I started building a small studio

[EduardoApolonia]

Originally Posted by judah

can you please tell me (or us) if you're happy with the isolation between the two rooms? I mean, when the drummer's pounding away can you hear it in the control room or is it very very faint? I'd like to know if the floating wood floor

It is very faint, although if I did it today I would do the isolation with blocks filled with sand, here in Portugal it would be cheaper than what I did (2 layers GB + 1 layerParticle board+rockwool) and would be more effective.

Originally Posted by glee

in your case, is the designer helping with any of these corrections?

He is, but not as much as I would like.
Communication has been at a very slow pace for a year now.
Although I know that I'm just a insignificant customer for him, so I was expecting way less help than what I have been getting.

So I got a portuguese studio designer to help me on this too.
BTW, he has designed some great studios like these:

EP Produções
O Ganho do Som

So I'm having help from several places. And it's not been easy.
I'm still not sure what is the real problem in my room.
It's really strange, I'm starting to think that the problem could be some kind of resonance or absorption from the floor, walls or ceiling that is causing this hole.
It is present everytime even if the monitors are on the back of the room or on the side.

[Sonic_X]

Originally Posted by EduardoApolonia

It is very faint, although if I did it today I would do the isolation with blocks filled with sand, here in Portugal it would be cheaper than what I did (2 layers GB + 1 layerParticle board+rockwool) and would be more effective.

Could you link us to those blocks filled with sand please, i'm sure many dudes who reading that would appreciate it -> Danke^^

[EduardoApolonia]

Originally Posted by ruidostudios

Hi Eduardo, I have just read all this magnificient thread, and really hope you can fix your acoustics as soon as possible, because you really deserve all the success with this great work.
Just a -perhaps a bit naive or even stupid- question: do you know if there is any possibility of fixing that lo freq gap with some monitor hardware/software such as the Genelec DSP correction system also used by new Tannoy, Focal speakers, etc or even the P.A. oriented SIM or SMAART?
I guess it's not the best solution after so long work, but it's a pity seeing all your walls being removed.
Keep fighting, you have teached a lot and have been very generous allowing all of us to learn from your experience. This is the way Sound Engineering can progress.

BTW I am beginning to build a medium-sized studio very near form you, at Leon (Spain). A bit frightened, but encouraged by your motivation.

Muito obrigado.

Thanks for the compliments, I really appreciate it.

It's not so naive or stupid suggestion, there is always that last resort of using EQ or DSP for correction, but I'm trying to avoid that at any cost. It makes some things better but creates a lot of other problems.
Also I still have one way of doing it before reaching that point, for what I've tested, if I use a sub to generate frequencies from 20Hz to +/-130Hz and x-overing the monitors at 80-90Hz the problem practically disappears.
Anyhow I'm still trying to do it without having an external sub.

AND I WILL GET THERE!!!!!

i hope

Originally Posted by Sonic_X

Could you link us to those blocks filled with sand please, i'm sure many dudes who reading that would appreciate it -> Danke^^

I'm talking about regular strong cement blocks that are filled with sand as the construction goes on.

something like this but filled with sand.



It creates a lot of mass.

[therealtaxman]

Hi Eduardo! nice pictures of the construction and is great that you are actually do it yourself ..can you post more from the 2nd layer of the floor..and the walls..etc..it´d be alot of help cuz i´m gonna be in the same situation soon ...see u man!! have a nice day

[El Nino]

Your studio looks amazing Eduardo. Without a doubt inspiring. It kills me to see the studio taken apart though. After reading this thread I felt like I had gone through an emotional roller coaster. Being a musician and engineer also, I truly admire your dedication.

I sing for a little band called ILL NINO. We'll be in Europe for doing the summer festivals in 2010. I'd love to bring the guys by the studio if we are routed through Portugal.

[Atleast]

Marcelo rocks! ;) Tenho a certeza que vais resolver o teu problema, mereces e muito! Abraço de Lisboa.

[talontsiawd]

Amazing. I was just trying to find inspiration for buying a new desk and read through this whole thread. I actually am most inspired by your drive to continue to try to get everything right, rather than work in a room you are not happy with or take any shortcuts.

[EduardoApolonia]

Originally Posted by therealtaxman

Hi Eduardo! nice pictures of the construction and is great that you are actually do it yourself ..can you post more from the 2nd layer of the floor..and the walls..etc..it´d be alot of help cuz i´m gonna be in the same situation soon ...see u man!! have a nice day

I didn't do it all myself, actually I just did myself a small part like:
the floor structure, and layers
caulked a lot
practically all rockwool placement
passing through electrical cables
passing through and installing all audio cables
mounting all furniture
etc...

I had to control everything, because it was very easy for someone to make a fatal mistake.

The 2nd layer, was exactly done as the 1st and 3rd layer except that it was a different material. So it was (counting from outside to inside):
Floor: 19mm plywood, 15mm GB, 19mm Plywood
Walls: 15mm GB, 19mm Particle Board, 15mm GB
Ceiling: 15mm GB, 19mm Plywood, 15mm GB

If you want to know any particular detail of something on the 2nd layer, let me know and I will try to get pics of it.

Originally Posted by Atleast

Marcelo rocks! ;) Tenho a certeza que vais resolver o teu problema, mereces e muito! Abraço de Lisboa.

O Marcelo é o Marcelo!!
Grande Homem!!

Abraço do Algarve!!

Originally Posted by talontsiawd

Amazing. I was just trying to find inspiration for buying a new desk and read through this whole thread. I actually am most inspired by your drive to continue to try to get everything right, rather than work in a room you are not happy with or take any shortcuts.

