Website credibility- film music work

[spidernook]

Has anyone ever heard of or used the site Film Music Network -

I have been getting mail with "jobs" from them as a non member for a long time but I never pay attention but next year I'm going freelance and now these emails look good. Is this just a crappy spam site that takes your money or does anyone actually get work from it?

[drBill]

Never seen any work from it. Tried it a couple of times, never even got a confirmation that the receiving party got my submission.

[Etch-A-Sketch]

As a general rule, I try to stay away from any sites that charge you to submit. Most people never see anything from it, even if the music you submit is amazing. That's not to say that some people have had good luck... it's just those are the exceptions, and not the norm.

[mnortham]

Hi Spidernook and all -

I'm a composer myself and head up the Film Music Network, and would be happy to answer any questions about our services. A quick overview/snapshot:

* We've been in business since 1997, and our goal is to locate opportunities for our members and readers to get their music into film and television.

* We're somewhat similar to TAXI, except we don't screen submissions - all music submitted is sent directly to job posters. Our member submission fees are among the lowest of any job service (TAXI, Broadjam, Sonicbids, etc)

* For job posters that use our online SubmitDIRECT online submission entry and review technology, there is a small submission fee per track ($1.99 for members, $5.99 for non-members) which helps pay for the submission technology and pays for our job researchers who spend each day out looking for new opportunities for our members.

* Some job posters don't use SubmitDIRECT - it's their choice. For those jobs, there is no submisison fee, and submitters send CDs via mail or however else the job poster wants to receive submissions.

I welcome any questions or feedback about any of our services - you can learn more about our different film & TV music related services at Welcome to Film Music World or go directly to the Film Music Network site at Film Music Network -

Best,

Mark Northam
mark@gmocorp.com

[Etch-A-Sketch]

Originally Posted by mnortham

* For job posters that use our online SubmitDIRECT online submission entry and review technology, there is a small submission fee per track ($1.99 for members, $5.99 for non-members) which helps pay for the submission technology and pays for our job researchers who spend each day out looking for new opportunities for our members.

How much of that $1.99~$5.99 goes to the job poster?

[mnortham]

Hi Derek -

Unlike many other job services, none of the submission fees go to the job poster - the job submission fees are used to pay for our job researchers who work to find the job leads and convince them to allow our members to submit, and pay for the technology used for the SubmitDIRECT platform.

Hope this helps better understand our service -

Best,

Mark Northam
Film Music Network

[Etch-A-Sketch]

Originally Posted by mnortham

Hi Derek -

Unlike many other job services, none of the submission fees go to the job poster - the job submission fees are used to pay for our job researchers who work to find the job leads and convince them to allow our members to submit, and pay for the technology used for the SubmitDIRECT platform.

Hope this helps better understand our service -

Best,

Mark Northam
Film Music Network

OK... so then how much of the fee of each submission goes to the "job researcher" who posts the job?

[mnortham]

Hi Derek -

Thanks for the question. As it involves personnel/payroll data, I hope you can understand why it would be inappropriate to publish compensation numbers for our staff. I can tell you that we have several job researchers who work for us locating specific opportunities for our members to submit with production companies, music libraries, jingle houses, ad agencies, and other users of music. They have a singular mission and goal: to build relationships in the industry and locate quality opportunities for our members to submit music for. We have members at all levels of the business, from those in the very early years of their careers, through folks who have been in the business for decades - for that reason not all job listings are appropriate for all members for reasons of experience, musical genres, etc.

Also, our job researchers doesn't actually post jobs - they identify opportunities and gather as much info as they can, working with the hiring company or person. Then we look at the job and make a judgment as to whether it's appropriate for our service, then we publish it if we believe it's a good fit. A "good fit" for us means we've been in touch with the posting company directly to confirm details, we believe that the job is not exploitative, and we are comfortable with the job poster and the job description being published.

Hope this helps -

Best,

Mark Northam

[Etch-A-Sketch]

Originally Posted by mnortham

Hi Derek -

Thanks for the question. As it involves personnel/payroll data, I hope you can understand why it would be inappropriate to publish compensation numbers for our staff.

That's what I thought you'd say. ;-)

But, that is also enough information to realize that your staff gets compensated for every submission, not for every placement.

If the submission fee is $1.99 for members... and your "researchers" get 50% for finding the lead... then they make a dollar for every person that submits regardless of whether the submission is even listened to or not by the posting production company...

I'd be interested in hearing about your policies to safeguard against the very obvious fraud that could occur. Where, one of your researchers finds a production in progress, knows the music supervisor and gets him/her to post the position on your site for a split of the compensation (under the table of course), even though the music supervisor has already picked all the music for the production before even posting on your site.

If you get on average around 1000 submissions (just a nice round number, no idea how many submissions you actually get), you make $2000 from the submissions (on top of the subscription fee). Why don't you change to charging $2000 per submission (or however much you make on average per posting), but only charge the person IF their submission is actually picked/licensed for the production?

