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charles maynes
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#61
10th December 2011
Old 10th December 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rack gear View Post
I heard the piece on NPR with Levine and all that he conceded was that "parts of the bill were perhaps to vague and should be more specific"... I'll concede he was replying to comments about free speech, but he also responded to the notion of possible abuse when his opponent could quote only two known instances of abuse of current copyright law in the context feared from SOPA... as Levine says, that's a pretty damn good law with only TWO abuses in 13 years... so again I think perspective is important in this conversation to maintain some sense of reality.

Although I could be mistaken, everyone get more info and/or listen here:

Internet Piracy: Will SOPA Change the Web as We Know It? - To the Point on KCRW

Listen:
KCRW | 89.9FM - Media Player

Download:
http://download.kcrw.com/audio/81401...-07-154815.mp3
thanks for posting that Rack Gear- it was the program I am referring to-

the main point is that he articulated that it could be refined, without losing its power. Thats all I am interested in-

There have been very few laws that have been perfect- and SOPA is like that- it may have the protections that are needed, but at the same if there is suitable blind spots regarding Civil Liberties it could very well be declared unconstitional, and anulled- and as you, John, Terry and others have said often, Google has in essence all the money in the world to attack the bill- both before and after it might become law- I just cant see giving them the ground to do so.
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#62
10th December 2011
Old 10th December 2011
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There's an excellent link (to a site, where a .pdf resides) on Terry's "Fridays Endnotes".
Just got through reading it, (it's 10-20 pages... depending on your eyesight, and thus 'zoom' level, lol)
i found it to be very open/balanced/honest, and along with debunking alot of the criticism thrown at SOPA and offering suggestions for improvement, was a call for a serious conversation on the subject.

Highly recommended reading. i'd be interested in anyone's take on the paper

Friday’s Endnotes – 12/09/11 | Copyhype
(third link down)

You need to click the PDF link when you get to the Information Technology & Innovation Foundation site for the full text.
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10th December 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AwwDeOhh View Post
There's an excellent link (to a site, where a .pdf resides) on Terry's "Fridays Endnotes".
Just got through reading it, (it's 10-20 pages... depending on your eyesight, and thus 'zoom' level, lol)
i found it to be very open/balanced/honest, and along with debunking alot of the criticism thrown at SOPA and offering suggestions for improvement, was a call for a serious conversation on the subject.

Highly recommended reading. i'd be interested in anyone's take on the paper

Friday’s Endnotes – 12/09/11 | Copyhype
(third link down)

You need to click the PDF link when you get to the Information Technology & Innovation Foundation site for the full text.
totally great read- It certainly covers my reservations about the act.
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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I just posted this on my facebook page-

To my industry friends- if online piracy is important to your work (which it surely is) please write your representitives and ask them to support the SOPA act which is going into committee soon- It is terribly important to derail pirates, and they need to know that it has a very serious impact on our communities. in the 818 area code, Adam Schiff is a sponsor for the bill, and you are welcome to "like" my request that he would host a local townhall meeting to discuss the matter and our collected concerns.

I also posted a similar message on Nancy Pelosi's page....
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11th December 2011
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this just went out to Mike Antonovich- (LA County Board of Supervisors)


Mr Antonovich, I am writing on my behalf, and the thousands of entertainment industry workers in Los Angeles in requesting your consideration of a County resolution supporting the combatting of media piracy, the SOPA act (co-sponsored by Rep Adam Schiff) is entering markup in the House Judiciary Committee, and a strong statement from Los Angeles County government supporting the efforts of the SOPA act would have weight in those hearings, as the center of the world film and TV industry and a primary center of the Music Industry, this act will provide substantial relief to us- please consider this as we are truly being killed by online piracy.....

