Old 7th February 2007
  #1
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
ISDN Alternatives

Just wondering if ISDN is still the prefered method for long distance VO session work. Are there alternatives that are comparable or better?
Old 8th February 2007
  #2
Gear nut
 
dogandpony's Avatar
 

Old 8th February 2007
  #3
Gear nut
 

the DML-plug as posted above is great, a few collegues use it extensively here in Sweden.
Basically it's a VST-plug that transfers audio bidirectionally directly from your host app to/from an external party over the net.. Ie, both you and you hired VO have it running in PT and voila, you have a telephone like connection with "studio audio quality" (see below), being able to record everything in realtime to PT.
It comes in several flavours, from "Free" to "Studio". The difference lies in the supported bandwith, hence with the "Free" you only get max 128 kbps, with "Studio" up to to 256 kbit/s. The "studio" account also incorporates a "file send" function that allows you to transfer any file directly from within the host.
To me the bandwith isn't really an issue, it's good enough to hear everything you need. Just record everything locally and use DML to coach the VO Talent "live" and then just transfer the full audio files via FTP later.
The instant record/transfer feature is good, but for me not at all necessary. In a music recording context, being able to jam live with someone can probably be invaluable. For me, the most important thing is being able to give direction and coach realtime so that I know that I have the takes I need to get the job done.
Old 8th February 2007
  #4
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
The DML does look interesting. I can't tell from the web site but is there a way to communicate with the VO talent through it? This is absolutely critical. If so the next obstacle would be getting NY studios on board with the technology. The fact that there is a free version of the plugin might help.
Old 8th February 2007
  #5
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Fajita's Avatar
saw a demo of source connect...


AWESOME. Controls PT on either end, locks with video for ADR, talkback, and they have aproduct for streaming your mix to somone without protools for approvals and stuff.

Super cool, super easy. It should be able to replace ISDN, quite easily.


Old 8th February 2007
  #6
Gear Head
 

Source Connect (and Source Live) are incredible plugins. I've been on the beta test program since the beginning and it's better than ISDN. The only downside is that not a lot of European studios use it (yet). It's really worth a try and I'm willing to test with anyone, just send me an e-mail...

cheers

Barnier
Old 8th February 2007
  #7
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamstudios View Post
Source Connect (and Source Live) are incredible plugins. I've been on the beta test program since the beginning and it's better than ISDN. The only downside is that not a lot of European studios use it (yet). It's really worth a try and I'm willing to test with anyone, just send me an e-mail...

cheers

Barnier
Better than ISDN? That's a big statement. I'm going to look into it. My concern would be the delay. Which is why ISDN is king. ISDN is as close to real time you can get.

Interent signals, though they have a wide bandwith hits about 20 connection points before it gets to its destination causing delay time.

When you send an email to the next town over, that email might have traveled across the country before getting there.
Old 8th February 2007
  #8
Gear addict
 
RobMacki's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ofsaints View Post
Better than ISDN? That's a big statement.
Yes it is.

When you check out Source Connect you'll know why.

Quote:
I'm going to look into it. My concern would be the delay. Which is why ISDN is king.

Cost & Quality. Two Versions. Unlimited use. Onetime expense.

The king is dead.
Long live the king!
Old 8th February 2007
  #9
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobMacki View Post
Yes it is.

When you check out Source Connect you'll know why.




Cost & Quality. Two Versions. Unlimited use. Onetime expense.

The king is dead.
Long live the king!
You sound like a salesman.

No one has commented on delay. How much delay? If no delay, how do they get around it?
Old 9th February 2007
  #10
Gear addict
 
RobMacki's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ofsaints View Post
You sound like a salesman.
This is what's called a Red Herring
Old 9th February 2007
  #11
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ofsaints View Post
No one has commented on delay. How much delay? If no delay, how do they get around it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobMacki View Post
This is what's called a Red Herring

No herring here, but your commentary had a fishy sales delivery. Are you sure you're not a monger?

Back to the subject at hand. Care to comment on delay now?
Old 9th February 2007
  #12
Gear addict
 
RobMacki's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ofsaints View Post
No herring here, but your commentary had a fishy sales delivery. Are you sure you're not a monger?

