Pro tools sounds thin and brittle. Need warmth!!!
XxFeendogxX
Thread Starter
#1
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #1
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
Pro tools sounds thin and brittle. Need warmth!!!

Hello guys
I am posting this topic because I am having an issue with my mixes within pro tools. Here is a list of gear to help you understand.
2007 iMac
Digi 003 rack plus
Focusrite octo pre
Presonus studio channel
Behringer xnenx 2442 running into first 8 of 003
D112
3 sm57
Rode nt-1a
2 audix f15
At4050
Mxl 990
Audix d6
Pro tools 10

My mixes sound great when listening in a pro tools session through my KRK rockit 8s and through headphones. However when I bounce to disk and listen in the car the mixes sound dull and brittle. I record at 24 bit 44.1 and use dither when bouncing down. What could be causing this to happen? It's not one particular session it is all of them. I have been engineering for about 5 years and have never had this issue with logic or cubase. I have checked all the settings in pro tools and I know I am doing everything right. At least I'm 95% sure. Has anyone else run in to this issue? Please help

Best regards.
#2
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #2
Gear Head
 
rushmpeg's Avatar
 

Hi,
Have you tried your mix with other speakers before mixdown? I know the rockit's are rather boomy and are a bit too generous with the low frequencies.
This would explain the thin sound on other systems that have less bass response.

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#3
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #3
Gear interested
 
Negyuh's Avatar
 

Hi, the answer to your question is: it depends, as posted in the previous post, it could be your monitors but personally i think i will be something else.
I also record like you do (i think) i put my instruments through my analog mixer right into the record track(direct out), then mix them right back through the mixer with effects gates and compression and master the track with another program ( i record with logic pro and master with garageband on a Mac Pro, interfaces used are focusrite saffire pro 40 and mastering done on my old m-audio fast track pro)
Question, do you use compression on your tracks like drums (by the way how do you do drum tracks?) i know from my personal experience this can make a huge difference to the overall sound of your recordings.
#4
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Stackx's Avatar
 

The 003 sounds pretty dull and gloomy as well. But it sounds like your monitors or room is fooling you.

Are your monitors against a wall?

Do you have room treatment?
XxFeendogxX
Thread Starter
#5
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #5
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
Thanks guys. My monitors are against a wall. Well about a foot away. I do have room treatment as well. No bass traps. Some foam. However the mixes do not sound as dull when I listen in headphones either. Do you think it could be the conversion during or after the bounce? Have you guys ever had this problem? It's only after the bounce do they sound different.
XxFeendogxX
Thread Starter
#6
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #6
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
I think staxx is right it may be my room. But it sounded the same on other mixes I have done with the same equipment in a different room as well.
#7
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #7
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Stackx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by XxFeendogxX View Post
Thanks guys. My monitors are against a wall. Well about a foot away. I do have room treatment as well. No bass traps. Some foam. However the mixes do not sound as dull when I listen in headphones either. Do you think it could be the conversion during or after the bounce? Have you guys ever had this problem? It's only after the bounce do they sound different.
After you bounce it down keep your session open. Play it threw your session then play the file you just bounce in windows media or whatever media player you have and see if they sound the same threw the same monitors and gear. If they don't then it's somewhere between the conversion. It it does sound the same but not the same out of the studio then it's your room. Foam doesn't do anything to bass. Matter of fact you might be hurting yourself with all the foam catching all the high frequencies but nothing catching any of the low frequencies. But then that would result in a mix with no bass and brittle and thin.
XxFeendogxX
Thread Starter
#8
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #8
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
I only have about 12 pieces of 1' X 1' foam in the room not too much. More or less to control the sound not deaden it. Do you think recording at a higher sample rate would help the brittleness stax?
#9
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #9
Perhaps hang a quilt behind your speakers and on the opposite wall? I had a 003 until last August and had similar mix translation issues until I treated the room. No problems now! Also, try to position your speakers in an optimal spot where they sound best, even if it seems like they are in a weird place.

[IMG] room-treatment by baskervils, on Flickr[/IMG]
#10
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #10
one man, ONE mic pre
the easiest thing to do, and one of the most effective, toward making your recordings sound less 'brittle' is to keep all the internal levels LOW.

that is (in Pro Tools) well in the green, never into the yellow)

it's the most common beginner mistake
#11
13th June 2012
Old 13th June 2012
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Stackx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by baskervils View Post
Perhaps hang a quilt behind your speakers and on the opposite wall? I had a 003 until last August and had similar mix translation issues until I treated the room. No problems now! Also, try to position your speakers in an optimal spot where they sound best, even if it seems like they are in a weird place.

[IMG] room-treatment by baskervils, on Flickr[/IMG]
Nice treatment. How did you hang those up?
XxFeendogxX
Thread Starter
#12
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #12
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
@wwittman have you had that issue before? So keep the levels below -16 when tracking or mixing? Or both? I do try to get a good level going in usually between -10 and -6.
#13
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stackx View Post
Nice treatment. How did you hang those up?
Ah! I found the perfect item. Art stores (and sometimes Home Depot) carry large picture frame hangers (Hangman), which attach to the back of the box and to the drywall.
#14
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #14
one man, ONE mic pre
Quote:
Originally Posted by XxFeendogxX View Post
@wwittman have you had that issue before? So keep the levels below -16 when tracking or mixing? Or both? I do try to get a good level going in usually between -10 and -6.
absolutely have.

the lower the better. you want to keep even the peaks WELL below headroom ceiling.

-10 is way too hot.
-20 is more like it.
#15
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #15
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Adam Dempsey's Avatar
The most important thing is this: have you clocked up lots of hours listening to music you know well in your monitoring environment?
XxFeendogxX
Thread Starter
#16
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #16
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
Wow. I think everyone is right on target. Wwhittman I think I have found my problem. You guys are great! Thank you!!!
#17
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #17
Lives for gear
 
Stackx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by baskervils View Post
Ah! I found the perfect item. Art stores (and sometimes Home Depot) carry large picture frame hangers (Hangman), which attach to the back of the box and to the drywall.
Omg. Ur a genius! Thanks for sharing.
#18
14th June 2012
Old 14th June 2012
  #18
Lives for gear
 
Ragan's Avatar
 

First thing first, have you imported your bounce back into the session and listened to it side by with the live session? Do that first. Blind, if possible.
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