A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer - Page 2

sirthought · 20th June 2008, 12:30 AM

tsvisser,

You may really want to look at Yamaha 01v96v2, as you can get the motorized faders with that, plus a choice of connection options. Once you start shopping for all of those desired features, that seems to be the lowest price point manufacturers are offering.

Also, the gear I use is still a Roland 2480, but I use it as a controller with the aid of a Presonus V-Fire. I can use the Roland's automation if I want or I can mix in the DAW.

tsvisser · 20th June 2008, 12:56 AM

I never really used Yamaha equipment before, and don't necessarily know that I trust the sound quality. Hey, I do like the fact that the Allen & Heath is a trusty old analog board, one of its major positive features, but the Yamaha does look quite interesting too... combined with a MADI card and maybe an RME RAYDAT it would make an excellent portable solution.

On the other hand, I've owned Allen & Heath gear before and have always been more than satisfied with their build and sound quality.

Does anyone else find it odd that the Yamaha board doesn't have dedicated DAW transport keys, since it is marketed as a controller? I guess you could assign the flexible keys, but it seems odd to me.

Saudade · 20th June 2008, 07:38 AM

tsvisser, I guess every user would want a new product to lean more to their style of workflow, but I think whether a product will sell or not depends a lot on the positioning or it's target market, and how much they are willing to pay for the feature set.

Here is how I see the 3 similar products I mentioned:

The Studiolive is a digital mixer. It boasts its DSP for digital effects (including compressors) for every channel. Personally, other than live purposes, I don't see any advantage of having a digital mixer to mixdown recordings nowadays, especially if it doesn't have motorised fader (left out due to the price). Why would anyone want to route streams from the computer back into a digital mixer to mix with its proprietary onboard fx eludes me

, especially nowadays DAW plugins are getting more and better by the day, many high quality ones are priced very low (sub $50)

The N12's eq, compressor and reverb are also digital, but it has only 8 pres. It boasts the "one function per knob" integration with Cubase AI, very deep integration that even lets you control the metronome level from a knob. It returns from DAW the same number of channels it can record to it. But again hardware mixing's appeal is questionable since it is a digital mixer. But the clear selling point is integration with Cubase AI.

The Onyx 1640 is arguably the closest in form to the Zed, with 16 pres and analog EQ. But its workflow is more leaning towards using it as a tracking mixer, then mix/sum ITB, given that it only can return 2 channels playback from DAW, a feature (or lack thereof) which made me scratch my head when the product was released. But of course they keep harping on the quality of their pres and eqs...

So where does the Zed R-16 stand? The thing that gets me excited is it does 18 in and 18 out to and from DAW (plus additional ADAT streams in certain sample rates). I am still not so sure what its MIDI ctrl is capable of doing as tactile control, but to me that does not affect it's positioning. Because it addresses squarely the wish for people who wish to use a mixing board as an analog tracking and mixing platform, and yet have the DAW for a recording "medium", plugins for efx and ITB automation. It is very clearly appealing to those who wants the cake and eat it, like me

I get ITB recallability and micro accuracy in tweaking and automation, yet I can pass it through an analog board to use outboard fx, analog eq and analog summing and record it back again through the master buss. And I think A&H cleverly designed it with serious project studios (read: those which actually rents out its rooms by hour, albeit at a budget price point) in mind by rounding up with the most important feature: its looks and size.

No offence to the other 3 manufacturers or the capability of their products, but if you place those other 3 products in a project studio, your clients will perceive your place as a home studio trying to make some side income. But if you place the Zed R16 as the centrepiece in your ctrl room, given its size, look and brand reputation, people will get the impression it is a serious mid budget setup maintained to offer recording services. It's that obvious to me

Add some nice affordable outboard pieces and some preamps via ext ADC and ADAT and you have a winner. The rest of the features are just (very nice) icing on the cake IMO

(no, I don't work for them)

sirthought · 20th June 2008, 08:29 AM

Some very good points, Saudade.

I seem to take the Onyx out of the running for the very reasons you gave. It's not flexible enough and I've heard about too many problems with the functionality it does offer.