Back to the subject at hand. Care to comment on delay now?
No salesman here.
Your earlier post seemed to indicate you had made a determination on SC before even hearing it and as it compares to ISDN. I've heard it and was pretty amazed by it.
But hey, hold on to ISDN and pay as you go.
Maybe even use both.
Fine with me.

I just see it as the future.
No need to get touchy.
Old 9th February 2007
  #13
Gear maniac
 
smsjr's Avatar
 

Okay guys, shake hands, everything will be okay.

We're going to try out Source Connect at some point in the near future. I'll report back with results. Looks very promising. Like everything else, there will be a transition phase. If it is accepted by the masses as an efficient and reliable means of doing remote VO/ADR, then it will be become a standard. Sometimes these things take time.

Anyone else using it? Any gotchas so far?

Steve
Old 9th February 2007
  #14
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ofsaints View Post
Better than ISDN? That's a big statement. I'm going to look into it. My concern would be the delay. Which is why ISDN is king. ISDN is as close to real time you can get.

Interent signals, though they have a wide bandwith hits about 20 connection points before it gets to its destination causing delay time.

When you send an email to the next town over, that email might have traveled across the country before getting there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobMacki View Post
No salesman here.
Your earlier post seemed to indicate you had made a determination on SC before even hearing it and as it compares to ISDN. I've heard it and was pretty amazed by it.
But hey, hold on to ISDN and pay as you go.
Maybe even use both.
Fine with me.

I just see it as the future.
No need to get touchy.

I think you need to reread my original statement. You're misinterpreting what I said. One of the first things I said was "I'm going to look into it". I haven't made any determination, I just expressed my concerns with delay. If they figured out a way around that, awesome. But previous attempts at internet VO software has had delay issues.

If you just want to say it's great without discussing the details, or commenting on the issues it makes your opinion pretty worthless
Old 9th February 2007
  #15
Gear addict
 
RobMacki's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ofsaints View Post
If you just want to say it's great without discussing the details, or commenting on the issues it makes your opinion pretty worthless

If you don't care for my opinion you're free to move on.
If you want details then email tech support.
If you want to believe every "detail" you read on GS then your in for a roller coaster ride.
My opinion was based upon my experience with it.
If that's worthless just because I didn't support it with a white paper then your world seems to be a bit myopic.
Old 9th February 2007
  #16
I just installed SourceConnect for a client two days ago using their new VST version. We had an issue with getting it to come up in Nuendo so I called Source Elements and a very nice woman with an english accent answered the phone. Her name was Rebecca and I come to find out that she is actually the programmer/designer of Source Connect.

She's extremely nice but rather useless because (and these are her words) "she doesn't know how to use the plug-in except in PT, she just programmed the thing".

I was like, um, what? Basically she knew absolutely nothing about Nuendo's routing scheme nor how to make the thing work, but after about an hour or so I figured it out and then proceeded to explain it to her (she still didn't get it even though I went through things step by step - and btw, their tutorial guide for VST and their demo session are worthless).

So, anyone wishing to try it out in Nuendo/Cubase here's how you do it:

1. Create 2 mono tracks
2. Put the Source-Connect plug-in on the first mono track, login
3. Put the Source-Receive plug-in on one of your input channels (where it would normally be a microphone coming in) - do not enable thru
4. Record/Listen enable the 2nd mono track and set the input of that track to input channel you put Source-Receive on
5. Choose a contact, enable a session with them using the Source-Connect plug-in (located on the 1st mono channel) and you are up and running

The technology is great. There is about 200ms of delay when Nuendo was set to 64 samples on the buffer (24/44.1 session). It works well and is very easy to understand once you get passed the initial hurdles. It's just a bit uncomfortable to me that the programmer of the software has no idea how to use her own stuff, especially at this price point.

Also, for those of you who will become owners and users of Source Connect, there is apparently a company called EDNet who will play middleman between customers who are ISDN only and you (running Source Connect). I don't know what they charge but basically they setup the ISDN session with your client and then Source Connect that session to you. Could be a good option until everyone ditches ISDN.

(p.s. I have no affiliation, nor am I a dealer with either company - I did all of this at a client's site the other day)

Hope that helps a bit!
Old 9th February 2007
  #17
Gear maniac
 

Thanks kittonian.
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