the ultimate Mac vs. PC slam death fest

[woodhenge]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

It's just ONE of the reasons. Macs sucks because they're overpriced computers that give you ZERO advantage over other OS's and they're definitely NOT made with better components.

So what does politics have to do with any of this?

[Fredrik]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

And no, I didn't make anything up. Read the HuffingtonPost article, it's all true. But then again, Apple fanboys don't particularly care about the REALITY OF THE FACTS...

What you made up is that I have been listening to George W Bush, or Steve Jobs. And the link is unrelated to the post you quoted, "what is a fundamentalist".

See, that is how a conversation works, you don't just throw random shit in there, unrelated to what came before. You don't know very much about the mac, that is why you never produce any ideas of your own. Just random links found with google, I could do just the same. But it's such a boring way of making conversation, using someone's else opinions, lame.

[djanthonyw]

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by djanthonyw

As I've said, I already posted WHY in this thread before:

And your silly statements were fantastically DEBUNKED one by one by another poster who clearly knows about computers more than you. Which is why I will only add a few comments to his (mine in parenthesis) :




- Core Audio / MIDI

ASIO is fine under Windows. MIDI isn't an issue, either. At least I can't remember the last time I've been running into problems.
Admittedly, something such as the IAC bus comes with OSX, but that's what virtual MIDI cable installs are for under Windows. And they're HEAPS better documented than the IAC bus.

(You never actually provided any EVIDENCE why the mac is supposedly better re: audio and MIDI.)





- I can have multiple apps open and play audio / MIDI in each of them at the same time

Must be a long time since you've used Windows, right? I could do that several years ago already.

(Exactly, and it's yet more evidence our fanboy has never actually tried Win 7.)




- OS X is based on UNIX, it's solid

Blank statement, completely invalid. My Windows machines have always been as stable as my Macs.

(Mine too.)




- If a program is having a problem or freezes it doesn't take the whole system down with it

A lie. I just had a Logic crash yesterday. Nothing helped but to press the shutdown button several seconds. There's even a message from OSX ocassionally, teling you to do just that. What do you think this message is programmed for (by Apple themselves)?

(As a former mac user, I can confirm that word by word.)




- OS X comes with apps that most people actually use, no bloat or garbage

Assumption. Absolutely irrelevant. I don't use even 20% of the apps OSX comes with.

(Our fanboy forgot to mention that gazillions of freeware apps are available for Windows, and they're only a mouse click away. You'll always find something better than what Apple gives you. Picasa is a 100 times better than iPhoto.)





- OS X is clean and uncluttered

Blank statement. Completely subjective, hence absolutely irrelevant.

(Exactly)





- OS X applications are self contained, easy installation, easy uninstallation

Showing that you have no clue. Install Logic, then remove just the .app file. After that have a look at how many GBs are left over on your system. And it doesn't come with any uninstaller.

(I think we've totally established that our fanboy is clueless. Yet more proof of that.)





- Installing / re-installing OS X doesn't require a serial number or authorization

True. A minor thing, though. I mean, how often do you reinstall your system?

(Exactly, big f***cking deal...)



- I can move apps and files around without having to deal with dependancies

Nonsense. You can do with a few (as you can under Windows), but very often you'll sacrifice some things. Such as automatic updates, which won't work for, say, any "Pro" application anymore.
And, just as an example: Under Windows I can organize my plugin folder the way I like. Impossible under OSX.

(Yep.)




- No registry

What exactly is your problem with the registry? It's growing (if you don't take care of it), so what? Under OSX, your library folders are growing.

(No registry = no customization. Mac users are like little kids, Apple would never trust them to put their hands deep into the engine...)




- No defragging

Because it's more or less happening in the background.
Yet, I may agree that it's a little advanced under OSX.

(Again, our fanboy doesn't know what he's talking about. It's idiotic to say "no defragging" and an indicator of total cluelessness. It's AUTOMATIC defragging, something I can do in Windows but would never actually dare, because I prefer manual control. Automatic defragging can actually crash your computer.)




- USB MIDI controllers and interfaces just work, OS X knows what they are the moment you plug them in, no driver installation needed

Possible under Windows ever since XP, at least in case the controllers are "class compliant" (which they need to be under OSX, too, btw.).

(Again, he has no idea how Windows works and never fails to prove it.)




- I've never dealt with one driver issue

Maybe not you. Some others did.

(This guy has a giant ego. He thinks that what allegedly happened to him is undisputable evidence of something...)





- Expose, dashboard, dock

Personal opinions. I never use Expose and Dashboard and I prefer Windows' task bar over the dock any day.

(Kid's toys.)