But I'm wondering if you're leaning away from the StudioLive and n12 mainly because they are digital? Is there something wrong with that? They don't really look that different from the ZED.

StudioLive IS targeted more as a live mixer, but I think a lot of folks will find it attractive because of how simple it seems to use. Fast workflow. Plus, for many the DSP effects on it may have them recording more than crashing on the computer. I also like the sound of Presonus pres for a lot of things. Yeah, you can argue that they aren't high end, but they work for a lot of situations and you could insert outboard gear if necessary. Good engineers make their equipment work for for them.

The n12 does tout the close Cubase integration, but I'm wondering if that is just what their marketers chose to spin. I mean, it's mainly from two areas. First, the templates they've created give you no-brainer setups to get your tracks working with the board. A&H could make the same templates. Second, the transport, monitoring, and other little niceities are really just MIDI controls programmed well for Cubase. I'm guessing an advanced user could duplicate it for other DAWs.

I also wonder why A&H hasn't played up more of the relationship with Sonar in the way Yamaha has with Cubase, because it really seems to be a good selling point. I imagine with the extra MIDI controls you could do all of the features the n12 has (except maybe the mute and dimmer volume) and MORE. But, please please please, show us some examples of how to integrate it so we don't have to think about that and can focus on creating music.

But Yamaha has really gone to great lengths to tout the n12's pres and the sound of the board. It's getting nothing but glowing reviews for it's sound. And if it does sound good, then I'd think keeping your signal within the digital realm would be ideal. The fewer times you have to run things through a converter the better, right?

I'm also not hearing enough from A&H's marketing copy about latency when using plugs while recording. This is a big claim from the n12 that you can monitor your plugs from the DAW as you record, which really isn't heard of with other options in this price range.

Me, I've never used an analog board myself for any period of time. I've recorded in studios that have them, but I don't have the experience to say why it's better over today's digital mixers. I know that the complaints over digital recording through the years has been that it's cold and has no feel. But that seems to be something that's improving vastly. Correct me if I'm wrong on this.

I'm excited to learn more and hopefully see this board soon. I did see it for sale today on a site from the UK. If it's selling here with a straight conversion from British pounds to dollars then it's going to be $3K+, which is too rich for me right now.

jeronimo · 22nd June 2008, 03:37 AM

As far as I know, Onyx mixers don´t have nothing but 2 ch FW returns...

sirthought · 25th June 2008, 10:07 PM

So guys!

Why all the secrecy?

What's the U.S. price and when should we see it in stores?

Saudade · 26th June 2008, 04:44 AM

Looks like you're in serious contemplation to purchase it

I'd better stop looking at the pictures...cos something like this is closer to my budget :

Helix Board 24 FireWire MKII | Mixers | 24-Input 4-Subgroup Mixer with DFX & FireWire Interface

soundrage · 28th June 2008, 12:01 AM

Nice looking board, but 60mm faders? I don't get that.

dougb415 · 28th June 2008, 12:55 PM

So instead of buying a controller, preamps and an interface, I could just get this one box? If an MCU is around $1400, RME Fireface is $1600, and let's just say an API 4-ch pre around $1600, that comes up to $4600. This box looks like it'll be somewhere between $3200-3600. Still a good grand cheaper. I hope there's a dealer in Nashville where I can check one out in person (eventually).

jeronimo · 28th June 2008, 01:00 PM

it doesn't have moving faders... so it won't fill the controler spot...

dougb415 · 28th June 2008, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeronimo

it doesn't have moving faders... so it won't fill the controler spot...

I'm not sure that no automized faders is a deal breaker for me. I've never had them before, don't have them now.

jeronimo · 28th June 2008, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dougb415

I'm not sure that no automized faders is a deal breaker for me. I've never had them before, don't have them now.

then why did you mentioned the MCU?

don't bother answering this.

malekmusic · 28th June 2008, 06:34 PM

well i think A&H made up their minds and came up with an amazing idea!

this board is exactly what a lot of project studios would like to have. and if i hadnt got a tegeler tube summerizer i would definatly this baby.

first i dont think the fact that you work on an analog board and need to convert your signal to be a problem at all. to be honest i really think just to summeriz analog makes a huge difference at least to me!

second the lack of moving faders wouldnt bother me, still you can automate youre channels, and you would just to move the fader to the right spot to move the fader in your DAW, which i believe is not a problem at all.

third it looks sexy.

i hope this baby sounds as good as it looks, if it does im sure A&H will sell a lot of these babies.

dougb415 · 28th June 2008, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeronimo

then why did you mentioned the MCU?

don't bother answering this.

