31 band eq clean guitar setting?

[deckard1]

Took your advice and did a brief search in the music computer forum but don't quite know how to title my search to obtain the best results. To be honest, I am afraid to venture out of this forum into the music computer forum or any other forum for that matter since most of you guys are professional audio/sound engineers. . .in short, I'm a little intimidated.

What if I started a "new computer" thread in this forum. . .the newbie forum?


Edit: Talked to the guy at Sweetwater and while he thinks I should purchase a "creation station" from Sweetwater, he essentially told me that most studios spend the extra money and get Macs.

Here ya go: http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Apple%26...&skuId=4983015

Any thoughts?

[matt thomas]

Actually, come to think of it, ideally you should have 4 hard drives. One for your system, one for audio, one for sample (like your drums) and one for back up

LOL

matt

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

Actually, come to think of it, ideally you should have 4 hard drives. One for your system, one for audio, one for sample (like your drums) and one for back up

LOL

matt

Very funny. . .I know you are serious. . .but, still, that is way out of my league.

Getting back to the basics. . .do you think the iMac I referenced above is a good choice? I'm probably going to go for a Dell PC Desktop instead that has close to the same requirements [Intel i5 instead of i7] as the iMac but cost $1000 less. That way I can spend the difference on a nice audio interface, external hard drive, etc., as well. Check her out:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Dell+-+X...=1218644422933

Besides, the Macs you probably use and what studio pros use are the MacPros. . .correct?

Thanks.

[matt thomas]

Yeah I have a MacPro, although I have an older model, and the current iMacs are faster than it. I will be upgrading soon.

PC's can do everything that a Mac can. At least as far as making music is concerned. There is some software (particularly Logic) that is only available on a Mac, and plenty (mostly cheaper stuff, free plugins etc) that are only available on a PC.

It is very rare that any hardware only works on one platform, although there are some examples, like the Apogee Duet, or the UAD Satellite, both Mac only.

Which one you use really comes down to personal preference. I prefer a Mac, as it feels better. Also it is the standard, so it is more attractive to others using my space.

The Creation Stations are probably great, but they are just PC's with well chosen parts. They are pretty specialist. To do it cheaper you could just copy their parts list and get a local computer shop to put a machine together for you using those parts.

Yes the iMac would be good, but it is a lot more $$$ than you were talking about paying.

You could also consider buying used. But that has obvious risks involved, but the money you save could make it worth it.

These guys are good to deal with, I have never bought anything off them, but I have had email discussions, and they seem great, they sell used Macs:

Apple Computers - New Macs, Used Macs & Accessories | PowerMax

You mentioned earlier about running Pro Tools and Reaper at the same time. You wouldn't do that, since they both serve the same purpose. Reaper is great, but Pro Tools is the standard, which is why it could be good to get to know it, if you ever want to take stuff further, send it to another studio etc..

I'd just try the laptop you already have if I were you.

Matt

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

I'd just try the laptop you already have if I were you.

But that's no fun!

I've already made up my mind to get a reasonably cheap [less expensive] PC Desktop and turn it solely into a workstation for my little studio. . .so I can run Reaper and use my guitar setup. Besides my present laptop is very slow and freezing all the time and I don't want to spend the money to upgrade it. . .kind of like beating a dead horse, as the saying goes.

The guy from Sweetwater told me the same thing. . .that I wouldn't need to use the Protools that the audio interface comes with since I already have Reaper. Great minds think alike.

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by deckard1

But that's no fun!

I've already made up my mind to get a reasonably cheap [less expensive] PC Desktop and turn it solely into a workstation for my little studio. . .so I can run Reaper and use my guitar setup. Besides my present laptop is very slow and freezing all the time and I don't want to spend the money to upgrade it. . .kind of like beating a dead horse, as the saying goes.

The guy from Sweetwater told me the same thing. . .that I wouldn't need to use the Protools that the audio interface comes with since I already have Reaper. Great minds think alike.