- You can legally run Windows along side OS X on a Mac (if you choose to)

Sure. That's because Microsoft isn't artificially limiting you to be able to run your preferred OS on one computer type only. How is that an advance of OSX at all? If at all, it's an advance of Windows.

(Of course he doesn't get it...)




- The parts are chosen by the same company the OS is from, true harmony

Complete and utter nonsense, and probably again based on whatever personal opinions. Harddrives, RAM chips, even important stuff such as FW controllers are only chosen by financial factors. Apple is using the cheapest they can get ahold of. Otherwise, try to explain why there's Macbooks of the *exact* same specification (at least from what you could see in the Apple store), just that one has a TI chipset (for the FW port), while the other one is from Lucid/Agere.

(Some fanboys actually believe that Intel makes special processors that go into macs. They're sprinkled with a magic powder that makes them better...)




- The cases and machine layout have been thoroughly thought out, again, clean and uncluttered

If you call having only 2 USB ports "unclutterd", I'd agree. I call it underpowered. If you call a fan that's giving up after 2 years, without any options to exchange it yourself, "uncluttered", you may have a point. Just that you don't.
Besides, I already told you that I don't care for the look of my computer.
I'd rather go for functionality. Besides, what has this to do with the superiority of OSX?

(Try to see it from his perspective: looks is ALL he knows and cares about...)




- The pro cases are sexy, durable / made out of metal

Wtf? "Sexy" hasn't got to do anything with quality. And do your really think you couldn't get a Windows box made out of metal?
Besides, what has this to do with the superiority of OSX?

(ditto as above)




- I had PC's from various manufacturers, I also built and upgraded them for myself and for other people.

Yet, you seem to have very little clues (if any at all) about how Windows works these days.

(Mac fanboys don't live in the real world. It's painfully evident that he has no clue how windows works, and yet he claims to have built win machines... Yeah, right...)

[gregwar]

about macs crashing, every time i load native instruments logic doesn't quit. my ensemble fails whenever i eject it every time. my favorite softsynth is alicia's keys so i load kontakt and have to force quit logic every time.

before this bring my mbp to school pretty much half the time when i opened the lid after working with my ensemble it didn't start and had to be rebooted by holding down the power button forever. macs crash, a lot.

i'm gonna upgrade my old pc to a quad or six core pc this fall and use my copy of sonar. i wish emagic would buy back logic because back in version 5 with my midiman (now m-audio) 24/96 card on pc i never had these problems, ever.

could always reboot my old pc, had the same track counts that my mbp (2009 unibody, 2.66g c2d 4g ram) had back in 2001. i'm concerned apple is ditching the creative pros because they're not as big as the aimless consumer crowd.

for a company with so many resources to be laying off final cut pro staffers and whatnot its possibly a sign of things to come.

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by gregwar

i'm concerned apple is ditching the creative pros because they're not as big as the aimless consumer crowd.

I realized that about two years ago. Since then, I've been happily mac-free.
Just look at how Apple has been pussyfooting with 64-bit, forcing Adobe to release CS4 for the mac only in 32-bit, while the Win version was already x64 (and I know at least a couple of graphic designers and one photographer who either switched to Windows or added a Win machine to their rig just for that reason.) Oh yeah, graphic designers --just like us musicians-- can DEFINITELY use more than 4 gb of RAM... Instead of fast-tracking the 64-bit OS, Apple has been out trying to convince people that 64-bit is no big deal. Then, of course, once OSX x64 will actually work, they will not only claim that it's the best thing since sliced bread, but also that they invented it...

Also let's not forget how they totally pi**ed Adobe off over the afore-mentioned CS4 incident and now with their anti-Flash nonsense. Without Adobe and their apps, not many "creative" guys will still use a mac...

[Fredrik]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

(No registry = no customization. Mac users are like little kids, Apple would never trust them to put their hands deep into the engine...)

Nonsense, it's obvious you never opened the terminal.

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by Fredrik

Nonsense, it's obvious you never opened the terminal.

LOL that you think the mac terminal even compares to the win registry...

[djanthonyw]

Originally Posted by gregwar

i'm concerned apple is ditching the creative pros because they're not as big as the aimless consumer crowd.

Typing on my 2010 MBP must just be my imagination right now.

It's obvious micro soft does a great job bringing professional products to the table.

[Fredrik]

I did not mean that it's the same as the registry obviously. But you pick and chose your interpretation as you wish as usual. It's an interface to many system utilities, (part of the Unix spec and others) that let's you put your hands deep in the system.

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by djanthonyw

Typing on my 2010 MBP must just be my imagination right now.

It's obvious micro soft does a great job bringing professional products to the table.

Yes, of course, there aren't any serious DAW's for the PC. Songsmith is just about it.

