MBox 2: will you part with the cash?

Originally Posted by Rail Jon Rogut

Get an M-Audio Transit (unless you're going to buy DV-Toolkit)

Rail

But Rail, can the Transit open PTLE files without buying the Mpowered PT? If it does I will buy one.

Lou

[Rail Jon Rogut]

For $69 -- Nope.

Rail

[T_R_S]

I did not get Mbox 1 and I won't buy Mbox 2. I need 64 tracks/96K.
I guess I will use Logic on my laptop and wait for MBox 3

[thermos]

And transit also won't open pro tools M powered, right?? Or will it?

[VuucuuV]

it's Crippleware!
new mBox- joke. just a dongle to run PTLE at only 48k, crippled as it won't let you use other interfaces, crippled like the 002 that still won't even let you mix multi-channel, even though the hardware is there! but their drivers suck to use it with anything else?

[pan60]

it's Crippleware!

[Sobe]

So what happens when someone sends you a ProTools file to work on ... it is a standard now and if you can not open the file and deliver your work back in the ProTools format , you come off as kind of a small time player . If all you do is your own stuff I guess you do not need it but out of all the programs I use DP , Logic ,Live , Reason etc .. it is still the best for editing audio .

[pan60]

no denying it is great editing software, just will no longer be held hostage to it.
it maybe a standard but their are many folks that are tired of digis tactics.

it is a standard now and if you can not open the file and deliver your work back in the ProTools format , you come off as kind of a small time player.

making stabs as such will not win you any favors in my book, and i would be willing to bet it would just piss some off.
lots of studio that have had their fill of digi.

[Sobe]

digi is more popular than ever there is not one world class studio that does not have an HD rig in it .

[zabour]

There are plenty of audio interfaces on the market right now that will give you 96K and a firewire bus at around $400. Digi sells mboxes to people like who just need session compatability but work in other daw.

Focusrite designed and the mBox for Digi and I I heard from a pretty unreliable buddy of mine that the Focusrite Saffire was pitched to Digi as the mBox 2 and they tought it was more than was a portable interface should be and that it would eat into 02 sales. it's 400 bucks the same shape as the dimesions as an mBox ... just wrapped in different plastic.

The mBox 2 is not about getting more than the mBox it just about changing the wrapper.

The only thing that will change the way Digi behaves in an anti-trust suit ... until then they'll keep doing things the way they are doing them now. Which means selling cripple-ware. I hope that by the time the mBox 1 becomes obselete... that we have a tryley open and portable file format that not only transports sessions ... but also automation (wishful thinking here) and effects ... the print media is really starting to get into standards perhaps it time audio guys take a hard look at standards ... (once again wishful thinking)

[pan60]

i think the everyone else has it so you must pitch is getting old.
lots of world class gearslutz here that have no interest in digi.
don't like pop, don't do pop, don't care.

[BillyJack]

"Cripple-Ware" I like that!

[Rail Jon Rogut]

Originally Posted by thermos

And transit also won't open pro tools M powered, right?? Or will it?

Yes it will.

Rail

[midnightsun]

I bought an M Box some time ago as an experiment. I already had a RADAR and a TASCAM SX1. I wanted portability and the ability to try some very simple mixes while traveling. I realized that I had to actually take the M Box on the plane just to fire up ProTools. I am personally not willing to submit to that type of bullshit. It is extortion. My experiment was a success in that it taught me that I shouldn't spend another nickle on digi. I don't give a crap about who is getting lubed to endorse it, nor do I listen to the peanut gallery singing about the emperor's new clothes.

[Duardo]

I realized that I had to actually take the M Box on the plane just to fire up ProTools. I am personally not willing to submit to that type of bullshit. It is extortion.

Yes, that's exactly what it is, extortion.

How dare they?

-Duardo

[Sobe]

they need a dongle so you can just run the program without the hardware .

[Jorg]

Originally Posted by Sobe

digi is more popular than ever there is not one world class studio that does not have an HD rig in it .

This is ridicilous!
How do u measure world class in ur book?

I guess u are working for digidesign, aren't u?
Saying that we all need PT because it's standard is a very bad selling tactic!

The MBOX2 is a joke because I can't see any major improvements! What have u guys been doing in the last couple of years. Did u discuss if it needs a handle or not????

I guess if you keep resting and relying much longer on your GOOD NAME, than u should be prepared for a dark future.

Pyramix already replaces PT in many Post Studios......
More and more project studios switch to Logic...

and btw (considering the Software)! How difficult can it be to implement plug-in delay compensation for LE? Ur the last ones without that feature!

[Sobe]

Every major studio in all the major areas have an HD rig ... tell me one that does not have a system ... so many times I would need to call a rental company now they all have it . I do not work for Digi I was a beta tester years ago and got discounts for that but those days are over .

[pan60]

As many have commented, the Mbox 2 is primarily designed to provide greater value and quality to new users, rather than as an upgrade to existing Mbox 1 owners. It is a “replacement” in our product-line in that respect, and we weren’t expecting it to take over from the needs of buyers of our FireWire-based products like 002 and 002Rack. As more and more MIDI musicians choose Pro Tools, we were keen to ensure that they wouldn’t have to buy a separate MIDI interface.

the word we is somewhat suspect, not that i care.

[thermos]

Rail, are you sure? I don't see that on the digidesign site. I have one of those transits, so it would be cool to run Pro Tools M-Powered with it.

[BillyJack]

You know something? I've read this thread three or four times along with other threads on the subject of Digi / No-Digi and I'll tell you what bothers me about the whole thing.