I'm happy that I inspired someone
I'm known for being a perfectionist, it's one of my greatest attributes and one of my biggest flaws

[EduardoApolonia]

Originally Posted by El Nino

Your studio looks amazing Eduardo. Without a doubt inspiring. It kills me to see the studio taken apart though. After reading this thread I felt like I had gone through an emotional roller coaster. Being a musician and engineer also, I truly admire your dedication.

I sing for a little band called ILL NINO. We'll be in Europe for doing the summer festivals in 2010. I'd love to bring the guys by the studio if we are routed through Portugal.

Thanks for the compliments.

"little" band called Ill Nino? That's a "big" joke
If Ill Nino is little I only know micro bands

I've seen you guys in Portugal twice.
In the first Portuguese Ozzfest and on the Road Rage Tour.
These were a lot of years ago.

If you come to Portugal, it would be a pleasure to have you guys visit the studio.

[Mixbuster]

Holy CRAP! Is that the same studio? WOW.
It looks amazing! Good work, and I hope for your sake that you enjoy beein' in those rooms cus I def. would.

[EduardoApolonia]

No no no...

Those aren't my rooms, I wish they were

These are just studios that Marcelo Tavares, the Portuguese consultant who is helping me too, has designed.

[Mixbuster]

Originally Posted by EduardoApolonia

No no no...

Those aren't my rooms, I wish they were

These are just studios that Marcelo Tavares, the Portuguese consultant who is helping me too, has designed.

Ah, ok, my mistake :D But they look amazing.

[morpheuzrecords]

Yo Eddy,

any progress with the tuning process ? Did you already found and implemented a solution?

Just be patient it's a b*tchi thing to tune a room

david

[EduardoApolonia]

Hi David,

I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel

It's almost certain that from a lot of things that are causing the problem(s) the control room has, the biggest culprit is the ceiling height.
It's the room mode created by the ceiling height added to the SBIR created by the ceiling height too.

I'll post more info soon

[morpheuzrecords]

Originally Posted by EduardoApolonia

Hi David,

I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel

It's almost certain that from a lot of things that are causing the problem(s) the control room has, the biggest culprit is the ceiling height.
It's the room mode created by the ceiling height added to the SBIR created by the ceiling height too.

I'll post more info soon

try to build an angled ceiling absorber similar mine - should fix the room ratios and it will lover the decay times as well. Btw - do you have any RT60 measurements - I am curious what's the decay in your control room.

[JP Friesen]

I appreciate all the work you've done to bring us along as you have created this labor of love. Someone asked about your windows a while back. Just for reference I have them in my home here. In Canada they are made by EuroLine - Home and are amazing. Also by the way you hit the slutty out of the park they fit right in. Solid enough that they may pass as iso doors.
All the best as you sort out your problems. Bummer the designer hasn't stepped up. Doesn't speak well for their pride in performance. How does the tracking room sound in comparison?
JP

[Famous Audio]

ahh man This thread is total eye candy

[GBeats]

This is one of my favorite threads on GS! Kinda feels like I should hurry and click to another window when my wife comes around though. It feels just as wrong as surfing pornog!

[Syncamorea]

Originally Posted by GBeats

This is one of my favorite threads on GS! Kinda feels like I should hurry and click to another window when my wife comes around though. It feels just as wrong as surfing pornog!

Hmmm. My wife has followed this thread with me. And she likes it!

[EduardoApolonia]

Originally Posted by morpheuzrecords

try to build an angled ceiling absorber similar mine - should fix the room ratios and it will lover the decay times as well. Btw - do you have any RT60 measurements - I am curious what's the decay in your control room.

Thanks very much for the suggestion, I was already working on that possibility
Everytime I figure out a new possible cause I start working immediately on the possible solution.

Do you have any plans or pics on the ceiling absorber you did on your studio?

The RT60 graphs I have are from Fuzzmeasure and I don't trust them much, but I can say that it is around 250ms

Originally Posted by JP Friesen

All the best as you sort out your problems. Bummer the designer hasn't stepped up. Doesn't speak well for their pride in performance. How does the tracking room sound in comparison?
JP

The Designer has stepped up but the communication hasn't been easy.
I think that the fact that my room is a really challenging to get corrected is not helping much.
The tracking room sounds good, althought it's not a big room with a high ceiling

Originally Posted by Famous Audio

ahh man This thread is total eye candy

Originally Posted by GBeats

This is one of my favorite threads on GS! Kinda feels like I should hurry and click to another window when my wife comes around though. It feels just as wrong as surfing pornog!

Thanks for the comparison

Originally Posted by Syncamorea

Hmmm. My wife has followed this thread with me. And she likes it!

My wife as followed the construction in person and she likes it!!

[morpheuzrecords]

Originally Posted by EduardoApolonia

Thanks very much for the suggestion, I was already working on that possibility
Everytime I figure out a new possible cause I start working immediately on the possible solution.

Do you have any plans or pics on the ceiling absorber you did on your studio?

The RT60 graphs I have are from Fuzzmeasure and I don't trust them much, but I can say that it is around 250ms

There are some pics in my build thread but I can send you some more detailed shots and description via email. Basically the whole ceiling is a huge broadband absorber divided to 2 sections - the rear section consists of 8 "boxes" of 75x75 centimeters with varrying depth and insulation amount. The front section is angled down and has 2 layers of insulation - the first layer is horrizontal to the ceiling and suspended 10 cm from the ceiling while the second layer is inserted in the studs. Hope I explained it well

I am sure you will nail the room Eddy good luck again !!!