What? Ask a question, and then say "don't answer"?

If your definition of controller must include automated faders, then replace "MCU" (which I was only using as an example) with "mixing board" or something similar that doesn't bother you as much. And as malekmusic said:

"the lack of moving faders wouldn't bother me, still you can automate your channels, and you would just to move the fader to the right spot to move the fader in your DAW, which i believe is not a problem at all."

Doesn't that accomplish the same thing as automated faders?

dougb415 · 2nd July 2008, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirthought

want to plug a MIDI keyboard into the ZED R16 board, pull a virtual instrument from the PC, and record that to a DAW. That sounds impossible w/o a MIDI in.

Get a separate MIDI box to hook to your PC. That's what I'm planning on doing.

jfz · 16th July 2008, 09:15 PM

AlienHealth,

I would like to ask you if there is a plan to expand the ZED-R line. I'm choosing what equipment to buy and I'm very delighted with the fact that ZED went multichanel. But ZED-R16 is too big for me, and I would be interested in something more compact, something like ZED-14 is.
Should I wait (for some weeks), or should I buy something other?

Thanks a lot.

sirthought · 16th July 2008, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfz

AlienHealth,

I would like to ask you if there is a plan to expand the ZED-R line. I'm choosing what equipment to buy and I'm very delighted with the fact that ZED went multichanel. But ZED-R16 is too big for me, and I would be interested in something more compact, something like ZED-14 is.
Should I wait (for some weeks), or should I buy something other?

Thanks a lot.

Well, there hasn't even been an official release of this in the States, yet. No price or release date. I doubt they're publicly discussing newer models at this point.

Have you looked at the Yamaha n8 or n12? The Korg Zero4 or Zero8? Presonus StudioLive?
One of those might do the trick.

Phillystylec · 16th July 2008, 10:45 PM

this thing looks pretty cool, but let me see if I am understanding this.

you get 16 channels to and FROM the computer. So you can record up to 16 channels at a time, but if you want to mix more than 16 at a time you would have to do subgroups or mix the first 16 then the next 16 and so on?

It has ADAT, but you can't use it if you are using all 16 FW channels?

The faders aren't motorized but are all of them midi controllers for the daw? or is it only the section that has the transport controls? I don't see not having motors as an issue if all the faders on the board can be used to control something. Also, if the faders are midi capable, then are the EQ pots? Can they be assigned to different tasks? (i.e. you have recorded your tracks, and now you are mixing and you have a reverb plugin on that track, can you assign an eq knob to control knee, or delay time?)

jfz · 16th July 2008, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirthought

Well, there hasn't even been an official release of this in the States, yet. No price or release date. I doubt they're publicly discussing newer models at this point.

Have you looked at the Yamaha n8 or n12? The Korg Zero4 or Zero8? Presonus StudioLive?
One of those might do the trick.

As I was tracking releasing of ZEDs, appearing of individual models seemed to me sudden and unexpected but continuing with short intervals. and they appeared same way in shops.
I just hope it will not stop before "my" model will be released ;-)

Thanks for your proposals anyway. But usualy these things are too expensive and/or insufficient. Especially digital consoles. Only other suitable solution for me is combination of FW/USB i/o and regular mix. I was thinking about M-audio NRV10 or Alesis MultiMix 16 USB 2.0, but I'm really unsure about its reliability.

"plan B" is motu ultralite + some mackie or tapco mix

Phillystylec · 16th July 2008, 11:07 PM

Ok, so I just read the manual. This thing is awesome. There are million options and I answered my own questions. I wish there was a mute/solo/arm button on the board. But this thing has some potential!

sirthought · 17th July 2008, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfz

As I was tracking releasing of ZEDs, appearing of individual models seemed to me sudden and unexpected but continuing with short intervals. and they appeared same way in shops.
I just hope it will not stop before "my" model will be released ;-)

Thanks for your proposals anyway. But usualy these things are too expensive and/or insufficient. Especially digital consoles. Only other suitable solution for me is combination of FW/USB i/o and regular mix. I was thinking about M-audio NRV10 or Alesis MultiMix 16 USB 2.0, but I'm really unsure about its reliability.

