Pro Tools 8 - my personal speculation

[JamieMB]

Gonna be sweet!

[TheReal7]

If this were true, they would have one hell of a challenge ahead of them. PT8 would have to be able to open up older version sessions with out major issues. That in itself will be a crutch when re-writing the DAW's code. It wouldn't be an issue for first time PT users. Unless they can write a conversion program into PT or standalone that can convert the old sessions.

[Harley-OIART]

AIR is merely a small company that was bought by Digidesign / Avid. No real different then M-Audio.

Do your homework before you label the hardworking guys @ A.I.R. with a sarcastic quote.

None the less, purely speculating you are probably correct that PT8 will be re-written fairly deeply, especially since multi-processor support is still less than stellar.

*God I hope this thread doesn't turn into another ADC vs. MDC thread*

[JamieMB]

Yes I know AIR was wizoo before it but you said yourself "the hard working guys at air" so you proved my point. What good is their hard work if the DAW they are designed for doesn't have the powerful midi capabilities to express their full potential? :D

[Harley-OIART]

Originally Posted by JamieMB

Yes I know AIR was wizoo before it but you said yourself "the hard working guys at air" so you proved my point. What good is their hard work if the DAW they are designed for doesn't have the powerful midi capabilities to express their full potential? :D

Frankly i don't see what the big deal is with protools and midi. I have used logic extensively, and I can see why it is clearly vastly superior in the midi department, but that does not change the fact I have never once ran into a situation in protools where I can't do what I need to do MIDI wise. It really isn't that bad IMNSHO.

To each they're own I guess.

Oh well... to keep the thread going - What powerful midi capabilities are required in your opinion in order to exress their [A.I.R.] full potential?

[JamieMB]

Personally I'd like to see things like a drum editor or midi/notation hybrid like samplitude. I don't use midi that much either but I've found in pro tools the "edit in place" directly on the track could be supplemented.

[AlexLakis]

Yeah, it's gonna be kinda tough to re-write the code from the bottom up. They have to keep in mind compatibility with older session files, and also, compatibility with approved Digi DAW builds and such. It would kind of suck to buy a Creation Station from Sweetwater or something only to find that the hardware isn't approved for the new version of Pro Tools they release a month later.

Of course, all things must change eventually...

[Jazzpunk]

My PT system is rock solid.

Digi's been slow to come around on the midi implementation because that has not been the primary concern of their high end users. As the market is shifting, Digi is starting to react. I see the features in the recent upgrade as well as the acquisition of A.I.R as positive signs of what is in store.

[Geert van den Berg]

Originally Posted by JamieMB

I believe that PT has alot of legacy code around which prevents the engineers from easily adding simple features which all the other daws have had for years

My suspicion is that in order for PT to take advantage of future technologies such as dual core, PT 8 is currently being secretely re-written.

PT 8 has be a completely new, re-written daw. They will do it in secret and in parallel with the new instruments so once it's finished, they will have a powerful daw and a whole line of instruments already to go.

Originally Posted by AlexLakis

Yeah, it's gonna be kinda tough to re-write the code from the bottom up.

My understanding is that the code has been rewritten a couple of times already, going from PT 5 to 6, I believe, and also going from 6 to 7....

The reason you don't see PT being bloated with extra features is because they're being well thought out before anything is being added.

The major overhauls you see with some other DAW's is also a very unprofessional attitude towards people that make a living using the software, added features have to be usefull and well implemented. Some people start to rely on them and you can't just take them out easily. That's why some things still require extra knowledge of the program, but still it's one of the easiest DAW's to learn.

And some things won't be implemented anytime soon, like a faster than realtime bounce to disk, because the TDM hardware doesn't allow for it, though I am sure they could find an alternative way for it to work. And since LE is always behind TDM LE doesn't get this feature.

