ProFire 2626

[brendley]

Originally Posted by mortimer

The Profire has 26 ins and 26 outs (hence the 2626). 8 of the IO has built in A/D D/A converters. The means the one unit has 8 analog inputs (mic/line inputs), and 8 analog outputs (line out). The rest of the inputs are accessible through two sets of ADAT ins and outs (four optical ports. 2x 8ch in and 2x 8ch out). The two last IO are S/PDIF digital IOs, the kind you find on MiniDisc, CD players etc.

The Profire 2626 can also operate "standalone", that is not connected via firewire to a computer. This means that you can get one or two EXTRA Profires, and configure them to behave as the extra AD/DAs needed to "expand" the first Profire to have 24 analog inputs and outputs. See what I mean?
As far as alternative AD/DAs, I'm not the right guy to answer this. My budget pointed me towards the 2626, it seems to be a flexible unit for a reasonable price, and many seem to be very happy with the quality of the preamps. If I'm not much mistaken, you can get pure ADAT AD converters with no pres (only line in) that cost way beyond what the 2626 costs, but I really don't have any idea how much better these are in comparison.

As for cost, sticking to the Profire 2626 only, you'd have 24 ins and 24 outs for the price of three Profire 2626, four TOSLINK optical cables (and maybe some coaxial cables for the PLL clock syncing between the units. Not sure if you need 2 or 4 of those). As I am in Norway, I doubt that any price I could come up with would benefit you :)

Hope this helps, man

Thanks Mortimer Makes perfect sense now...

So guys help me out..

Is there a stand alone 8 ch Adat ad/da line in converter cheaper and of similar quality to the profire????

Your help is greatly apprecciatted.

BA

[d4n]

I've got the Behringer ADA 8000 (yeah, I know, the B-word ) in use as a live drums preamp with a 01v96. Should be somewhere around 250 bucks.
I'd imagine there's not too much difference in sound quality, haven't compared them directly yet.

With the money saved, you can still look for a higher quality SPDIF preamp for critical signals.

[mortimer]

Originally Posted by brendley

Is there a stand alone 8 ch Adat ad/da line in converter cheaper and of similar quality to the profire????

I have by no means the ability to make this an absolute statement, but after having looked around some for extra converters for adding to the Profire:
I cannot find anything that's cheaper than the Profire, that will do 24bit 96kHz sound. Anyone else? Are they comparable?

Have a nice weekend, everyone!

[Dean7]

Originally Posted by brendley

Thanks Mortimer Makes perfect sense now...

So guys help me out..

Is there a stand alone 8 ch Adat ad/da line in converter cheaper and of similar quality to the profire????

Your help is greatly apprecciatted.

BA

You might be able to pick up an older Apogee unit, like the AD16 (not AD16X):

Apogee AD16 Analog to Digital Converter AD-16 - eBay (item 200223975646 end time May-20-08 18:00:55 PDT)

Otherwise, I think th 2626 is about as good as it gets for bang for the buck. :)

[breathsavers]

Just to add another positive review, I started using my Profire on Monday to record my band's demo, and it has worked beautifully with my Macbook and Logic Pro 8.

[JonesH]

I could be misunderstanding or unfamiliar with prices in your region, but isn't the PreSonus FS cheap enough? And it does 96 kHz operation (whatever you'd want that for, anyways...).

[Dean7]

Originally Posted by JonesH

I could be misunderstanding or unfamiliar with prices in your region, but isn't the PreSonus FS cheap enough? And it does 96 kHz operation (whatever you'd want that for, anyways...).

I thought the PreSonus FS was well-known as a somewhat unstable unit with bad conversion, though. Am I wrong about that?

[mortimer]

Originally Posted by Dean7

I thought the PreSonus FS was well-known as a somewhat unstable unit with bad conversion, though. Am I wrong about that?

Whatever it is, it's about 900 NOK (180 USD) more than the M-Audio unit.

[breathsavers]

Originally Posted by Dean7

I thought the PreSonus FS was well-known as a somewhat unstable unit with bad conversion, though. Am I wrong about that?

I bought a Firestudio and it never worked. I traded for the 2626 and it's been great. just my 2 cents.

[Dean7]

Originally Posted by breathsavers

I bought a Firestudio and it never worked. I traded for the 2626 and it's been great. just my 2 cents.

