hollywood all the time. (Surprised he doesn't want editorial done there too.) This is to take nothing away from anyone in H-wood, but I am here to tell you, you don't need to be in LA to get work (even good work), and you don't need to be in LA to be good at what you do. AFAIK, I have the only Dolby-tuned and approved Dub Stage in the Midwest. Otherwise, I can think of facilities in Salt Lake City and New Orleans, and then you have to go to NYC (and of course SF) or Canada.

I suggest you mull over the possibilities, discuss things with the Director and Mr. Kay. And feel free to give me a call or drop me an e-mail next week. In the end, we all know it is the Director's decision, for everything.

Oh, and by the way, we have the smartest people of any city in the US:

America’s smartest people - Destinations- msnbc.com

But it is currently 15ºF with WC down to -5! So, I don't know how smart we really are......... (It is lovely here in the summer).

[sysyphus300021]

Thanks all for the replies. I never thought I would be able to do the final mix. I was just wondering what my room could do with a x-curve? I have not gone over this with Kini because I just build the 2 rooms. Although in the past we have both agreed that you have to mix a movie in a theater if you want it to sound right in a theater. That to me seemed easy to figure out. But I wanted to ask anyways. Here is a pic

I just took 2 rooms gutted them and sound proofed the rooms as much as I could. I also get rid of parallel walls. Also redid electricity and HVAC system in the 2 rooms. You can hear nothing coming from the outside and I can make lots of noise. Even got windows with a STC rating. I built the rooms planning to do mostly editing, adr, vo, and maybe stem mixes. I get a lot of work to clean up audio too. I have been doing more and more indie films so I needed somewhere I could work. I did adr in the rooms before but it sucked to deal with neighbors dog. I never thought during the building process I would be able to do a theatrical mix. I started to read on x-curve so I thought I would ask. Thanks again for all the recommendations. I would like to start working with a studio now early in my career.