I also mailed a friend of mine who is a Burbank City Councilman requesting a similar resolution- since Burbank is home to Warner Brothers, Disney, and has Universal Studios as well as Technicolor as major contributors to our local economy, I have high hopes of seeing a resolution happen.
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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Well done Charles and a lesson for everyone to follow.
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11th December 2011
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Originally Posted by GearOnTheGo View Post
Well done Charles and a lesson for everyone to follow.
I release that text for anyone to use in similar petitions to their governments...



please do whatever you can- for the most part, only a few electrons will bothered by the effort.... there are thousands of members here at GS, I do hope we can mobilize at least a few of them in a grass roots effort to bring more attention to this.

We cant be seen in public as "an Industry" we need to be seen as people who are getting robbed.
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11th December 2011
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Originally Posted by charles maynes View Post
I just posted this on my facebook page-

To my industry friends- if online piracy is important to your work (which it surely is) please write your representitives and ask them to support the SOPA act which is going into committee soon- It is terribly important to derail pirates, and they need to know that it has a very serious impact on our communities. in the 818 area code, Adam Schiff is a sponsor for the bill, and you are welcome to "like" my request that he would host a local townhall meeting to discuss the matter and our collected concerns.

I also posted a similar message on Nancy Pelosi's page....
so my facebook page is getting a lot of comments already-

I just posted this in response to people thinking SOPA would break the Internet and bring about martial law (thats my exaggereation)

SOPA is going through Markup presently- the supporters are in the process of honing that language whch is at best vague, but is being tightened up to protect both whistleblowers and free speech. The bottom line is that theft is not free speech, and for these sites to profit from it costs us dearly- both in the price of doing business, and in both having our own work stolen, but then having the likes of Pirate Bay make ad revenue from them- SOPA is about eliminating that. Read the act your self, it is not what you are hearing about in the media- it is very different, and it will protect the content creator in ways our present laws cant.
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11th December 2011
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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I might have kicked the hornets nest with the facebook post-


here is the last post to those anti-SOPA folks.... this was in regards to sites being blocked.....


how much of your work is on pirate bay Jory? the action against infringing sites is such say that, someone types in "Charles Maynes Signature Series pirate bay" google would not return a result. I see that as a win. At present, those sites are making significant ad revenue by people going to them to download music, films, and software- if a complaint is lodged against them to the AG, the AG can then investigate, and order domestic ISP's to block sites which are demonstrably trafficking in infringing materials. Free speech is not being effected here, unless you count theft to be free speech- I looked through the Bill of Rights, and couldnt find it as a protected action.



I have a feeling its going to be a long night.....


please wish me good vibes....
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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I got this comment- it is telling....

from one of the anti-folks....
I'm sure it is. I've worked on lots of AAA games. But guess what, many of those games have grossed over a billion dollars...and I've worked on crap games I would have never wanted to buy, and many people do the "try before you buy" model. I'm sure lots of FCPX users would have liked to have had a pirated copy of the software before they paid for it to realize they shouldn't have wasted their money on it. This isn't something I'm going to get bent out of shape about. People will always find a way to pirate stuff. Like I said, it's part of the gig.


my response-


Dave, so you think having that work stolen, whether it was a successful title or not is not important? Do you have any of your own work up on PirateBay? It is one thing to do a work for hire, vs having a vested interest in royalties from your sales as well.


I think I can change some perception here- it will take a little bit of time though.....
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11th December 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles maynes View Post
..

I think I can change some perception here- it will take a little bit of time though.....
Good Luck!
(you may well need it, lol)
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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more-

Whether my work is on Pirate Bay or not, I would rather it go before a JUDGE than be subject to the whims of the political agent known as Attorney General.

The Attorney General is part of the Executive Branch. We are protected from unreasonable search and seizure by the Bill of Rights. Only the Judicial Branch may execute a warrant, which provides checks and balances.

That is what this country is founded upon.

The day the Executive Branch gets to decide what is acceptable or not is the day we can just tear up the Constitution, because it simply won't matter any more.

Don't worry, though, our government is currently marching lock-step towards that day, regardless of what "We the People" want.

