Dithering

jbuntz · 17th July 2003, 05:02 PM

I have a friend that uses Logic and says there's a huge difference upgrading from either the apogee stuff that steinberg uses or the L2's dithering feature to Logic's Pow-R dithering. I have a hard time believing that the difference could be huge based on the damned near inaudible difference from 24 to my dithered 16 bit mixes. Anybody have experience with this?

Teacher · 17th July 2003, 06:12 PM

i use the POW-R dithering in samplitude..since i've been using samplitude my mixes do sound better...but i don't think thats the reason..

Alécio Costa · 17th July 2003, 09:53 PM

It is funny. I have just written two threads at PSW ( NIka´s room) and at RO ( PLugin home) concerning plugins and dithers. A guy said I was doing damage to my job using Power dither from Digi, which is not my opinion.

So I wrote a thread at Guru Nika´s place so as to have deeper info about it. I always thought Power was quite good. So what are your opinions? I prefer digirack dither than that of MAster X and WAves.

iomegaman · 20th July 2003, 07:48 AM

Well you've got to identify your apples and your oranges here...
dithering in it's simplest definition is adding noise to your signal to smooth out truncation errors caused by changing bit rates. In a more complex discussion there are several different algorithems that will allow you to do this and avoid huge artifacts, this is where you need to decide which apple is related to what orange. I don' think you can make generalised statements comparing dithering processes without first identifying which algorithem you are talking about...you know apples to apples...

All dithering adds noise, I believe apogee is using UV22 which refers to the fact that almost all the noise added in their dither happens at 22khz (just out of earshot), this would explain a perceived difference in other dithers, but personally I would only use that dither after all other processing was done. There are differences in the way the dither algorithems sound compared to one another, but some of it is subjective.

Alécio Costa · 20th July 2003, 09:32 AM

I agree with you iomega.

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17th July 2003, 05:02 PM	#1
jbuntz Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 1,650	Dithering I have a friend that uses Logic and says there's a huge difference upgrading from either the apogee stuff that steinberg uses or the L2's dithering feature to Logic's Pow-R dithering. I have a hard time believing that the difference could be huge based on the damned near inaudible difference from 24 to my dithered 16 bit mixes. Anybody have experience with this?

17th July 2003, 06:12 PM	#2
Teacher Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: NY Posts: 1,769	i use the POW-R dithering in samplitude..since i've been using samplitude my mixes do sound better...but i don't think thats the reason.. __________________ "I hate it when they tell us how far we came to be, as if our people's history started with slavery...." Immortal Technique www.sicbeats.com

17th July 2003, 09:53 PM	#3
Alécio Costa Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Brazil, Florianópolis/SC Posts: 1,264	hi It is funny. I have just written two threads at PSW ( NIka´s room) and at RO ( PLugin home) concerning plugins and dithers. A guy said I was doing damage to my job using Power dither from Digi, which is not my opinion. So I wrote a thread at Guru Nika´s place so as to have deeper info about it. I always thought Power was quite good. So what are your opinions? I prefer digirack dither than that of MAster X and WAves. __________________ Alécio Costa Studio Music Production/Mastering http://www.aleciocosta.com Listen to my album at: http://www.audiostreet.net/artist.aspx?artistid=38915

20th July 2003, 07:48 AM	#4
iomegaman Gear addict Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: 35° 8' N 111° 40' W Posts: 365	Well you've got to identify your apples and your oranges here... dithering in it's simplest definition is adding noise to your signal to smooth out truncation errors caused by changing bit rates. In a more complex discussion there are several different algorithems that will allow you to do this and avoid huge artifacts, this is where you need to decide which apple is related to what orange. I don' think you can make generalised statements comparing dithering processes without first identifying which algorithem you are talking about...you know apples to apples... All dithering adds noise, I believe apogee is using UV22 which refers to the fact that almost all the noise added in their dither happens at 22khz (just out of earshot), this would explain a perceived difference in other dithers, but personally I would only use that dither after all other processing was done. There are differences in the way the dither algorithems sound compared to one another, but some of it is subjective. __________________ " Directly or indirectly, all questions connected with this subject must come for decision to the ear, as the organ of hearing; and from it there can be no appeal."— Lord Rayliegh

20th July 2003, 09:32 AM	#5
Alécio Costa Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Brazil, Florianópolis/SC Posts: 1,264	I agree with you iomega. __________________ Alécio Costa Studio Music Production/Mastering http://www.aleciocosta.com Listen to my album at: http://www.audiostreet.net/artist.aspx?artistid=38915

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