Hey Mixers!! So how do YOU like your effects editorial delivered to the stage?

[JSt0rm]

you know how it is. everybody is different. Some guys (and gals) like some thing others like other things but i bet you all like 2 pops and tail pops What other things do you like?

Notes in the comments windows?
Regions renamed?
Track names following the type of effect?
5.1 panning already on the effects?

tell me please. Maybe one day I will be delivering to you

[philper]

Originally Posted by JSt0rm

you know how it is. everybody is different. Some guys (and gals) like some thing others like other things but i bet you all like 2 pops and tail pops What other things do you like?

Notes in the comments windows?
Regions renamed?
Track names following the type of effect?
5.1 panning already on the effects?

tell me please. Maybe one day I will be delivering to you

The best recent comment I heard on this was from Gary G, who requested that fx tracks for a big project be gathered into "food groups" so one gets to know which part of the edit window has what sort of fx tracks. This would be really important if there were enough tracks up that one couldn't see all of them at once (or only zoomed way out), and would make subgrouping much more straightforward. I don't like the idea of built-in 5.1 pans very much--I think it works better to do all that in the mix.

Philip Perkins

[georgia]

as clean as possible. Any reverbs/effects added by the editors/sound designers please give me the track printed and a track dry. Place all sfx type in sub groups for BIG mixes... Also difference groups of tracks well labeled for AMBIENCE, SFX, DIAG, MUSIC, ADR...etc.. even more broken down to tracks with DIEGETIC vs NON DIEGETIC MUSIC, groupings of "like" SFX... All materials with No panning other than stereo for starters... Except music, if mixed on the stage or before in 5.1 or custom 5.1 Ambiences etc. ... ALL materials labeled and documented.. including Region and file names MAKING SENSE! Reels split in APPROPRIATE locations. Volume automation minimal and moderate... DIAG split by actor... with original production tracks available even if its ADRed....



cheers
geo

[soundboy]

In heavy action films, I've even seen the SFX subdevided into catagories like,
guns shots
explosions
etc......

oh, no panning, no eq/reverb, unless you are building a particular effect and need those tools. But don't eq, compress, reverb with the idea of mixing it into the scene. That's the mixers job.

[JSt0rm]

Thanks everyone. how do you feel about some effects spilling over onto other tracks at time? Sometimes I find that only for 30 seconds do I need those extra 4 tracks in a reel and it's easier to just spill over into tracks that aren't being used at that time.

When running only 2 rigs (dx,mx--->sfx,fol,rec) how wide do you expect the sfx tracks to be? I, for instance, try to keep my backgrounds A/B on only 24 tracks so that the mixer can have access to the entire bg session all on one set of faders. I also try to think about breaking down the rest of the effects in sets of 24. Am I limiting myself? Or do you find this practice helpful? Do you find it easier to have a little spill over on tracks and have things kept on sets of 24 or larger sessions?

I know I shouldn't do panning but I'm thinking it can be apart of my design on some occasions. It's not something I would do all of the time but if i am working as a sound designer on a film why shouldn't I take advantage of the entire sound field?

[ErikG]

THE most important thing is that the editing team and the re-recording mixer agrees on how things are done.
Nothing else matters imho.
There are no rules as long as you dont screw things up.

BUT saying this below are some presonal reflections:
Without a good monitoring system and a lot of time on the dub stage, you don't really have the tools (in the editing room) to do much pre mixing at all without actually screwing things up...

Corrective EQ done in a room with bad room modes or monitoring will be horrendous and will only make the mixers job harder. If done well will it will save you a lot of time in the dub and that time could be used to work creatively rather than fixing problems.

Reverbs are pretty tricky to get right beeing applied in a small room and then bringing it to the stage. But personally I dont mind as long as it is separated and can easily be removed and replaced when it's not working.
After spending some time with the mixers on the dub stage you'll get a sense of what and how reverb is applied on the stage and might be able to replicate yhat in the editing room.

5.1 panning of ambiences is something that I think definetly belongs in the editing rooms. Building ambience is not viable if you dont know how things envelop you as a viewer/listener.

5.1 ambiences mostly pretty much suck. Mostly just adds noise imho.

Moving 5.1 panning of FX can work at times if you have the experience but often needs to be redone on the dub stage.
Static positioning often work but not always.

Dont over complicate the layout of the Delivery sessions (what is the common word in "Hollywoodeese" again?). Make them obvious but not overseparated. Be realistic about what kind of separation control is needed in the mix. Talk to the mixer so that you agree on how it should be delivered.

Different mixers work differently... Personally I often prefer more separation than my colleague does (without creating huge sessions where you loose the ability to have a decent overview. In the mix it's just faster to be confident that if I just bring this fader down on the water group I WILL lower the rain and not the main ambience in the scene. Some mixers prefer to work with broader strokes and leave the detailing to the stage editor(s).

Some mixers always want the layout to be the same as it makes them work faster and more intuitively.

Different stages are different too.
Some mixers do a lot of DAW handling themselves, others want/need the stage editors to do it for them. The way it will work on any particular mix session will also be affected by how things are setup at that particular stage.


So finally back on the original question...

How to deliver.
Separate intelligently.
Dialogue by camera angle or character and boom/lav (ask the mixer, give them what they want). Keep ADR and fill on dedicated tracks!
Separate all Production Effects but make sure that the dialogue still works fine when (not if) the mixer decides not to use them.

FX and ambience by general type, Since the division by type is hard to say since it differs from film to film I'd try to keep it to the obvious and then sub devide again when needed. Action (Guns,Swords,Hits,Falls); Transport (Cars,horses and carriages); Special FX (Explosions,Flashes,Trainwreck); Sound Design ( "weird stuff" or flashback/transitions; General (phones,doors, beeps etc). Just the basics here as it is impossible to know what a specific film might need. if there's a lot of cars and car doors you might need to have separation between differnt kind of cars and doors. With only a few cars and car doors in the entire film theres really no need to separate them much at all.

FX and ambience, use mono when a sound is intended to be moved around the soundstage (you can do this with stereo as well but it takes more time and dont really make that much of a difference in most cases). Most action sounds benefit from beeing mono as well (or stereo with a spread if close up). Use multichannel design when things need to stand out. Not having everything in stereo/lcr all the time brings the sounds themselves to the screen center where most of the action is taking place and also makes sounds that are wider in image to stand out easier.

OTOH Dont be afraid to pan things out when it suits the picture or stylistic intentions of the film.

'nugh form me :-)