"plan B" is motu ultralite + some mackie or tapco mix

The pres on the Yamaha will beat a lot of what's out there. The reviews on the sound of this board have been nothing but positive, plus like with the Zen, you can mix what's coming out of the DAW... just fewer channels. It also has excellent control room features, like the Zen. It's also a reasonable price. I only wish we knew what the price of the ZEN-R16 is.

The Korg, which would NOT be my choice, is an option if you really need the MIDI control aspect. The Presonus, could be a sleeper, but they aren't the most reliable of companies.

Funkster · 19th July 2008, 07:24 PM

bump for any new US release date and pricing info from anyone.

-ps - also wanted to add a welcome to Alien Health

and say how much I always appreciate companies showing there face around here once in awhile. I know to me and a lot of others it says a lot about the company.

TrackZero · 21st July 2008, 12:50 AM

Interesting product and thread! For those who have missed it there is a video presentation on the ZED R16 at Sonic State : Sonic State - News (Video Item) LIMS08: Zeds Red Baby - FireWire Red, A+H Zed R16 FireWire Recording Mixer represents good value

computa · 24th July 2008, 05:04 AM

interesting

Fausto · 24th July 2008, 11:42 AM

Thanks for the video! :)

Saudade · 24th July 2008, 12:28 PM

Tell the man IT IS GOING TO BE POPULAR!!! Go ahead and make 24 and 32 ch versions!

If you read the manual it is really a very well thought out product that truly integrates analog and ITB. The line between what is hardware and what is software is virtually dissolved, when you can use the EQ on the board and software plugins at the same time while mixing.

The number of ways it allows you to route the signal from hardware to software and back again really beats having to think about things like hooking up pieces of outboard to interface, D/A to A/D, which channel, which input, which output, which send, which return, what to mute to avoid feedback loop, print it or route it live....all the tedious things that make integrating hardware in ITB mixing such a pain in the ass for lazy bums like me, even when I know of its possible sonic enhancements if done correctly. With this you can have 16 channels of decent eq at your disposal, or add some hardware compressors at the inserts, sum a stem mix etc.....fluid workflow.

I really should stop looking at it since I can't afford it.....

I shall console myself by saying I'll save up for a 24 ch version

(no, I don't work for them)

sirthought · 26th July 2008, 12:11 AM

We don't even know how much it costs! When are they going to release this?

It's kind of weird. Has anyone purchased this over in Europe?
Any reports on performance or problems?

SidGuatama · 26th July 2008, 03:00 PM

I have been patiently saving for a Toft ATB. Combine that with the cost of 16 channels of AD/DA conversion, and I was looking at roughly $5,500 to $6,000. For me, the ZED would be a perfect alternative for (what I'm assuming will be) a lot less money. It almost makes me upset that I recently pulled the trigger on something else. Although, it looks like the ADAT I/O will allow me to integrate the ZED into my setup without making me feel like my new interface is now obsolete. My only concern is the lack of a word clock. Will this sync to other digital gear via ADAT?

I'm hearing a lot of talk about a lack of motorized faders. Personally, this doesn't really effect me in the slightest. I like to use the DAW fader to initially write automation envelopes. But then I switch to trim/read mode (I use REAPER

) so that I can still use the fader as a trim adjustment for the envelope as a whole. I don't like moving faders. But I have ADD, and I'm easily distracted...YMMV. So at least for me, it looks like the ZED would work exactly how I would want it to, right out of the box.

tsvisser · 26th July 2008, 04:59 PM

I think that the limitation with the lack of motorized faders limits its usefulness as a control surface. When you change the focus of the faders some something inside your DAW, suddenly you are faced with the fact that your physical fader position is not synced up with the software position of the fader. This means likely that no changes are made until you write a change on the physical fader... so in order to start working, you have to then physically move the fader, keeping track of its original software position, until they match up. Or... face the possibility of accidentally writing fader changes while working if you accidentally bump something.