Well than. From my limited knowledge (largely transplanted from Mac Land), I'd recommend, assuming you don't want to spend too much

Get an i5, or if you can, an i7 processor
Get 8gB Ram
get a large fast hdd. Expect to upgrade to two (or more) in the future.
If you don't get a back up disk you will kick yourself at some point.
You don't need a flash graphics card, but possibly one with two outputs.
You will want a large monitor, or two smaller ones, which means you'll need a video card with two outputs.

If you have it in the same room as you, noise may be an issue. I solve this by having long cables and having it in the next room. The cables cost a bit, but it is cheaper and more effective than trying to build a silent pc.

I would find a local store, one of those ones above another store in a cheap suburb, run by nerd, who is probably also a recent immigrant, probably from asia (hope thats not too stereotyping, but it is true), that has piles of computer peripheral boxes in the window, to make one to order, with the same parts that a pro DAW place lists on their site, right down to the motherboard. At least where I am from, it is generally cheaper than buying pre-made ones, and you can choose exactly what you want.

Matt

[deckard1]

Found one. . .and it's only a little over $700:

Dell PC desktop
Intel i5 processor
8 GB of memory
1 TB of storage
3.1 GHz
7200 rpm hard drive

NO firewire though. . .how crucial is that?

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by deckard1

Found one. . .and it's only a little over $700:

Dell PC desktop
Intel i5 processor
8 GB of memory
1 TB of storage
3.1 GHz
7200 rpm hard drive

NO firewire though. . .how crucial is that?

Sounds like an option

Firewire is only crucial if you have a firewire audio interface.

Otherwise firewire is a good way to connect external drives, but USB works too. Or eSata is even better.

Some video cameras connect with firewire too, but that is not so common these days.

remember to budget in a monitor.

Does it have space for another internal drive later? (generally internal is better than external ones, the sata bus internally is faster the USB or firewire)

matt

[deckard1]

Thanks.

Monitor: Dell - 20" Flat-Panel LED HD Monitor [$150]
Available Expansion Slots: 2 PCI Express [whatever that means]

Was in the store today and checked out the monitors. . .the ones that were bigger than 20" or 21.5" seemed too big. Is 20" big enough?

How do you know if there is space for an internal drive later? Can you tell from looking at the tower or do you need the specs?

Here are some closeups of the tower: http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....type=Alternate View 5&h=488

Check out the "angle" view. . .it looks like there is space for another internal drive. . .no?

[matt thomas]

PCIe slots are for expansion cards, like high end interfaces, and extra processing like UAD cards.

How big a screen you want depends on you, Audio stuff tends to take up a lot of room. I would say 20 would be a minimum.

You can't really tell if there is room for another drive unless you see the inside. The part I think you are talking about is for a DVD drive. Only way to know really is to ask, or find an internal photo, or full specs.

matt

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

PCIe slots are for expansion cards, like high end interfaces, and extra processing like UAD cards.

How big a screen you want depends on you, Audio stuff tends to take up a lot of room. I would say 20 would be a minimum.

You can't really tell if there is room for another drive unless you see the inside. The part I think you are talking about is for a DVD drive. Only way to know really is to ask, or find an internal photo, or full specs.

matt

Called Dell support and they said there is in fact room for 2 more internal drives.

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by deckard1

Called Dell support and they said there is in fact room for 2 more internal drives.

perfect

matt

[deckard1]

Okay. . .got the new computer up and running! Very very happy with it.

Just ordered the audio interface [M-Audio C400] as well. I assume I am good to go!

Just curious as to what you think I might need next for my new workstation? I'm good for now. . .but something to think about for the future? What would you get??? Just curious.


BTW, I can't thank you enough for helping me out.

deckard1

[matt thomas]

No worries helping you out. I have spent a bit of time on this, but you seem like a good guy, and I'm glad to be of assistance.

So, next? Ha. You are addicted.

First I'd get a back up disk. They say: if its not backed up, you don't have it at all.