1st = Comments like "For $500 what do you expect?"
My answer: Something more than a $200 value with a $300 name recognition tagged onto it!

2nd = Comments being made saying this is for entry level recording to tease the ignorant like myself into making a dead end investment. I'm mean yes I can upgrade to the 002 for another $2000+ dollars and then as I expand my desire buy a $10,000+ HD starter setup.
My answer: For the money wouldn't entry level be better served dollar wise to buy DP with the HD192 for around $2500 out of the box and ready to go. This system I could expand on without being held captive to propitiatory hardware and software. This to me would be more of the definition of entry level.

Which brings me to number 3 = "digi is more popular than ever there is not one world class studio that does not have a HD rig in it".
My answer: WTF? I thought we were talking designed for entry level.

Is my perspective way off base here? No I'm not a big time studio but I want to produce a quality product with my investment and I don't want to be dragged through the coals to do it.

Seriously, am I viewing the context wrong?

[Jorg]

Originally Posted by BillyJack

Seriously, am I viewing the context wrong?

No u don't!!!
Slowly but surely digi looses us all.

[Kestral]

You pretty much nailed it dead on, BillyJack. Great post

[Albert]

ProTools is as ubiquitous in recording studios now as multitrack tape machines used to be. For years, every session I've played in a commercial recording studio has been recorded to PT and Digi hardware.

You see other stuff in people's home or project studios, but *by far* the most common system in commercial studios is the Digi stuff. That and multitrack tape machines.

[Jorg]

Originally Posted by Albert

ProTools is as ubiquitous in recording studios now as multitrack tape machines used to be. For years, every session I've played in a commercial recording studio has been recorded to PT and Digi hardware.

You see other stuff in people's home or project studios, but *by far* the most common system in commercial studios is the Digi stuff. That and multitrack tape machines.

That does not mean:

- that's its the best out there!

- that's it's gonna stay like that!

- that the new MBox2 is good!


Let something be invented like a session wrapper that lets u import PT Session in Logic, DP or Cubase and even more people will switch.
Digidesign is only good for one thing: Putting ridicilous price tags on their gear.
I see more and more Studios running Logic (true, they use a HD rig because they need the possibilty to open PT Sessions).

I think PT (the software) is already miles behind and its only getting worse.

Pro Tools is a great piece of software for those guys who are used to tape and then changed to digital. However the new generation is more demanding...

[Duardo]

[quote]The MBOX2 is a joke because I can't see any major improvements! [quote]

There are minor improvements. I don't think Digidesign is claiming any major improvements. Seems reasonable considering that the price didn't change.

For the money wouldn't entry level be better served dollar wise to buy DP with the HD192 for around $2500 out of the box and ready to go.

That depends on your needs. For some sure, the DP/HD192 setup may be a better choice. I actually went with a 2408-based setup over an LE setup because it was better for my needs at the time (this was back when the 001 was it). For others...including those who need a few preamps, or want a control surface, or need Pro Tools software, the 002 might be a better choice. There's no one solution that's the "best" for any given level.

Digidesign is only good for one thing: Putting ridicilous price tags on their gear.
I see more and more Studios running Logic (true, they use a HD rig because they need the possibilty to open PT Sessions).

It may not be cheap, but I don't think any of Digidesign's products are "ridiculous". And since we're talking about the M Box specifically I don't see how that could be considered to be ridiculously priced...if you figure the value of the sofware at about $300 (in line with, say, Cubase SL) and the box at $150 it's pretty reasonable (and nobody here even knows what the box sounds like yet...maybe it is a big improvement?).

I think that most of the studios running Logic that are using HD rigs do so because they want access to the DSP on the Digidesign cards.

-Duardo

[Henchman]

What a joke. No 96k option or 5.1 playback capabilities.
I bought a firebox just for that. More ins and outs than the Shitbox2.

[rolo]

i have always been a digi fan... i own an hd3 accel sys w'192's i also own an mbox for my powerbook. when the mbox first came out... everyone i knew thought it was pretty damn great. it was not ground breaking, but very close. this new mbox2 does nothing at all for me. in fact it is my opinion that digi developed this box to seperate themselves further from focusrite (the sapphire has just been released, and in my opinion... is an mbox killer!!!) so.... box2 has the same software, with the same track counts, and the same 48k tops platform. about the only cool thing the mbox2 has is stinking midi... which the should have released in the FIRST mbox. i will not buy an mbox 2. why is it so hard for digidesign to give their customers the features they desire... they have the technology to do it. their software can support higher resolutions and higher track counts.... they have the ability to develope a budget interface that can support both of these demands... but... doing this (i think) will make purchasing a hd system more trivial,at least for beginners and intermediate users.

[Duardo]

I imagine part of the reason it hasn't changed much is because the M-Audio lineup of products fill a lot of holes.

-Duardo

[uvc1977]

All I can say that the Mbox 2 is rather average and compared to other similar products in the market place it already feels outdated. I mean USB 1.1 hahahaha, companies such as Presonus must be jumpin up & down for joy.

This all ties into the bigger picture with their HD systems, keep LE crippled just enough so you've got to fork out $$$$ to serious production work. In the long run it wont work, for every new release of Cubase, Logic, Sonar, DP etc combined with the power of PC's/MAC's it just eats away at the "Perceived" advantages of Pro Tools.

It would be nice to see Digi release Pro Tools LE with at least 48 tracks capabilities, and a 16 channel adat, would fit nicely for my production needs.