I would really like to see an 8x4x2 implementation of this design (with optional rackmount ears please) that costs in the same ballpark as this model with all faders motorized. It could even cost a little bit more. This would be more useful in my mind because then it comes into its own as a true controller for your DAW. As it stand now, I think it is an excellent recording interface, analog board, but with limited controller capabilities due to the lack of motofadification.

SidGuatama · 27th July 2008, 03:20 AM

I agree with you 100%, and if I were intending to use the ZED as a control surface, your points would be a major concern. But like I said, I can physically write the automation with the DAW and then use the channel faders on the ZED as a trim for the envelope as a whole. This exactly how I already work in REAPER. Quite frankly, I don't see how this is much different from any other analog console without motorized faders used for OTB summing and mixing...it just happens that the tape returns can be fed via ADAT or Firewire instead of balanced 1/4" jacks.

Again, I'm looking at this as a comparative option to a Toft ATB-16. So my point of reference might be different. Perhaps, I'm grossly oversimplifying things, but from what I understand, the ZED isn't really a "digital mixer". It's an analog mixer with some nice digital I/O options.

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20th June 2008, 07:38 AM	#33
Saudade Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Birthplace of the Soundblaster Posts: 331	tsvisser, I guess every user would want a new product to lean more to their style of workflow, but I think whether a product will sell or not depends a lot on the positioning or it's target market, and how much they are willing to pay for the feature set. Here is how I see the 3 similar products I mentioned: The Studiolive is a digital mixer. It boasts its DSP for digital effects (including compressors) for every channel. Personally, other than live purposes, I don't see any advantage of having a digital mixer to mixdown recordings nowadays, especially if it doesn't have motorised fader (left out due to the price). Why would anyone want to route streams from the computer back into a digital mixer to mix with its proprietary onboard fx eludes me , especially nowadays DAW plugins are getting more and better by the day, many high quality ones are priced very low (sub $50) The N12's eq, compressor and reverb are also digital, but it has only 8 pres. It boasts the "one function per knob" integration with Cubase AI, very deep integration that even lets you control the metronome level from a knob. It returns from DAW the same number of channels it can record to it. But again hardware mixing's appeal is questionable since it is a digital mixer. But the clear selling point is integration with Cubase AI. The Onyx 1640 is arguably the closest in form to the Zed, with 16 pres and analog EQ. But its workflow is more leaning towards using it as a tracking mixer, then mix/sum ITB, given that it only can return 2 channels playback from DAW, a feature (or lack thereof) which made me scratch my head when the product was released. But of course they keep harping on the quality of their pres and eqs... So where does the Zed R-16 stand? The thing that gets me excited is it does 18 in and 18 out to and from DAW (plus additional ADAT streams in certain sample rates). I am still not so sure what its MIDI ctrl is capable of doing as tactile control, but to me that does not affect it's positioning. Because it addresses squarely the wish for people who wish to use a mixing board as an analog tracking and mixing platform, and yet have the DAW for a recording "medium", plugins for efx and ITB automation. It is very clearly appealing to those who wants the cake and eat it, like me I get ITB recallability and micro accuracy in tweaking and automation, yet I can pass it through an analog board to use outboard fx, analog eq and analog summing and record it back again through the master buss. And I think A&H cleverly designed it with serious project studios (read: those which actually rents out its rooms by hour, albeit at a budget price point) in mind by rounding up with the most important feature: its looks and size. No offence to the other 3 manufacturers or the capability of their products, but if you place those other 3 products in a project studio, your clients will perceive your place as a home studio trying to make some side income. But if you place the Zed R16 as the centrepiece in your ctrl room, given its size, look and brand reputation, people will get the impression it is a serious mid budget setup maintained to offer recording services. It's that obvious to me Add some nice affordable outboard pieces and some preamps via ext ADC and ADAT and you have a winner. The rest of the features are just (very nice) icing on the cake IMO (no, I don't work for them) __________________ "If the human mind was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it." - Emerson Pugh