Cool. Yeah, I've heard that the FS drivers are such total and complete crap that it's pretty much unusable. I guess if it was operating in stand-alone mode that might be OK if the hardware itself is solid, but from what I've also heard the conversion on the FS isn't great and neither are the pres.

But, since the FS is more money than the 2626 and the guy was looking for a cheaper alternative, I guess I'm getting off-track here. :D

[JonesH]

Sorry, I was unclear. I am, of course, referring to the Presonus Digimax FS, not the FireStudio. Apologies.

The Digimax FS has received good reviews, and at $599 (Sweetwater) retails at $100 lower than the 2626. On the other hand, buying another set of 2626 also gives you a backup interface should the primary fail. The FS unit does give you a set of direct outs AND DA outs, though, whereas the 2626 only does 8 analog out.

[Dean7]

Originally Posted by JonesH

Sorry, I was unclear. I am, of course, referring to the Presonus Digimax FS, not the FireStudio. Apologies.

The Digimax FS has received good reviews, and at $599 (Sweetwater) retails at $100 lower than the 2626. On the other hand, buying another set of 2626 also gives you a backup interface should the primary fail. The FS unit does give you a set of direct outs AND DA outs, though, whereas the 2626 only does 8 analog out.

Yeah, I guess that's an OK option. Sorry, I didn't realize which unit you were talking about!

[mortimer]

Originally Posted by Dean7

Yeah, I guess that's an OK option. Sorry, I didn't realize which unit you were talking about!

Me neither. I have to say, though. Given the relatively small difference in price between the Digimax FS and the Profire 2626, the "backup interface" point is a valid one in my eyes. Or for taking it on the road without 100% crippling the studio, if that is needed.

[djivano]

Originally Posted by mlange

GREAT NEWS - Just had an outstanding series of calls from Calvin Banks of M-Audio.... what a class act.

The ProFire 2626 as a product line is 100% A-OK - they just verified the TRS signal path in-house and there's no issues whatsoever with the line-level inputs!!

My unit's just malfunctioning :( - but being replaced as I type :)

For anyone who's interested, I'll post the replacement's results later this week.

Now back to your regularly scheduled program......

Hi mlange,

I just bought an 2626 and I seem to experience the same low level line inputs as you did. Is what you are saying, that I have to send it back and have it fixed cuz it's a hardware problem?
Please let me know how your returned 2626 behaves.

thanx, djivano

[breathsavers]

Originally Posted by JonesH

Sorry, I was unclear. I am, of course, referring to the Presonus Digimax FS, not the FireStudio. Apologies.

I was just saying that to comment on Presonus's reliability and drivers. But the FS has had more time to get the kinks worked out I guess.

[mlange]

Originally Posted by djivano

Hi mlange,

I just bought an 2626 and I seem to experience the same low level line inputs as you did. Is what you are saying, that I have to send it back and have it fixed cuz it's a hardware problem?
Please let me know how your returned 2626 behaves.

thanx, djivano

OK - Success - here's the whole skinny:

First and foremost, there is nothing wrong with the 2626 - the guys at M-Audio tech support have gone out-of-their-way to follow through with this testing.

A sine wave, by it's very nature, does not have any transients whatsoever..... therefore, when measuring a 1K +4dBu sine wave signal into many "classic" analog VU meters, this will result in a 0 reading. These meters present the average level of the input signal.

The identical signal, (again, a sine wave - no transients [ie, peaks], right?) injected into PT yields -18dbfs, as the channel's segment meters are peak meters. The peak meter has absolutely no transient peak material to detect.

Now taking the identical signal path, we'll use program material - say a bass guitar - and adjust it for a nominal 0 level on a "classic" analog VU meter. When this signal is inputted into PT, the PT channel meter will display something fairly close to the analog meter's level.

There is no issue with the metering levels: the difference in the tests is the program material's transients. Sine waves have no spiked transients, and in this example, our bass guitar certainly does.

And the above principles held true on every system we tested, including an fully-loaded HD3 rig. The HD3's headroom values were virtually identical to the ProFire 2626's. This speaks quite highly to the 2626's design.

While various metering plugs (Bomb Factory, Waves, etc) may *look* like an analog VU meter, the user must select average, rms, peak, etc. in order to change the response style/curve of the meter. Regardless of the interface (how the meter *looks*), do recognize that the meter's scale determines its' ballistics.