I'm truly sorry that your hard (and incredible) work is being pirated. There is a process for dealing with that But turning the USA into a police state is not part of that process.


my response-

It would- and it could be appealed as well.- the important point to remember is that the government has no power to shut down a foreign site- and these ARE foreign sites as the domestic ones have been pretty much shutdown with the present laws- what this does is allows for a site to be classed as a chronic and intentional infringer, and once that is established, (and might be apealled) the site would be blocked and ad revenue from US advertising on the infringing site would be cancelled.


jesus- it is going to be a long night...
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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can of worms, meet can opener...
charles maynes
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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one broke contact-

last postings-
anti-
There's a world of difference, though. If a City fines you for a building code violation, it must be severe for them to shut you down entirely. And even if it is severe, they don't shut down every single aspect of your existence. Additionally, building code violations fall under public safety, not civil crimes.

If the AG wants to bring suit against someone, that's very different than driving them out of existence on someone's whim. A JUDGE makes that decision, based on information presented, not based on a mere complaint from a copyright holder.

And I strongly believe that eliminating checks and balances -- flagrantly ignoring the BIll of Rights -- will result in PEOPLE being harmed.

Anyway, I don't think we're really covering any new ground here.

I respect your opinion, even if I don't agree with it, and appreciate the chance to discuss SOPA with folks.


my response....

well again Jory- remember these are foreign sites, and the whole rest of the world is accessing them- this is possibly a small dent in their revenue stream, and I really dont think that someone here being able to steal anything is something we should view as a Civil Liberties matter
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11th December 2011
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I would post a link to that .pdf file from Information Technology & Innovation Foundation.
May save you some headache (if anyone actually reads it) in the correcting of some of the off-base criticism. Most people that are against the Bill --i've found are going on hearsay (which alot of orginates from the Big Tech propoganda machine).
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11th December 2011
Old 11th December 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AwwDeOhh View Post
I would post a link to that .pdf file from Information Technology & Innovation Foundation.
May save you some headache (if anyone actually reads it) in the correcting of some of the off-base criticism. Most people that are against the Bill --i've found are going on hearsay (which alot of orginates from the Big Tech propoganda machine).
yeah that qualifies for a what the **** was I thinking- thank you very much for the kind reminder- I am posting it now...
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11th December 2011
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new posting- I was expecting this one actually..... as I am quite fond of Franklin.
anti-
Those who would sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither.


response....

Mark, whose liberty are we discussing? and whose security. Theft is theft, no matter where it might occur. defining piracy as anything short of theft is lying.
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11th December 2011
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I'm always reminded that creative people have had their freedom to work curtailed.
So in an argument between possible loss of freedom, and actual loss of freedom, actual should win?

Talking about 'police states' is an absolute nonsense, and kind of gives you a clue that people need to grasp extremes to make a point, rather than have decent 'anti' points to make.

Also, the rather pathetic excuses get trotted out, like....

Quote:
I'm sure lots of FCPX users would have liked to have had a pirated copy of the software before they paid for it to realize they shouldn't have wasted their money on it.
I'm an enthusiastic video amateur. Not many people actually had to purchase FCPX in it's first weeks. A few pros did, so did a few respected reviewers, and a few in the industry got a sneak peak.
Fact is, almost from day one of it's release, alarm bells were being sounded about something wrong with FCPX on all the video fora and blogs.
If you buy things the first day they are available, you only have yourself to blame. With the web we have, it's pretty easy to see a myriad of opinion on new products. Quite easy to hear new music even.
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11th December 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
I'm always reminded that creative people have had their freedom to work curtailed.
So in an argument between possible loss of freedom, and actual loss of freedom, actual should win?

Talking about 'police states' is an absolute nonsense, and kind of gives you a clue that people need to grasp extremes to make a point, rather than have decent 'anti' points to make.

Also, the rather pathetic excuses get trotted out, like....