[hociman]

Originally Posted by JamieMB

My suspicion is that in order for PT to take advantage of future technologies such as dual core, PT 8 wis currently being secretely re-written. Not to mention the fact that its somewhat pointless to have an "advanced instrument researh group" when it's a fact of life that other daws like cubase rule in this area. In order to take some market share in serious midi work, PT 8 has be a completely new, re-written daw. They will do it in secret and in parallel with the new instruments so once it's finished, they will have a powerful daw and a whole line of instruments already to go.

It wouldn't be any more secret than anything else they've done, and of course they would give themselves an upper hand like that. Do you think that MOTU designed the Mach 5 independent of DP? The coolest Mach 5/DP feature is drag-and-drop, which doesn't exist with Mach 5/PT.

Here's to hoping that Structure allows for drag-and-drop. Sections of code will probably be rewritten with every cycle. A major rewrite? Well, that depends on what they (don't) do.

[Jazzpunk]

Originally Posted by hociman

Here's to hoping that Structure allows for drag-and-drop.

From Digidesign site;

'You can also create your own samples by dragging and dropping Pro Tools regions directly into Structure'

Cool feature for sound design purposes

[JamieMB]

that alone is enough for me to give PT another shot for sound design.

[hociman]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

From Digidesign site;

'You can also create your own samples by dragging and dropping Pro Tools regions directly into Structure'

Cool feature for sound design purposes

Yes, it is. Our engineers are going to need this to work with any audio file (AIFF, BWAV, etc.) from any location. Say, drag the byte from the desktop onto Structure. If that can't be done, the very first thing I'm going to have to listen to is a 5 minute rant about how "Well, if you use DP with Mach 5, you can do that. Why can't Structure do that? Is it not Structured properly?" and so on and so forth.

[Jazzpunk]

Originally Posted by hociman

Yes, it is. Our engineers are going to need to this to work with any audio file (AIFF, BWAV, etc.) from any location. Say, drag the byte from the desktop onto Structure. If that can't be done, the very first thing I'm going to have to listen to is a 5 minute rant about how "Well, if you use DP with Mach 5, you can do that. Why can't Structure do that? Is it not Structured properly?" and so on and so forth.

Engineers in NYC get 5 minutes to rant? Must be nice. We only get 30 seconds out here in L.A.

[charles maynes]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

Engineers in NYC get 5 minutes to rant? Must be nice. We only get 30 seconds out here in L.A.

All I can say about this is the more time you spend bitching about your hammer, the longer it takes to build the house-

If PT ain't doing it for you, use the tool that will.

I have no problem with asking for new features, but anyone who is DOING work is doing it with whatever tools are available.

personally, the best sound design I have ever heard was the result of a well placed microphone- so I spend a lot time trying to find where to put the mic... (I know, but I have pulled it out of that place on a great number of occasions...)

charles maynes

[hociman]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

Engineers in NYC get 5 minutes to rant? Must be nice. We only get 30 seconds out here in L.A.

Cute.

[Krumbz]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

My PT system is rock solid.

Digi's been slow to come around on the midi implementation because that has not been the primary concern of their high end users. As the market is shifting, Digi is starting to react. I see the features in the recent upgrade as well as the acquisition of A.I.R as positive signs of what is in store.

Winner.

[jamesblond]

With the possibility to run 128 tracks in LE with the new Music production toolkit, extra busses would be a welcome addition. I run out of busses in no time with LE 7.x. Does anyone have any info on that? Will there be extra busses and, if so: how many?

Cheers,

Jamesblond.

[Airon]

Originally Posted by jamesblond

With the possibility to run 128 tracks in LE with the new Music production toolkit, extra busses would be a welcome addition. I run out of busses in no time with LE 7.x. Does anyone have any info on that? Will there be extra busses and, if so: how many?

Cheers,

Jamesblond.

No info on the busses so far.

And it's 128 MONO tracks, or 64 stereo tracks, so it's 128 VOICES in all, which I find a bit ridiculous.