Then, dunno, its really a never ending process. I'm not sure what you're usin for monitoring (speakers), which is an important one. Its also an area where its only really worth it to spend some serious money, theres not much point going half way.

Maybe a controller keyboard, for playing other parts.

Look out for some freeware plugins, there are quite a few available for PC. But don't just download anything or you'll get all loaded up with crap, figure out what is good first.

BTW. Funny you living in LA, everything on your doorstep. Bit different from round here.

matt

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

No worries helping you out. I have spent a bit of time on this, but you seem like a good guy, and I'm glad to be of assistance.

So, next? Ha. You are addicted.

First I'd get a back up disk. They say: if its not backed up, you don't have it at all.

Then, dunno, its really a never ending process. I'm not sure what you're usin for monitoring (speakers), which is an important one. Its also an area where its only really worth it to spend some serious money, theres not much point going half way.

Maybe a controller keyboard, for playing other parts.

Look out for some freeware plugins, there are quite a few available for PC. But don't just download anything or you'll get all loaded up with crap, figure out what is good first.

BTW. Funny you living in LA, everything on your doorstep. Bit different from round here.

matt

Thanks Matt. Yeah, LA is definitely an interesting place. Never a dull moment. Funny, that with all music retail stores available I still order my stuff online from Sweetwater now. Ever heard of something like this. . .it's a sonic maximizer. . .apparently it's great for guitar tone:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/sear...onic+maximizer

Great suggestions. . .I already know what I want next.

A couple of more monitors would be great. That way I would have 4 speakers situated throughout the room. I think it would sound awesome. The audio interface I ordered [M-Audio C400] has 4 outputs. . .so two more monitors would work. The 2 monitors I have right now are KRK Rokit Powered 5 Generation 2 Powered Studio monitors. Have you ever heard of them? They were $150 a piece.

BTW, what do you do with all your unwanted used gear. . .do you sell it. . .ebay, etc.?? I need to get rid of my portastudio.

deckard1

[matt thomas]

BBE's (sonic maximizers) have a reputation for being things that people buy when they are starting out, and then being the first things they sell.

I know KRK speakers, but not that model. I wasn't suggesting more speakers so you have four, I was meaning two good ones so you can hear stuff as well as possible. But the ones you have will do for now, unless you are spending a lot on them.

Sell gear, probably on ebay. I use a local auction site here in NZ. Gearslutz has a classifieds you could try first, although typically its higher end stuff.

matt

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

BBE's (sonic maximizers) have a reputation for being things that people buy when they are starting out, and then being the first things they sell.

I know KRK speakers, but not that model. I wasn't suggesting more speakers so you have four, I was meaning two good ones so you can hear stuff as well as possible. But the ones you have will do for now, unless you are spending a lot on them.

Sell gear, probably on ebay. I use a local auction site here in NZ. Gearslutz has a classifieds you could try first, although typically its higher end stuff.

matt

Thanks for the headsup on the BBE's [God I love this forum and website. . .excellent advice from REAL sound engineers like yourself. I'm used to dealing with the local Guitar Center pro-audio guy who doesn't know squat and just wants to sell you something.]

I'll take your advice and stick with my current monitors. I am reasonably satisfied with them for now.

As soon as I sell the portastudio I am going to get a backup hard drive like you suggested.

BTW, New Zealand is supposed to be a very beautiful place. . .haven't been there myself, but, my parents went there and can't wait to go back! Lots of sheep, they said. A bit different than Los Angeles.

deckard1

[matt thomas]

BBE's do have their place, but they are waaay overused by beginners. Usually to try to fix problems that are best fixed otherwise. I wouldn't get one if I were you.

For a back up drive you just need anything, but bigger is good, so it can fit more backups on it. Doesn't have to be fast or anything..

Yeah NZ is great. Unless you are trying to buy a new Mac Pro like I was today. I phoned every store in the city (decent size city, over a million people) and there is only one in one store, and its an old model, that they still want the old price for it. To get a new one they have to order it in from overseas, takes 10 days. ha. I look at american prices all the time and get jealous.

