Help setting up a small post production facility

[slidefader]

I need to setup a small post prodution facility for mixing down 24 tracks out of a Mackie MDR 24/96 and was wondering if you could give me pros and cons of what I had in mind for gear. Most if not all sessions so far are recorded live out of a modified A&H 3300 (Pre-fader/Pre-EQ) utilizing the channel direct outs. While I am pleased with the results, its a PITA to shlep around from 1 studio to another working around other peoples studio schedules and would like to setup something in my home to make the job easier.

Console:Mackie 32 ch analog 8-bus w/meterbidge. I can get a b-stock for around $2600US. Full Warrenty. I know they don't have the best mic pre's but the outputs from the MDR are balanced TRS 1/4". If I neede to overdub, I could alway get a decent outboard micpre or 2. Any recommendations on decent low cost pre's?

Studio Monitors:Mackie HR824's. I hear they are very good but a bit pricey. Any comparable lower priced powered monitors recommended?

Comps and gates: DBX 1046 & 1074. Presonus ACP-88 ok for studio use? Maybe a tube based comp or 2 for the money channels?

Reverbs, Delays & Multi FX: Lexicon MPX-1 MPX-500, Yamaha Rev-500, TC Electronic M1/D2 and maybe the cheapo TC M300? Should I just scour the used gear ads for a PCM 70 or 80?

CDR: Denon DN-C550R(specs look good and dual well for copies)

Mastering: TC Finalizer or the dbx quantum 2. Would Stienburg wavelab be just as good because I haven't used standalone mastering stuff yet. I do like wavelab and have had good results so far.

Any and all recommendations would be appreciated. I would also like recommendations on whether or not used gear would be the best best way to go or should I just buy all new stuff in case I need to get rid of it all for resale value.

TYIA,
Best wishes,
Slidefader

[Henchman]

Are you talking Audio-post for TV and film?

Because if you are, then you won't really need a Finalizer.

So, what is your main focus of biz?

Here's some idea'S:

You might want to think about a used panasonic DA-7 to get going. This would solve your micpre issues in the short term. There's one on ebay right now for $1800,-.

You could start by getting some Oktava mics for recording voices. I use them alot, and they sound fine.

Get at least 1 used DA-88 with timecode . These have pretty much become a standard over here for Post laybacks. This will run you about $500-$600.
A pair of decent monitors. I used the Tannoy Reveals for awhile, untill we got our M+K's. About $400,-

Also the TC stuff is great for verbs etc.


Since you're on a budget, get an inexpensive PC to burn CD's etc.

So, think about thIS kind of set-up to start, and you can always buy more stuff once you get going.
Because there's always more.

Mark

[slidefader]

Maybe I should backup a bit. Perhaps Post production wouldn't be the correct term for what I am doing. More like mixing down 24 tracks of live recorded material. Same differance?

Some of this was cut/pasted from another forum on another website that only one person replied to. And I believe that because none of my text included Neve, API or Trident, noone thought it was worth thier time to respond.

Here is the gist of what I want to do:

The band I work for has aquired a Mackie MDR 24/96 to record live shows. I modified the direct outs of each channel of a 32 channel Allen & Heath 3300 for pre fader/pre EQ and I am getting good audio onto the Mackie's hard drive. I run 24 channels from the stage and no FX are printed to the MDR. Our problem is mixing down. Taking the A&H and FOH rack out of the truck everytime we want to mix down is a PITA, and makes sound check the next gig that much longer. We want to set up a separate mixdown facility and are looking around for a decent 32 ch analog mixdown board. We would need 24 line inputs for the Mackie MDR and 8 channels for FX returns. Obviuosly we would not need great mic pre amps unless we want to overdub but we could always get a good outboard preamp for that. I was thinking a 24 mono channel digital with TRS line level ins with built in dynamics and FX would fit the bill nicely but cant seem find one with more than 16 mono and 4 stereo(think Yamaha O2R).

As far as analog goes, would a 32 channel mackie 8 bus be ok or a used Soundcraft Ghost? Then,we could just buy whatever outboard that we would need. I can get a b-stock mackie 32 channel 8-bus for around $2600US w/meterbidge and full warrenty.

The recordings would only be used for the band to hear their performances and to work on any mistakes. Meaning I could give the keyboard player a mixminus keyboards so she could work on her parts.

Thank You,
Slidefader

[Henchman]

I would still think about a Ramsa DA-7, and buy some external mic pres's

[mdvirtual]

Actually a used 02R might fit the bill perfectly, if you could find one that had ADAT or TDIF cards installed. That way you could get the corresponding cards for the Mackie and take advantage of the 02R's full 40 inputs (16 analog line ins, 16 digital ins via ADAT or TDIF cards, and 4 stereo ins) The cards are in blocks of 8 channels, so you'd only need one to supplement the analog ins and cover 24 tracks.