I think you've already proven to us how utterly clueless you are about Windows 7 or Windows in general, you really don't need to bury yourself into a bigger hole...

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by Fredrik

I did not mean that it's the same as the registry obviously. But you pick and chose your interpretation as you wish as usual. It's an interface to many system utilities, (part of the Unix spec and others) that let's you put your hands deep in the system.

So, it's not the same as the registry and the mac cannot be customized as extensively as a win machine. Which was my original point, which you very unsuccessfully tried to disprove.

[Fredrik]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

So, it's not the same as the registry and the mac cannot be customized as extensively as a win machine. Which was my original point, which you very unsuccessfully tried to disprove.

Why would you even use a proprietary system if you want to customize it? Why would you need to customize it, unless something is wrong with it?

[djanthonyw]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

Yes, of course, there aren't any serious DAW's for the PC. Songsmith is just about it.

I think you've already proven to us how utterly clueless you are about Windows 7 or Windows in general, you really don't need to bury yourself into a bigger hole...

Are you really that thickheaded? My point is that micro soft doesn't provide any options for professional users. Instead they release a piece of junk that is songsmith. Typical of micro soft, all they release is junk.

Originally Posted by PaPi61

So, it's not the same as the registry and the mac cannot be customized as extensively as a win machine. Which was my original point, which you very unsuccessfully tried to disprove.

Your posts don't even justify further replies as far as I'm concerned. You only read what you want from posts and you seem to get a rise out of personal attacks when they aren't even justified. You're actually the one that's clueless about OS X and Windows. It's obvious from your posts. The only thing I really have left to say to you is

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by Fredrik

Why would you need to customize it, unless something is wrong with it?

Because my needs are different than those of a graphic designer or a NASA scientist? I know it's hard for mac heads to even conceive that two computers with identical specs can actually be very different in how they function... Hey, just trust whatever Uncle Steve says is best for you! And it's not only best for you, it's best for everyone!

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by djanthonyw

You're actually the one that's clueless about OS X and Windows. It's obvious from your posts.

Gratuitous ad hominem. As usual, without any evidence. But then again, have you actually contributed anything else to this discussion?

Sascha and I have actually *PROVED* that you don't know anything about Windows 7 and Windows in general. It's evident from your list of reasons why the mac is supposedly better that has been hilariously debunked. And, of course, you won't even try to discuss my points and Sascha's, because we've given you FACTS to counter your clueless HYPE.

[Fredrik]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

Because my needs are different than those of a graphic designer or a NASA scientists? I know it's hard for mac heads to even conceive that two computers with identical specs can actually be very different in how they function... Hey, just trust whatever Uncle Steve says is best for you! And it's not only best for you, it's best for everyone!

You and your Nasa scientists lol. Mac's are also used in many different applications. Here are some a super computer cluster made with xserves for example.

University of Maine Supercomputer
MACH5 | TOP500 Supercomputing Sites
System X | TOP500 Supercomputing Sites

[PaPi61]

Originally Posted by Fredrik

Mac's are also used in many different applications.

Irrelevant. We were discussing customization. My point was that the mac is very limited when it comes to customization. First you assaulted me claiming I don't know what a terminal is (hey KID, I'm sure I'm much OLDER than you, I've been using computers and macs since the mid eighties, when you were not even a figment of your mom's imagination...), and when I trounced you by proving that not only I've used the kiddie terminal many times but that it has nothing whatsoever to do with the registry that can change your computer so much more dramatically, you immediately switched the subject.

Face it, you lost the argument again.

[Fredrik]

Yes, and I claim what you need is right there. Although, we probably do best in letting this stay in the "personal computing" domain, or I could do something rediculous like posting links to IBM z10 mainframes then let you bash these $100.000 boxes for being expensive and lacking the windows registry.

[kilon]

Originally Posted by PaPi61

Irrelevant. We were discussing customization. My point was that the mac is very limited when it comes to customization. First you assaulted me claiming I don't know what a terminal is (hey KID, I'm sure I'm much OLDER than you, I've been using computers and macs since the mid eighties, when you were not even a figment of your mom's imagination...), and when I trounced you by proving that not only I've used the kiddie terminal many times but that it has nothing whatsoever to do with the registry that can change your computer so much more dramatically, you immediately switched the subject.

Face it, you lost the argument again.

I was ready to reply to your "MACOS is less customisable" myth, had prepared a lenghty post about Applescprit and the Actively support of Apple of python scripting and programming language as measn of customisation of MACOS, similarly to the sucess of python in Linux. Was ready to hit the post button and then ....

silence....


blue screen of death....

REBOOT



Conclusion : Windows 7 does not want me to reply in this thread