20th June 2008, 08:29 AM	#34
sirthought Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 137	Some very good points, Saudade. I seem to take the Onyx out of the running for the very reasons you gave. It's not flexible enough and I've heard about too many problems with the functionality it does offer. But I'm wondering if you're leaning away from the StudioLive and n12 mainly because they are digital? Is there something wrong with that? They don't really look that different from the ZED. StudioLive IS targeted more as a live mixer, but I think a lot of folks will find it attractive because of how simple it seems to use. Fast workflow. Plus, for many the DSP effects on it may have them recording more than crashing on the computer. I also like the sound of Presonus pres for a lot of things. Yeah, you can argue that they aren't high end, but they work for a lot of situations and you could insert outboard gear if necessary. Good engineers make their equipment work for for them. The n12 does tout the close Cubase integration, but I'm wondering if that is just what their marketers chose to spin. I mean, it's mainly from two areas. First, the templates they've created give you no-brainer setups to get your tracks working with the board. A&H could make the same templates. Second, the transport, monitoring, and other little niceities are really just MIDI controls programmed well for Cubase. I'm guessing an advanced user could duplicate it for other DAWs. I also wonder why A&H hasn't played up more of the relationship with Sonar in the way Yamaha has with Cubase, because it really seems to be a good selling point. I imagine with the extra MIDI controls you could do all of the features the n12 has (except maybe the mute and dimmer volume) and MORE. But, please please please, show us some examples of how to integrate it so we don't have to think about that and can focus on creating music. But Yamaha has really gone to great lengths to tout the n12's pres and the sound of the board. It's getting nothing but glowing reviews for it's sound. And if it does sound good, then I'd think keeping your signal within the digital realm would be ideal. The fewer times you have to run things through a converter the better, right? I'm also not hearing enough from A&H's marketing copy about latency when using plugs while recording. This is a big claim from the n12 that you can monitor your plugs from the DAW as you record, which really isn't heard of with other options in this price range. Me, I've never used an analog board myself for any period of time. I've recorded in studios that have them, but I don't have the experience to say why it's better over today's digital mixers. I know that the complaints over digital recording through the years has been that it's cold and has no feel. But that seems to be something that's improving vastly. Correct me if I'm wrong on this. I'm excited to learn more and hopefully see this board soon. I did see it for sale today on a site from the UK. If it's selling here with a straight conversion from British pounds to dollars then it's going to be $3K+, which is too rich for me right now. Last edited by sirthought; 20th June 2008 at 08:31 AM. Reason: spelling

22nd June 2008, 03:37 AM	#35
jeronimo Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Salvador, BA - Brazil Posts: 2,382	As far as I know, Onyx mixers don´t have nothing but 2 ch FW returns... __________________ Think Diferente! www.verticeestudio.com http://www.myspace.com/jelmet

26th June 2008, 04:44 AM	#37
Saudade Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Birthplace of the Soundblaster Posts: 331	Looks like you're in serious contemplation to purchase it I'd better stop looking at the pictures...cos something like this is closer to my budget : Helix Board 24 FireWire MKII \| Mixers \| 24-Input 4-Subgroup Mixer with DFX & FireWire Interface __________________ "If the human mind was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it." - Emerson Pugh

20th June 2008, 12:30 AM	#31
sirthought Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 137	tsvisser, You may really want to look at Yamaha 01v96v2, as you can get the motorized faders with that, plus a choice of connection options. Once you start shopping for all of those desired features, that seems to be the lowest price point manufacturers are offering. Also, the gear I use is still a Roland 2480, but I use it as a controller with the aid of a Presonus V-Fire. I can use the Roland's automation if I want or I can mix in the DAW.

20th June 2008, 12:56 AM	#32
tsvisser Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NYC and HI Posts: 588	I never really used Yamaha equipment before, and don't necessarily know that I trust the sound quality. Hey, I do like the fact that the Allen & Heath is a trusty old analog board, one of its major positive features, but the Yamaha does look quite interesting too... combined with a MADI card and maybe an RME RAYDAT it would make an excellent portable solution. On the other hand, I've owned Allen & Heath gear before and have always been more than satisfied with their build and sound quality. Does anyone else find it odd that the Yamaha board doesn't have dedicated DAW transport keys, since it is marketed as a controller? I guess you could assign the flexible keys, but it seems odd to me.