I'm an enthusiastic video amateur. Not many people actually had to purchase FCPX in it's first weeks. A few pros did, so did a few respected reviewers, and a few in the industry got a sneak peak.
Fact is, almost from day one of it's release, alarm bells were being sounded about something wrong with FCPX on all the video fora and blogs.
If you buy things the first day they are available, you only have yourself to blame. With the web we have, it's pretty easy to see a myriad of opinion on new products. Quite easy to hear new music even.
this is sort of why I was saying there was a message problem- people have so accepted "the party line" against SOPA, and frankly, against piracy in general- that they have just lost all their bearings on right and wrong-

When we see people stand up and directly say I would rather have theft than what I think I know about the law- that is a huge communications issue- perhaps a better one would be-

hey, if we can stop piracy, chances are, the end user cost for software, music and films will drop- it would make people stand up and notice- most people our age are probably not pirating anywhere near what youngsters are- and yet they are totally willing to believe a piece on the news that any anti-piracy laws are some huge infringement on their freedom....

As I said in the postings- theft is not a civil right. I am prepared to say that a lot in the weeks and months and perhaps years to come....

a quote to close....the credo of the scoundrel...

All, all is theft, all is unceasing and rigorous competition in nature; the desire to make off with the substance of others is the foremost - the most legitimate - passion nature has bred into us and, without doubt, the most agreeable one.
Marquis de Sade

Theft Quotes - BrainyQuote
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11th December 2011
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Not that I disagree with you..... but the problem is deeper.
The music industry and media has promoted the millionaire musician for decades. It's perfectly reasonable for the average punter to think most musicians wont miss a dollar here or there.
Secondly, people love something for nothing. Even if they know in their hearts what they are doing is wrong, they persuade themselves it isn't that bad a deed, because they so desperately want this content but can't afford to buy it all.
This is why in part I blame the tech companies and isp's.
They are advertising a dreamlike future of content at your finger tips, huge amounts, and free or cheap. Quite well educated people I've spoken to assume someone else is paying somewhere along the line, so they can download music and movies free of charge.
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11th December 2011
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Not that I disagree with you..... but the problem is deeper.
The music industry and media has promoted the millionaire musician for decades. It's perfectly reasonable for the average punter to think most musicians wont miss a dollar here or there.
Secondly, people love something for nothing. Even if they know in their hearts what they are doing is wrong, they persuade themselves it isn't that bad a deed, because they so desperately want this content but can't afford to buy it all.
This is why in part I blame the tech companies and isp's.
They are advertising a dreamlike future of content at your finger tips, huge amounts, and free or cheap. Quite well educated people I've spoken to assume someone else is paying somewhere along the line, so they can download music and movies free of charge.
I might quibble over details, but frankly it would be dumb- Yes, I think I agree with your estimation Chris...


I think I might start popping this to the folks I run across who reflect your comments-


If you illegally download, and someone comes into your house and steals it- would you call the police?
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11th December 2011
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Originally Posted by charles maynes View Post
I might have kicked the hornets nest with the facebook post-


here is the last post to those anti-SOPA folks.... this was in regards to sites being blocked.....


how much of your work is on pirate bay Jory? the action against infringing sites is such say that, someone types in "Charles Maynes Signature Series pirate bay" google would not return a result. I see that as a win. At present, those sites are making significant ad revenue by people going to them to download music, films, and software- if a complaint is lodged against them to the AG, the AG can then investigate, and order domestic ISP's to block sites which are demonstrably trafficking in infringing materials. Free speech is not being effected here, unless you count theft to be free speech- I looked through the Bill of Rights, and couldnt find it as a protected action.



I have a feeling its going to be a long night.....


please wish me good vibes....
Good vibes and good luck!
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11th December 2011
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Originally Posted by charles maynes View Post
If you illegally download, and someone comes into your house and steals it- would you call the police?
LoL, good thinker there.

I'm sure you'll get the "but B&E is a totally different thing. It is a violation of my personal property"

Right, and i can assure you [them] that mass piracy leaves that exact same feeling in the creators' gut. And by the way, ever heard the term IP? the key word is the 'P' as it stands for 'Property'.
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11th December 2011
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having received an infraction for being political- I will say this is not intended to be political beyond acting against piracy-

I received word back from a member of the Burbank City council that it seems a resolution in support of combatting piracy is actually moving forward....