Matt

[deckard1]

Matt,

Would love to get something that removes certain tracks from songs. For example, getting rid of the vocals and guitar tracks from a CD [or a song off of iTunes, for example] so you hear only the bass and drums of a song. Is this even possible? Do such devices exist? Can a DAW, like Reaper, accomplish this?

Many thanks,
deckard1

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by deckard1

Matt,

Would love to get something that removes certain tracks from songs. For example, getting rid of the vocals and guitar tracks from a CD [or a song off of iTunes, for example] so you hear only the bass and drums of a song. Is this even possible? Do such devices exist? Can a DAW, like Reaper, accomplish this?

Many thanks,
deckard1

Nah its not possible, although I have seen a program demoed that can do it, using pretty flash software, but I don't think its released yet.

Its not a simple thing to do, as any sound is blended with all the other sounds. You would have to predict all the harmonics and structure of the part you are trying to remove to be able to do it. I was amazed when I saw the demo of the software I mentioned above, I had thought that it was virtually impossible to achieve.

You can slightly remove vocals from some recordings in the way that a "karaoke" button on a home stereo works. The easiest way is to find an eq that has a Mid-Side mode (or MS mode), and remove some of the middle frequencies from the mid signal. This doesn't work very well, as it also removes lots of other stuff, and also leaves stuff, but it is a start. If you don't have an MS capable eq you can get a MS encoder/decoder plugin, and insert it before and after any eq that can control the left and right separately, and convert the signal from LR to MS, then eq out the mids in the left signal, then convert it from MS to LR.

Make sense? I'm guessing not. If it does, then you could figure out how to use this method to get rid of panned guitars too.

There are probably freeware VST plugins that work the same way.. I just googled, here's one: -/////-

You can also approach it with spectral editing. Izotope RX is great at this, although it is expensive. It can remove sounds from within other sounds. Although whole parts would be pushing your luck probably. Its more for little sounds, like a chair squeak or something.

Actually I did see a plugin recently that had a wee screen where you could highlight spectral parts of a mix and just play them, the demo was quite cool, although it was aimed at DJ's, but I can't remember what it was called. You could grab just the snare (in a filtered sounding way)

Long story short, you probably shouldn't worry about it, its not really a worthwhile thing to spend time on, and you won't get great results in the end, no matter how long you spend on it. Again its something that people who are starting out ask, and then realise that there isn't much point to it anyway, with the exception being DJ's doing remixes I suppose.

matt

[deckard1]

Great explanation!

I've been studying the Reaper User's Manual and am very happy I made the switch to a DAW (i.e. Reaper) over my portastudio. The possibilities are endless with Reaper. That said, I think I am eventually going to need a midi controller keyboard for bass, keyboards, etc., in addition to my guitar and EZDrummer. I checked out Sweetwater and they are very inexpensive compared to most equipment. Any thoughts. . .what's good and what to stay away from? Looks like M-Audio has cornered the market in this area.

deckard1

[matt thomas]

You want to go into a shop and try these, because the feel of them is of key (pun intended) importance. Also the build quality varies, some feel quite flimsy.

But yes M-Audio, Novation, and Akai are probably the ones to look out for. There are some other good ones too, but they are the obvious ones.

If you get one with a few knobs and sliders, it is can be an idea to have LED strips by them, so that you know what they are doing. This makes them more expensive though. Although I think some of the novation ones have a transparent window that comes up on your DAW to do the same job, but I'm not sure how useful that is.

If I was buying blind I'd probably go for Novation. Otherwise I'd go try them.

I use an old Roland master keyboard, probably about 20 years old. It isn't designed specifically for DAWs but it was a great controller in its day, with a great feeling keyboard. It hooks up via midi, because USB wasn't even invented then..