25th June 2008, 10:07 PM	#36
sirthought Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 137	So guys! Why all the secrecy? What's the U.S. price and when should we see it in stores?

28th June 2008, 12:01 AM	#38
soundrage Gear addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 333	Nice looking board, but 60mm faders? I don't get that.

28th June 2008, 12:55 PM	#39
dougb415 Gear maniac Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Huntsville AL Posts: 238	So instead of buying a controller, preamps and an interface, I could just get this one box? If an MCU is around $1400, RME Fireface is $1600, and let's just say an API 4-ch pre around $1600, that comes up to $4600. This box looks like it'll be somewhere between $3200-3600. Still a good grand cheaper. I hope there's a dealer in Nashville where I can check one out in person (eventually).

28th June 2008, 01:00 PM	#40
jeronimo Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Salvador, BA - Brazil Posts: 2,382	it doesn't have moving faders... so it won't fill the controler spot... __________________ Think Diferente! www.verticeestudio.com http://www.myspace.com/jelmet

28th June 2008, 06:34 PM	#43
malekmusic Gear nut Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Germany, Duesseldorf Posts: 84	well i think A&H made up their minds and came up with an amazing idea! this board is exactly what a lot of project studios would like to have. and if i hadnt got a tegeler tube summerizer i would definatly this baby. first i dont think the fact that you work on an analog board and need to convert your signal to be a problem at all. to be honest i really think just to summeriz analog makes a huge difference at least to me! second the lack of moving faders wouldnt bother me, still you can automate youre channels, and you would just to move the fader to the right spot to move the fader in your DAW, which i believe is not a problem at all. third it looks sexy. i hope this baby sounds as good as it looks, if it does im sure A&H will sell a lot of these babies.

16th July 2008, 09:15 PM	#46
jfz Gear interested Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 2	AlienHealth, I would like to ask you if there is a plan to expand the ZED-R line. I'm choosing what equipment to buy and I'm very delighted with the fact that ZED went multichanel. But ZED-R16 is too big for me, and I would be interested in something more compact, something like ZED-14 is. Should I wait (for some weeks), or should I buy something other? Thanks a lot.

16th July 2008, 10:45 PM	#48
Phillystylec Gear interested Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 29	this thing looks pretty cool, but let me see if I am understanding this. you get 16 channels to and FROM the computer. So you can record up to 16 channels at a time, but if you want to mix more than 16 at a time you would have to do subgroups or mix the first 16 then the next 16 and so on? It has ADAT, but you can't use it if you are using all 16 FW channels? The faders aren't motorized but are all of them midi controllers for the daw? or is it only the section that has the transport controls? I don't see not having motors as an issue if all the faders on the board can be used to control something. Also, if the faders are midi capable, then are the EQ pots? Can they be assigned to different tasks? (i.e. you have recorded your tracks, and now you are mixing and you have a reverb plugin on that track, can you assign an eq knob to control knee, or delay time?)

16th July 2008, 11:07 PM	#50
Phillystylec Gear interested Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 29	Ok, so I just read the manual. This thing is awesome. There are million options and I answered my own questions. I wish there was a mute/solo/arm button on the board. But this thing has some potential!

19th July 2008, 07:24 PM	#52
Funkster Gear maniac Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 154	bump for any new US release date and pricing info from anyone. -ps - also wanted to add a welcome to Alien Health and say how much I always appreciate companies showing there face around here once in awhile. I know to me and a lot of others it says a lot about the company. __________________ Mark Everetts FunkyLoft.com myspace.com/markeveretts

21st July 2008, 12:50 AM	#53
TrackZero Gear interested Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 11	Interesting product and thread! For those who have missed it there is a video presentation on the ZED R16 at Sonic State : Sonic State - News (Video Item) LIMS08: Zeds Red Baby - FireWire Red, A+H Zed R16 FireWire Recording Mixer represents good value

24th July 2008, 05:04 AM	#54
computa Lives for gear Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 781	interesting

24th July 2008, 11:42 AM	#55
Fausto Gear interested Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Rio, Brazil Posts: 20	Thanks for the video! :)