I will update as things develop further-


Burbank has WB and Disney/ABC as well as NBC's LA operations headquartered here, along with Universal Studios and Dreamworks being just outside our borders- we also have a number of professional recording studios and a large percentage of industry workers....
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11th December 2011
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Have you read either one yet or are you still waiting for the price to come down on shipping to NZ? ...
I've read Lanier's book. It was in the local library.
"... the record companies have not helped themselves. They have made a public fuss about suing the most sympathetic people, snooped obnoxiously, and so on. Furthermore, there's a long history of sleaze, corruption, creative accounting, and price fixing in the music business." - Jaron Lanier

... but not Levine's. I don't think it's going to change my life so fundamentally that I need to get it from Amazon. I'll wait for it to be available locally. And I have no plans to acquire an e-reader, or the means to read e-books, in the near future. I'm waiting for a flexible one that won't break when dropped.
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12th December 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Hills View Post
"... the record companies have not helped themselves. They have made a public fuss about suing the most sympathetic people, snooped obnoxiously, and so on. Furthermore, there's a long history of sleaze, corruption, creative accounting, and price fixing in the music business." - Jaron Lanier
Well again, he comes from the tech industry. And I think it's a huge mistake (being repeatedly made) to lump the 'record companies' into one basket.
My continuing experience from the early 80's to now, is of business people enthusiastic and passionate about music. For the most part I'm not walking the corridors of Sony, Universal etc, but then neither are the majority of workers in the music industry.
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12th December 2011
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Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Well again, he comes from the tech industry. And I think it's a huge mistake (being repeatedly made) to lump the 'record companies' into one basket.
My continuing experience from the early 80's to now, is of business people enthusiastic and passionate about music. For the most part I'm not walking the corridors of Sony, Universal etc, but then neither are the majority of workers in the music industry.
If the average person- who is not in the industry are allowed to believe that the "person" benefitting from SOPA is a is the stereotypical rock /rap bad boy they will be inclined to side against it even when they know its wrong. That perception is hurting the public impression of the bill seriously. its really a propaganda war- plain and simply- and sadly, the people against SOPA have a lot of very good material to fashion their stereotypes from...
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12th December 2011
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Scandal sells.
There just aren't dozens of books about "my happy successful music career".
The bottom line is also, how you reconcile musicians being the main victims of piracy with the excuse musicians were victims of the record labels?
In the end, there are just too many people who have never worked with a label or had a record deal spouting off about the 'evil' labels.
The frustration I have is experiencing the very broad church of the recording industry, while people who supposedly support creative musicians, falling into the lazy narrative of describing the industry based on what they've heard about a few major labels.
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12th December 2011
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Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Scandal sells.
There just aren't dozens of books about "my happy successful music career".
The bottom line is also, how you reconcile musicians being the main victims of piracy with the excuse musicians were victims of the record labels?
In the end, there are just too many people who have never worked with a label or had a record deal spouting off about the 'evil' labels.
The frustration I have is experiencing the very broad church of the recording industry, while people who supposedly support creative musicians, falling into the lazy narrative of describing the industry based on what they've heard about a few major labels.
I think the artist (and here me out here) has to be minimized- The public face needs to focus on the songwriters and all the other hidden people attached to the process who are profoundly impacted by theft- John really articulated that well when he was talking about how people see rich artists and have no sympathy that they have a percentage of their work pirated-

we in the industry obviously know that is a mis-perception, and that probably about 98% of those affected by the matter arent at that level of economic success- It would do us no good to expect people to have sympathy for the financial suffering of Bono, Springsteen, George Clooney or Bill Gates- because they wont- their first reaction will be outrage- and that this is another scam for the rich to get richer. They like the idea of "stickin' it to the man" especially in a recession....

It could fail on that point alone- before a word of the act is even read.
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