The other intermittent issues with our 2626 was almost assuredly caused by it being man-handled by the carrier and not a reflection of the build-quality. M-Audio's done well by me.

As much time as I've spent with ours chasing this down, I can truly say that the 2626 feels solid & very well built. The software's been completely stable, too.

The other intermittent issue with our 2626 was almost assuredly caused by it being man-handled by the carrier and not a reflection of the build-quality. M-Audio's done well by me.

Hope this helps - I'm sold .... and very happy.

Now - FINALLY - back to the recording :)

[djivano]

Originally Posted by mlange

OK - Success - here's the whole skinny:

First and foremost, there is nothing wrong with the 2626 - the guys at M-Audio tech support have gone out-of-their-way to follow through with this testing.

A sine wave, by it's very nature, does not have any transients whatsoever..... therefore, when measuring a 1K +4dBu sine wave signal into many "classic" analog VU meters, this will result in a 0 reading. These meters present the average level of the input signal.

The identical signal, (again, a sine wave - no transients [ie, peaks], right?) injected into PT yields -18dbfs, as the channel's segment meters are peak meters. The peak meter has absolutely no transient peak material to detect.

Now taking the identical signal path, we'll use program material - say a bass guitar - and adjust it for a nominal 0 level on a "classic" analog VU meter. When this signal is inputted into PT, the PT channel meter will display something fairly close to the analog meter's level.

There is no issue with the metering levels: the difference in the tests is the program material's transients. Sine waves have no spiked transients, and in this example, our bass guitar certainly does.

And the above principles held true on every system we tested, including an fully-loaded HD3 rig. The HD3's headroom values were virtually identical to the ProFire 2626's. This speaks quite highly to the 2626's design.

While various metering plugs (Bomb Factory, Waves, etc) may *look* like an analog VU meter, the user must select average, rms, peak, etc. in order to change the response style/curve of the meter. Regardless of the interface (how the meter *looks*), do recognize that the meter's scale determines its' ballistics.

The other intermittent issues with our 2626 was almost assuredly caused by it being man-handled by the carrier and not a reflection of the build-quality. M-Audio's done well by me.

As much time as I've spent with ours chasing this down, I can truly say that the 2626 feels solid & very well built. The software's been completely stable, too.

The other intermittent issue with our 2626 was almost assuredly caused by it being man-handled by the carrier and not a reflection of the build-quality. M-Audio's done well by me.

Hope this helps - I'm sold .... and very happy.

Now - FINALLY - back to the recording :)

Still I'm not sure if my 2626 is okay then...

Here's the story:

Normally when I connected the outs of my Emu Virtuoso 2000 into the line-ins of my Firewire 1814 I got hot levels and I would turn the volume down on the sound module to not get any (red) clips and/or distortion. When I connect to my new 2626 and open the M-audio control panel, the meter's max. readout is approx. -18dB.
Is this normal or is this malfunction?

What seemed to be wrong with your unit then by it being man-handled by the carrier?

thx, djivano

[mlange]

Originally Posted by djivano

Still I'm not sure if my 2626 is okay then...

Here's the story:

Normally when I connected the outs of my Emu Virtuoso 2000 into the line-ins of my Firewire 1814 I got hot levels and I would turn the volume down on the sound module to not get any (red) clips and/or distortion. When I connect to my new 2626 and open the M-audio control panel, the meter's max. readout is approx. -18dB.
Is this normal or is this malfunction?

What seemed to be wrong with your unit then by it being man-handled by the carrier?

thx, djivano

djvano-

The levels going into the 1814 would appear hotter because it has unbalanced -10dBV line level inputs. The ProFire 2626 has +4dBm balanced inputs, and can therefore accept a much hotter signal. If you use an unbalanced 1/4" guitar-type cable into the 2626's balanced line inputs, I believe there's an additional 3db drop.... (anyone who wants to clarify or challange that, please feel free to chime in). All in all, you'd get a level similar to what you're describing. If it doesn't sound distorted you're probably A-OK. If you need more gain, go through one of the mic-preamps.

Our box was thrashed by the shipping co, so the 2626 wouldn't power on occasion. The other unit has *never* done this. Both units read all levels identically.

Hope this helps!

