Ocean Way Drums, Drum Masters 2 -OR- SSD Ex

[RTR]

Just curious about what YOU all would get..either the "Ocean Way Drums, Drum Masters 2 and Infinite Player" for $99.00 with that group buy OR the "SSD EX" for $99.00..OR would you not even bother if you already have ezdrummer and Addictive drums! I have both of those..do you think one of the other 2 would be a step up..I do mostly pop/rock and R&B!! Thanks for your thoughts!!

[RTR]

Has anyone had both of these to compare?

[Mark Kaufman]

Thanks for the question RTR, because I have exactly what you have, and am considering exactly what you are. thumbsup

[RTR]

Originally Posted by Mark Kaufman

Thanks for the question RTR, because I have exactly what you have, and am considering exactly what you are. thumbsup

Ya man..I want some better/real sounding drums..I am a drummer but have no room nor the good gear required to mic up a kit, I play with both hands on a keyboard but I really like the midi loops to get writing right away!!

[guitarob]

I have SSD platinum, and I'm also considering getting the Ocean Way group buy, especially for the free EZPlayer pro(50$) that i could also use with SSD.

But I'm not sure i would use those drums sounds, since all I do is basically Metal/Mordern Rock Stuff.

[jonutarr]

Originally Posted by RTR

Ya man..I want some better/real sounding drums..I am a drummer but have no room nor the good gear required to mic up a kit, I play with both hands on a keyboard but I really like the midi loops to get writing right away!!

Get the OWD & DM group buy and set of V-Drums thumbsup

[Phroggy]

Originally Posted by RTR

Just curious about what YOU all would get..either the "Ocean Way Drums, Drum Masters 2 and Infinite Player" for $99.00 with that group buy OR the "SSD EX" for $99.00..OR would you not even bother if you already have ezdrummer and Addictive drums! I have both of those..do you think one of the other 2 would be a step up..I do mostly pop/rock and R&B!! Thanks for your thoughts!!

I'm in the same boat. Having a hard time deciding between the two. I do rock but not heavy metal.

[RTR]

Originally Posted by jonutarr

Get the OWD & DM group buy and set of V-Drums thumbsup

I had to sell my V-drums last year (Was Broke)..I miss them man..I am pretty good at playing with my fingers, been doing that since the 80's with hip hop....So you would get them even it you had EZ and ADD ?

[pw2005]

I have both and they are very different from each other. I have actually layered SSD and OWD together and they compliment each other perfectly.

I might suggest the group buy because it is temporary and is a great deal.

Peter

[RTR]

Originally Posted by pw2005

I have both and they are very different from each other. I have actually layer SSD and OWD together and they compliment each other perfectly.

I might suggest the group buy because it is temporary and is a great deal.

Peter

TRUE.....It's so cheap I might just do it..I do not need more drum sounds but wheres the fun in that..right?

[PlatinumSamples]

Originally Posted by pw2005

I would go for it. SSD is also great and it works amazingly well with OWD as a layer. I do not use BFD or Superior any more because SSD ,Drum masters and OWD are so much better sounding.I layered an SSD kick with an OWD kick and it is the best sound I have ever heard. They are both in Kontakt so you can easily use them together.

Peter Warren

Peter, correct me if I'm wrong but you do beta test for Sonic Reality don't you? When you requested to be on our Barresi beta team for Superior you told me that you beta tested for 2 other drum sample companies....

Rail

[Squids]

We don't have official outside beta testers. But we sometimes let users have advanced patches with new scripts - we offered that to current Drum Masters users when we had the 1.5 version and based on user's feedback we jumped to Drum Masters 2. That's about as close as we've gotten to outside beta testing - more of a public beta (but just for those that already bought the samples).