You'd have onboard effects with total recall, and the ability to save different versions of your mix minus whatever instruments you needed to remove. The sound quality wouldn't be world-class, but probably fine in your application. If you found the internal effects lacking you could always supplement with outboard processors.

[slidefader]

If I was to go the all digital route, wouldn't the Mackie D8B w/all the plugins and the HDR digital output cards be a better option?

Slidefader

[Henchman]

Yes, I think so. we use the D8B with our failrights. The D8B is a bit more expensive though. Which is why I recommended the DA-7. Also the onboard reverbs of the D8B are ok, but external boxes are still better.

Mark

[foldback]

Originally Posted by slidefader

Maybe I should backup a bit. Perhaps Post production wouldn't be the correct term for what I am doing. More like mixing down 24 tracks of live recorded material. Same differance?

We want to set up a separate mixdown facility and are looking around for a decent 32 ch analog mixdown board.

As far as analog goes, would a 32 channel mackie 8 bus be ok or a used Soundcraft Ghost? Then,we could just buy whatever outboard that we would need. I can get a b-stock mackie 32 channel 8-bus for around $2600US w/meterbidge and full warrenty.

The recordings would only be used for the band to hear their performances and to work on any mistakes.

I owned several of the Mackie analog 8-bus mixers and they are crap. They sound OK but the reliability is terrible and repair service or support from Mackie is ZERO. The St Louis Mackie repair center (which shall remain nameless) made one of my failing Mackie 8-bus consoles worse than when I delivered it to them.

Mackie 8-buss mixers are a pain to be shipping out of town for service, I was never sure someone could actually fix them so finally we ditched them and replaced them with 4-bus Yamaha MG3214fx which have been trouble free. I think one of these mixers would work for you based on your description. It has 24 full input channels, 4 stereo input channels and two SPX signal processors built in. There's also some other aux returns so there's lots of places for returning efx. The built in SPX efx sound good and they're always there and ready to use with no patching.

The Yamaha mic pres are ok, the mixers are low noise and relatively light weight. I got them for under $1000 each brand new. I had road cases made for them and they've been trouble free in a year and a half of schlepping them around with bands. I pair the Yamaha up with Alesis HD24XR recorders all the time for mixing live recordings of bands.

I would much rather have a decent analog mixer than any of the first generation digital mixers like the D8b or Ramsa. I have a wiring harness and patchbays that I made so that my 24-track can use the mic preamps of the MG32 for a complete portable 24 track recording setup. I have bands that are mixing their CDs with the tracks we've cut using this so it works for some folks besides me. Personally I like my Grace and API preamps better but that's a lot more money.

Best of luck to you with your recording endeavor.

[Axiomhead]

Originally Posted by Henchman

Are you talking Audio-post for TV and film?

Because if you are, then you won't really need a Finalizer.

I know its OT at this point, but 90% of the post houses I've been to have (and use) Finalizers... but I'm from DC, and we're sorta nutty up here

[Henchman]

Originally Posted by Axiomhead

I know its OT at this point, but 90% of the post houses I've been to have (and use) Finalizers... but I'm from DC, and we're sorta nutty up here

We don't use finalizers on anyhtbign.
I guess I could see post hosues that do cimmercials usinf them. But they're simply not necessary, with all the plug-ins available today.

[Doser]

If I were you I would definatly go "In the Box" rather than spending cash on a digital mixer. I understand using the Mackie 24 track recorder but buying a digital console would not be cost efficient in my opinion. I would find a way to transfer the contents of the Mackie so that you can import them into a Protools system and mix inside of
Protools and spend the cash on great plug ins. A Digi002 would suffice.
I myself have been doing live band tracking and mixing for 7 years now for television and what I find best is to have a great source material to work with. That means a quality band. Secondly mic choice and placement on stage and how to get a great split so you can control your levels to your mackie without getting noise from passing through various transformers. If you can come across a quality microphone splitter and some decent Preamps you will notice your warmth and quality of your material greatly increased. 3rd Find a way to dump it into Protools or whatever digital program you like to mix on. I am unfamliar with using the Mackie MDR 24/96 but I assume you can take the contents and dump it to a computer hard drive.
You will be amazed how powerful an LE system can be with music mix downs. When you have the mix just bounce it to disk!
My equipment flow where i work at is the following
Microphones---->splitter----->gml console------>recorded on protools----->Mix in the box using the conlsole only for speaker monitoring----->bounce to disk----->give files to producer and WALLAH!