[jamesblond]

That's pretty strange, since Protools LE 7.x runs 48 STEREO tracks @ 96k with no problems... Only a marginal profit, so it would seem. However, 128 mono tracks is enough for most of my needs :)

[soundguydave]

Just give me folders in the Bin and I am happy

[MixinMonkey]

Originally Posted by soundguydave

Just give me folders in the Bin and I am happy

+1!

[meathman]

that bin folder thing is something that I am also desperate for. Unfortunately in talking to a friend who is a software programmer for digi, looks like this IS NOT a new feature in PT8

Too bad cause this is the ONLY improvement I was hoping for

[minister]

Originally Posted by meathman

that bin folder thing is something that I am also desperate for. Unfortunately in talking to a friend who is a software programmer for digi, looks like this IS NOT a new feature in PT8

Too bad cause this is the ONLY improvement I was hoping for

Don't hold your breath.

It is not an easy thing to impliment. they HAVE looked into it. Several times.

BUT, they still SHOULD and we should keep HAMMERING on them to do it!

Maybe if people stop complaining about the MIDI and use a good MIDI program INSTEAD then they would turn their attentions towards post needs. But, ho, ho, ho.... Post is a wee l'il sub-set of the user-base.....despite the fact that many musicians and failing music studios turn to post because they think it will be easy and lucrative. VO? how hard is that? ADR? how hard is that? 2 turn tables and a microphone. You don't need experience to do that, just gear, right? Mixing a film? Puh! i can do it on my laptop in my kitchen!! Hey anyone know where i can get work? that seems cool.

and so it goes...........

ah, to have everything......where would i put it?

[scanner]

According to admin at the DUC:

DigiTechSupt
Administrator






Re: How many Busses in Pro Tools 8 LE?
The number of busses will remain the same except in the Complete Toolkit, which will give you 128 busses.




Hmmmm..........

[cubivore]

it's good to know my 1000 dollars thrown toward DVTK2 was simply for timecode. can't wait to see how i'll get raped for 7.1 and bus upgrade. if you're using LE on something like a 003/2 will you need an external encoder or something for the surround mix or will there be some box you check before rendering? either way, i'll be more broke than i was today.

[ggegan]

Originally Posted by minister

Don't hold your breath.

It is not an easy thing to impliment. they HAVE looked into it. Several times.

BUT, they still SHOULD and we should keep HAMMERING on them to do it!

Maybe if people stop complaining about the MIDI and use a good MIDI program INSTEAD then they would turn their attentions towards post needs. But, ho, ho, ho.... Post is a wee l'il sub-set of the user-base.....despite the fact that many musicians and failing music studios turn to post because they think it will be easy and lucrative. VO? how hard is that? ADR? how hard is that? 2 turn tables and a microphone. You don't need experience to do that, just gear, right? Mixing a film? Puh! i can do it on my laptop in my kitchen!! Hey anyone know where i can get work? that seems cool.

and so it goes...........

ah, to have everything......where would i put it?

I get the impression that most music PT users purchase smaller packages than post users. I would be interested to know how many music people buy multiple expanded HD systems with several 192 IOs and sync capability, not to mention two man ICON consoles. I would think that post users may be fewer in number, but on average spend considerably more on their systems. That's not a slap at music people, just pointing out that post has got to be a gold mine for Digidesign because it is a bottomless money pit.

[soundguydave]

Originally Posted by ggegan

I get the impression that most music PT users purchase smaller packages than post users. I would be interested to know how many music people buy multiple expanded HD systems with several 192 IOs and sync capability, not to mention two man ICON consoles. I would think that post users may be fewer in number, but on average spend considerably more on their systems. That's not a slap at music people, just pointing out that post has got to be a gold mine for Digidesign because it is a bottomless money pit.

And we generally stay up with the tech and upgrade our systems?

And with the Bin thing, it can't be that hard! If every other piece of software can do it, why can't protools? Some sessions can have thousands of files and the bin can get pretty unruly at times. I'll even pay $29.99 for it like the MP3 export option (which most other software does for free too....)