[Branislav]

Originally Posted by mortimer

The Profire 2626 can also operate "standalone", that is not connected via firewire to a computer. This means that you can get one or two EXTRA Profires, and configure them to behave as the extra AD/DAs needed to "expand" the first Profire to have 24 analog inputs and outputs.

I'm thinking of buying two 2626s and use one in stanalone mode plugged via ADAT into the other, to be able to get 16 analog I/Os at 96KHz.
Does 2626 support SMUX with PTMP, so that I can really get 16 analog I/Os at 96KHz, as this is not possible with Digi 003 and PTLE?

Branislav

[mortimer]

Originally Posted by Branislav

I'm thinking of buying two 2626s and use one in stanalone mode plugged via ADAT into the other, to be able to get 16 analog I/Os at 96KHz.
Does 2626 support SMUX with PTMP, so that I can really get 16 analog I/Os at 96KHz, as this is not possible with Digi 003 and PTLE?

Branislav

I messed around some with the settings on my 2626 last night, and it seems there are some limitations for this above 48 kHz. These limitations are likely related to the ADAT standard, but I don't have the equipment to test and haven't read up enough to say anything definitive.
Maybe some of the other guys on here can be of assistance?

BTW: Finally got the chance to do the first takes on the 2626 last night, and man am I happy with the purchase! Recordings sound (in lack of precise words) a lot better :-)
Of course I'm comparing to a smallish B*****ger Eurorack mixer with pres tapped into an inexpensive Terratec EWS88MT PCI sound card (8 unbalanced IO, no preamps) that we previously used for recording.

[studioland]

If it can help someone make his decision

I used to own a 1814 and just upgraded to the 2626.
It's way better in general sound, better ADDA conversion and decent preamps.

If you're on a budget I highly recommend this unit certainly sounds better than presonus, behringer, emu and the other ones in this price.

[djivano]

Originally Posted by mlange

Hope this helps!

THanKs

[dogbox]

Can anyone recomend a laptop that would suit the 2626?? I,m looking for a PC laptop around the $2000 mark. Any suggestions. what are others using??
cheers

[breathsavers]

Originally Posted by dogbox

Can anyone recomend a laptop that would suit the 2626?? I,m looking for a PC laptop around the $2000 mark. Any suggestions. what are others using??
cheers

I use a Macbook, but if you're going PC, you just need a fast processor and lots of RAM. Custom building would probably be cheapest, but you could build one on dell or something. i've been pretty happy with my dell desktop PC.

[crossroad]

Anyone knows if the firewire connection is 400 or 800?
Couldn't find it in the specs.

[DrSyn]

IEEE 1394a (400)

Originally Posted by crossroad

Anyone knows if the firewire connection is 400 or 800?
Couldn't find it in the specs.

[crossroad]

Thanks

[nillox]

Hi guys. first post here. im very interested in this product and plan on upgrading from my FP10 with cubase se. i was planning on getting a 003 to get back into pro tools but i dont want to spend extra money on extra pre amps, so the profire seems the perfect price for me with the perfect features.
one thing i didnt like about the FP10 was the firewire connections, they werent sunken into it, they were poking if u get me. and im always afraid i might damage them. are the profires firewire connections poking out like the FP10??
i know its only a little thing but the little things bug me.

[Dean7]

Originally Posted by nillox

Hi guys. first post here. im very interested in this product and plan on upgrading from my FP10 with cubase se. i was planning on getting a 003 to get back into pro tools but i dont want to spend extra money on extra pre amps, so the profire seems the perfect price for me with the perfect features.
one thing i didnt like about the FP10 was the firewire connections, they werent sunken into it, they were poking if u get me. and im always afraid i might damage them. are the profires firewire connections poking out like the FP10??
i know its only a little thing but the little things bug me.

The 2626 does sound like it would be perfect for you. Anyway, check this out:

M-Audio ProFire 2626 Close-Up | Sweetwater.com

I'm not sure if I understand what you're asking about the Firewire ports, but looking at that picture should clear things up for you.

[Dean7]

BTW, my friends and I did some basic testing of the 2626 vs Lucid converters (it was a friend's unit so I'm not sure but I believe it was a 88192) and they sounded identical to me (using the same mic, same pre and re-amping a guitar track). I didn't painstakingly listen back to each one over and over again (don't worry, I will soon!) yet, so perhaps that will reveal something that I missed initially.

Anyway, I want to do more testing but I'm really happy with the 2626. Figured I'd give you an update. :)