24th July 2008, 12:28 PM	#56
Saudade Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Birthplace of the Soundblaster Posts: 331	Tell the man IT IS GOING TO BE POPULAR!!! Go ahead and make 24 and 32 ch versions! If you read the manual it is really a very well thought out product that truly integrates analog and ITB. The line between what is hardware and what is software is virtually dissolved, when you can use the EQ on the board and software plugins at the same time while mixing. The number of ways it allows you to route the signal from hardware to software and back again really beats having to think about things like hooking up pieces of outboard to interface, D/A to A/D, which channel, which input, which output, which send, which return, what to mute to avoid feedback loop, print it or route it live....all the tedious things that make integrating hardware in ITB mixing such a pain in the ass for lazy bums like me, even when I know of its possible sonic enhancements if done correctly. With this you can have 16 channels of decent eq at your disposal, or add some hardware compressors at the inserts, sum a stem mix etc.....fluid workflow. I really should stop looking at it since I can't afford it..... I shall console myself by saying I'll save up for a 24 ch version (no, I don't work for them) __________________ "If the human mind was simple enough to understand, we'd be too simple to understand it." - Emerson Pugh

26th July 2008, 12:11 AM	#57
sirthought Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 137	We don't even know how much it costs! When are they going to release this? It's kind of weird. Has anyone purchased this over in Europe? Any reports on performance or problems?

26th July 2008, 03:00 PM	#58
SidGuatama Gear interested Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 11	I have been patiently saving for a Toft ATB. Combine that with the cost of 16 channels of AD/DA conversion, and I was looking at roughly $5,500 to $6,000. For me, the ZED would be a perfect alternative for (what I'm assuming will be) a lot less money. It almost makes me upset that I recently pulled the trigger on something else. Although, it looks like the ADAT I/O will allow me to integrate the ZED into my setup without making me feel like my new interface is now obsolete. My only concern is the lack of a word clock. Will this sync to other digital gear via ADAT? I'm hearing a lot of talk about a lack of motorized faders. Personally, this doesn't really effect me in the slightest. I like to use the DAW fader to initially write automation envelopes. But then I switch to trim/read mode (I use REAPER ) so that I can still use the fader as a trim adjustment for the envelope as a whole. I don't like moving faders. But I have ADD, and I'm easily distracted...YMMV. So at least for me, it looks like the ZED would work exactly how I would want it to, right out of the box. Last edited by SidGuatama; 26th July 2008 at 03:03 PM. Reason: grammar/continuity

26th July 2008, 04:59 PM	#59
tsvisser Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NYC and HI Posts: 588	I think that the limitation with the lack of motorized faders limits its usefulness as a control surface. When you change the focus of the faders some something inside your DAW, suddenly you are faced with the fact that your physical fader position is not synced up with the software position of the fader. This means likely that no changes are made until you write a change on the physical fader... so in order to start working, you have to then physically move the fader, keeping track of its original software position, until they match up. Or... face the possibility of accidentally writing fader changes while working if you accidentally bump something. I would really like to see an 8x4x2 implementation of this design (with optional rackmount ears please) that costs in the same ballpark as this model with all faders motorized. It could even cost a little bit more. This would be more useful in my mind because then it comes into its own as a true controller for your DAW. As it stand now, I think it is an excellent recording interface, analog board, but with limited controller capabilities due to the lack of motofadification.

27th July 2008, 03:20 AM	#60
SidGuatama Gear interested Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 11	I agree with you 100%, and if I were intending to use the ZED as a control surface, your points would be a major concern. But like I said, I can physically write the automation with the DAW and then use the channel faders on the ZED as a trim for the envelope as a whole. This exactly how I already work in REAPER. Quite frankly, I don't see how this is much different from any other analog console without motorized faders used for OTB summing and mixing...it just happens that the tape returns can be fed via ADAT or Firewire instead of balanced 1/4" jacks. Again, I'm looking at this as a comparative option to a Toft ATB-16. So my point of reference might be different. Perhaps, I'm grossly oversimplifying things, but from what I understand, the ZED isn't really a "digital mixer". It's an analog mixer with some nice digital I/O options.