Loweing my Latency without turning my comp into a PopClick fest

ddeez · 10th November 2006

win xp
cubase sx 3
4 gigs of ram
3.4 ghz pentium
motu 24 i/o pci 424 sound card
motu 128 midi timepiece

right now i have 6.3 ms of latency...i want to chop that in half at least. How can i go about doing this?...when i halve my buffer size from 256 to 128 i start hearing clicks and pops....as it stands now there is still a noticable delay from the metronome click on my cubase to when a note plays thats supposed to fall on that metronome click.

what can i do to solve this problem?

thank you very much.

thanks for all the previous help to guys i love this board

theblue1 · 10th November 2006

That sounds like it should be a fairly strong performer.

I'm able to set the i/o buffers on my MOTU 828mkII down to 128 (but not 96) samples which generally allows a 2.9 ms monitoring buffer setting on my modest 2.8 GHz P4HT tower. (I set it higher when I'm mixing with a bunch of plugs or virtual instruments, not suprisingly.)

Since the pops and clicks you're experience are presumably related to your PC hardware and software not being able to supply the MOTU interface 'fast' enough, I'm wondering if your machine is thoroughly optimized.

Many folks have all kinds of crap running in background on their machines, everything from media player "loader/helpers" (almost always an unnecessary waste of resources, since the real rationale behind them is to get their logo into your systray) to possibly/likely ineffective anti-virus "protection." (A recent study showed that the major AV player fail to catch 80% of the most current threats -- mostly because the most current threats are the newest... AND because virus blackhatters use Norton, Macaffee, and the rest as TESTBEDs... if their new release doesn't sail past Norton, et al, then it's not ready for prime time.)

Anyhow, you probably already know all this, but I thought I'd kick it in.

You can get optimizing techniques and tips at www.MusicXP.com and www.TweakXP.com ...

iomegaman · 10th November 2006

I think the buffer size relates to how big a "bit-word" goes thru the bus.

Not sure how it works in Cubase but In Sonar you can actually make the word length BIGGER so that IO buffer loads a little bit slower but it contains more data.

The hardware user pane from your gear probably has a dma buffer that spins the wordlength off to the pci bus...maybe try setting it there instead og the audio app.

ddeez · 10th November 2006

yeah my system is pretty optimized already any other thoughts?...iomega im not sure how i would do that with my setup...any ideas?

captain caveman · 11th November 2006

The 2 biggest things you can do is to upgrade your processor and change your audio interface to a PCI one.

Firewire interfaces are total crap at low latencies compared to good PCI interfaces (ie RME or Lynx 2).

On my relatively powerful Core 2 Duo setup, my RME Fireface 400 has a "sweet spot" of 512 buffers. 256 is OK, 128 is crap, relative "number of plug-ins" speaking.

But before you expect miracles out of you setup, increasing your processing speed is THE most important thing in terms of getting more stuff going on at lower latencies.

captain caveman · 11th November 2006

ps..

bad PCI interfaces are worst than good firewire ones.

ddeez · 11th November 2006

i have a pci one...i have a motu 24i/o pci 424

iomegaman · 11th November 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddeez

i have a pci one...i have a motu 24i/o pci 424

Not sure how motu interfaces, I think your computer is plenty strong.

Does your motu have a "user panel" that allows you to set hardware routing etc...?

Somewhere in that panel it will let you set the "dma" buffers (direct memory access) to different sizes, these are usually the typical 128, 512, 764, 1024...etc sizes...it may be listed as your "ASIO buffer" size but it is the same thing...

Maybe read this article for some "beyond the basic" understanding...

filthyrich · 17th January 2007

Speaking of which; how to do you change the DMA settings for your hard drives? I've seen people speak of this in different ways, but can't seem to find the settings in my control panel. I changed the ASIO panel settings in my MOTU, but people seem convinced there's something in the hard drive setup.

I'm using Windows 64 and Sonar 64. I'm starting to think Sonar 32 is the way to go. I dunno. Glitches and pops and clicks...oh my!

10th November 2006	#1
ddeez Gear addict Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 445 Thread Starter	Loweing my Latency without turning my comp into a PopClick fest win xp cubase sx 3 4 gigs of ram 3.4 ghz pentium motu 24 i/o pci 424 sound card motu 128 midi timepiece right now i have 6.3 ms of latency...i want to chop that in half at least. How can i go about doing this?...when i halve my buffer size from 256 to 128 i start hearing clicks and pops....as it stands now there is still a noticable delay from the metronome click on my cubase to when a note plays thats supposed to fall on that metronome click. what can i do to solve this problem? thank you very much. thanks for all the previous help to guys i love this board

10th November 2006	#2
theblue1 Gear Guru Joined: Mar 2005 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 15,095	That sounds like it should be a fairly strong performer. I'm able to set the i/o buffers on my MOTU 828mkII down to 128 (but not 96) samples which generally allows a 2.9 ms monitoring buffer setting on my modest 2.8 GHz P4HT tower. (I set it higher when I'm mixing with a bunch of plugs or virtual instruments, not suprisingly.) Since the pops and clicks you're experience are presumably related to your PC hardware and software not being able to supply the MOTU interface 'fast' enough, I'm wondering if your machine is thoroughly optimized. Many folks have all kinds of crap running in background on their machines, everything from media player "loader/helpers" (almost always an unnecessary waste of resources, since the real rationale behind them is to get their logo into your systray) to possibly/likely ineffective anti-virus "protection." (A recent study showed that the major AV player fail to catch 80% of the most current threats -- mostly because the most current threats are the newest... AND because virus blackhatters use Norton, Macaffee, and the rest as TESTBEDs... if their new release doesn't sail past Norton, et al, then it's not ready for prime time.) Anyhow, you probably already know all this, but I thought I'd kick it in. You can get optimizing techniques and tips at www.MusicXP.com and www.TweakXP.com ... __________________ day job \| A Year of Songs \| music and social stuff \| mutant pop on facebook \| roots acoustic on facebook

10th November 2006	#3
iomegaman Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2003 Location: 35° 8' N 111° 40' W Posts: 854	I think the buffer size relates to how big a "bit-word" goes thru the bus. Not sure how it works in Cubase but In Sonar you can actually make the word length BIGGER so that IO buffer loads a little bit slower but it contains more data. The hardware user pane from your gear probably has a dma buffer that spins the wordlength off to the pci bus...maybe try setting it there instead og the audio app. __________________ Q:Why did the bass player break his window after he locked his keys in his car? A:To get the drummer out.

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11th November 2006	#5
captain caveman Lives for gear Joined: Sep 2005 Posts: 695	The 2 biggest things you can do is to upgrade your processor and change your audio interface to a PCI one. Firewire interfaces are total crap at low latencies compared to good PCI interfaces (ie RME or Lynx 2). On my relatively powerful Core 2 Duo setup, my RME Fireface 400 has a "sweet spot" of 512 buffers. 256 is OK, 128 is crap, relative "number of plug-ins" speaking. But before you expect miracles out of you setup, increasing your processing speed is THE most important thing in terms of getting more stuff going on at lower latencies.

17th January 2007	#9
filthyrich Lives for gear Joined: Apr 2006 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 854	Speaking of which; how to do you change the DMA settings for your hard drives? I've seen people speak of this in different ways, but can't seem to find the settings in my control panel. I changed the ASIO panel settings in my MOTU, but people seem convinced there's something in the hard drive setup. I'm using Windows 64 and Sonar 64. I'm starting to think Sonar 32 is the way to go. I dunno. Glitches and pops and clicks...oh my!