[londontown]

So...if a major number of the clients are actually music libraries, you have to pay to submit it to somebody who will then submit it along with the rest of the library for potential but completely unguaranteed usage? Effectively, you're asking people to pay for the opportunity to give up the publishing rights they otherwise own? Seems like a win win for the publishing libraries and a small win for you, and a big lose for the composer?

Music library work sucks enough (90% of library tracks barely making a dime in the long run) without having to pay to get your music into one...most libraries, even the big ones, are more than happy to take stuff if it's any good...but that's just my experience. Libraries only make the money when the stuff is licensed....it's a lottery otherwise?

Originally Posted by mnortham

Hi Derek -

Thanks for the question. As it involves personnel/payroll data, I hope you can understand why it would be inappropriate to publish compensation numbers for our staff. I can tell you that we have several job researchers who work for us locating specific opportunities for our members to submit with production companies, music libraries, jingle houses, ad agencies, and other users of music. They have a singular mission and goal: to build relationships in the industry and locate quality opportunities for our members to submit music for. We have members at all levels of the business, from those in the very early years of their careers, through folks who have been in the business for decades - for that reason not all job listings are appropriate for all members for reasons of experience, musical genres, etc.

Also, our job researchers doesn't actually post jobs - they identify opportunities and gather as much info as they can, working with the hiring company or person. Then we look at the job and make a judgment as to whether it's appropriate for our service, then we publish it if we believe it's a good fit. A "good fit" for us means we've been in touch with the posting company directly to confirm details, we believe that the job is not exploitative, and we are comfortable with the job poster and the job description being published.

Hope this helps -

Best,

Mark Northam

[mnortham]

Hi Londontown -

Thanks for the reply. Some notes on music library postings from my point of view (opinion included!):

* We do not post listings for libraries who expect copyright to be "given" to them with no up-front payment/compensation to the composer. This standard, far more prevalent in the UK than in the USA, is exploitative, in my opinion. If a library wants copyright, let them pay for it!

* In the USA, a rapidly growing number of libraries use retitling, and allow the composer to keep his/her copyright. Other business models involving libraries licensing music from composers and then placing that music are in many cases replacing the traditional "we must own the copyright, give it to us!" deal that can seriously disadvantage composers. As soon as you give up copyright, you are virtually powerless to compel the library or end users of music to do much of anything.

* In USA television, the use of library music is expanding rapidly as more and more shows, especially sit-coms, etc are done exclusively with library music. It's a combination of a lot of great sounding music being available now from libraries plus the fact that editors are very comfortable editing music audio. It's not the greatest news for custom score composers, but the fast growth of libraries presents other types of opportunities for instrumental music.

* Writing for libraries allows composers to live anywhere - a huge advantage to composers who live outside LA and the other music centers.

[mnortham]

Hi Derek -

Re: submissions/compensation - Actually none of our staff are compensated based on the number of submissions. Our job researchers get a combination of hourly wage plus a modest fee for each job they locate and we approve and post. Also, I look at every job that goes out before it is posted and sign off on the listings - I've got to be comfortable that the job is a good fit for our members and doesn't raise any "red flags".

As far as the number of submissions, we've never received anywhere close to 1000 submissions for a job - it's usually under 100 for jobs with more of a niche audience (rare genres, etc) or a max of a few hundred for the most popular jobs.

In the end, the service is not for everybody, and it's certainly not intended to be a composer's primary source of leads/jobs. In a nutshell, it's a music delivery system with a built-in review platform that helps music seekers get quick submissions for jobs and control the flow of submissions in an orderly way to help them, hopefully, find the best music for their job with a minimum of hassle.

In closing, here's an email I received just today from a member - we get these from time to time, and it really sums up why we do this - it's all about creating opportunities that can lead to other opportunities, etc. A lowly library placement can end up leading to bigger and better things, as this member reports:

"Hi Mark,

I thought you might like to hear that one of your listings in 2008 resulted in my being signed to create music for 6 CDs for the company. From that I got placements this year on 3 major national commercial campaigns, the latest being the Mastercard Priceless Christmas campaign with Peyton Manning. Needless to say, I am very happy with your service!

Thank you for providing these kinds of opportunities for the composing community."

To me, that about says it all. We didn't get him these jobs, he and his music did. We made him aware of an opportunity through our service, and he used the fact that he was selected by the first job poster (a library) to leverage that into bigger and better opportunities.

[JohnnyFree]

I have seen these kinds of things....in this day and age with the internet....why go through someone who charges for submissions?

1) Pump Audio - They screen submissions and DO NOT CHARGE you unless a placement ensues, which they have a spelled out contract as to what percentages you get and they get and what rights are retained or given away. I've submitted music through them.

2) Many publications nowadays give you a complete list of music supervisors and publishing companies that you can send music to directly for the price/time of postage or digitally - why pay insane submission fees for the same chances?

3) Contact CD production music libraries directly, find out someone who works there are try to submit to them. I have friends that have sold a few tracks this way....

Just my two cents - but when music pays SO LITTLE why should anyone have to PAY MORE just for the chance to maybe get an actual paying placement.

just my two!