You should look out for what software comes bundled with them, because that can sway a decision. For instance the Arturia one (another good option) comes with a cut down version of all their excellent software synths.

matt

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

You want to go into a shop and try these, because the feel of them is of key (pun intended) importance. Also the build quality varies, some feel quite flimsy.

But yes M-Audio, Novation, and Akai are probably the ones to look out for. There are some other good ones too, but they are the obvious ones.

If you get one with a few knobs and sliders, it is can be an idea to have LED strips by them, so that you know what they are doing. This makes them more expensive though. Although I think some of the novation ones have a transparent window that comes up on your DAW to do the same job, but I'm not sure how useful that is.

If I was buying blind I'd probably go for Novation. Otherwise I'd go try them.

I use an old Roland master keyboard, probably about 20 years old. It isn't designed specifically for DAWs but it was a great controller in its day, with a great feeling keyboard. It hooks up via midi, because USB wasn't even invented then..

You should look out for what software comes bundled with them, because that can sway a decision. For instance the Arturia one (another good option) comes with a cut down version of all their excellent software synths.

matt

Thanks. What about the number of keys on the keyboard. . .how significant is this? I don't want to make the same mistake I made with the 31 band graphic eq where I mistakenly thought "the more the better." I know if I asked the guy in the store this same question he would try to sell me the keyboard with the most keys as they are also more expensive.

deckard1

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by deckard1

Thanks. What about the number of keys on the keyboard. . .how significant is this? I don't want to make the same mistake I made with the 31 band graphic eq where I mistakenly thought "the more the better." I know if I asked the guy in the store this same question he would try to sell me the keyboard with the most keys as they are also more expensive.

deckard1

Ah, well in this case more is better, unless you are talking about portability.

A normal piano has 88 keys, so if you want to play full piano parts you need 88 keys, but the truth is, even when playing a piano you don't normally use the highest and the lowest notes. So for most piano parts you can get away with a smaller keyboard, say a 61 key.

A 49 is good for if you play mostly one handed parts. This is suitable for people who play lead synth, or bass parts. Good for programming. Good for dance music etc.. not so good for two handed piano playing.

Anything smaller is just to save space, and will probably be annoying because you have to keep jumping octaves to play various parts.

m

[matt thomas]

some have little drum pads on them. I got a pad one thinking I would use it, but ended up preferring the keyboard. YMMV (your milage may vary)

matt

[deckard1]

LOL! I found one!

Checked out all the sound samples and reviews. Not going to buy it right away. . .as I need to search some more and my checkbook needs a bit of a rest.

I forgot to mention I am an analog freak.

Arturia - Musical Instruments | Intro


deckard1

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by deckard1

LOL! I found one!

Checked out all the sound samples and reviews. Not going to buy it right away. . .as I need to search some more and my checkbook needs a bit of a rest.

I forgot to mention I am an analog freak.

Arturia - Musical Instruments | Intro


deckard1

Yeah, I have never used one of those, but its definitely an interesting option.

matt

[matt thomas]

BTW. These are probably very good. I have bought some of Kenny's Pro Tools tutorials in the past, and they are excellent:

Reaper Training Videos

matt

[mlange]

Originally Posted by matt thomas

ah ok, actually I think you did mention the wampler, I just didn't know what it was.

I have a guitarist friend who has been anti amp simulators till he tried this one:

Kemper Profiling Amplifier (White) | Sweetwater.com

Its the latest thing, so that's always more exciting, maybe the buzz will die down, but it is pretty crazy piece of equipment if you check out the videos. You can download simulations of other user's amps online.. Quite expensive though..

matt

Not to bore you, but much of our studio's amp backline were used by the engineers who did the Kemper Amps profiles.... It really is remarkable - and I didn't want to be a believer. YMMV, but I believe it would be unbeatable as a go-to guitar recording tool. ........ And I own the flipping amps

And Matt you are a prince - there's nothing but good words & solid advice throughout!

[deckard1]

Originally Posted by mlange

And Matt you are a prince - there's nothing but good words & solid advice throughout!

Agreed!