Anyway, with regard to the question, I think there are some good points made about how both are in Kontakt and would be useful to have so you can expand the sonic possibilities in the same sampler. SSD has more processing which might be a good thing in combination with the more natural sounds of Drum Masters 2 or the audiophile fidelity kind of sound of OWD. You may want to use a hi hat and cymbals from OWD, a set of barking Gretsch "Collins-esque" toms from Drum Masters 2 and then a compressed kick and snare from SSD. Something like that could be handy to have! It's nice to have options. We're also going to release some expansion libraries of JUST kicks & toms, JUST snares etc. (and different ones than what's in these kit collections) so you can add more variety of kit pieces into your collection (and add over time as well if you're on a tight budget).

The only thing about this particular bundle we're doing the Group Buy on though is the limited time. SSD I imagine will be around for awhile as it is his regular product. This was a special situation where I got Ocean Way and all of the artists and studios involved in this particular bundle to agree to a one time limited duration of availability (and not just at this price but at all!) for this combined multi-product.

If you were going to get both - which is a good idea considering the value you get for the money with either of them - just time it right so you don't miss this deal. It ends December 30th and I don't even know if we'll offer it at all next year and if we do it will be only temporary. That's not up to me. So get it while you can!

join the group buy for The Ultimate Studio Drums Group Buy. (download) (Group Buy) ()

[chrisso]

Originally Posted by Squids

We don't have official outside beta testers. But we sometimes let users have advanced patches with new scripts - we offered that to current Drum Masters users when we had the 1.5 version and based on user's feedback we jumped to Drum Masters 2. That's about as close as we've gotten to outside beta testing - more of a public beta (but just for those that already bought the samples).

Like this I suppose?:

Originally Posted by relayer

DM2 will be filled with all kinds of goodies. MIDI learn, articulation control, a one-size-fits-all V-drum map, and other stuff. He gave me a sneak peak at 1.5 (not an RC), and I was blown away.
Steve

Still, I find it odd that a couple of Gearslutz who seem to have personal contact with you, including sneak peaks of future versions, continually post one liners in these OWD and DM threads..... with questions like 'Are these kits multi channel'?
Perhaps they should just drop you an email.

[pw2005]

I have deleted my post referring to these vs BFD and Superior. The lesson is don't do posts after having a few too many beers! All these are different from each other but these 2 seem to be the closest to the type of acoustic sound I use. Currently I mainly record acoustic drums with some samples as layers.

The original post was asking about Sonic reality vs Slate so I didn't think BFD or Superior was a consideration in this case,and could not be purchased for $100.

Peter

[RTR]

Does this set come with midi loops, ya know how ez and AD come with a shit load of loops you can just drag and drop to get a nice beat going to write to?

[Squids]

Originally Posted by chrisso

Like this I suppose?:

Still, I find it odd that a couple of Gearslutz who seem to have personal contact with you, including sneak peaks of future versions, continually post one liners in these OWD and DM threads..... with questions like 'Are these kits multi channel'?
Perhaps they should just drop you an email.

It's amazing how you read one thing and assume you know. Like I said, the checking out of Drum Masters 1.5 kit patches was only offered publicly to current Drum Masters users who contacted me on KVR or Vdrums.com (and I think I mentioned it here as well). It was through threads like this: KVR: Infinite Player Content News: Drum Masters 1.5, FX Tron and Cinema Sessions and I think there was another one or two about preliminary specs and public discussion about it so we could get feedback. The samples weren't given out, just the patches... hence people had to own it already. No knock to anyone who was proud to have it but it wasn't reserved for any "team" of people. But I appreciate the feedback we got and I am glad to see people post about it. I certainly don't like any of our users getting discouraged from that or accused of anything. That's not cool.

The only person who works for Sonic Reality on forums is me. Anyone else who posts anything about it with knowledge is a customer of our products. So, if ANY "public beta testers" of the MULTITRACK DM1.5 kits have questions about THIS bundle (which are different than the multitracks) that is a totally legit question. NO ONE has this bundle. No beta tester, no one outside the company.

So, now that this is clear maybe the thread can go back to talking about OWD, Drum Masters or SSD?

[Squids]

Originally Posted by pw2005

I have deleted my post referring to these vs BFD and Superior. The lesson is don't do posts after having a few too many beers! All these are different from each other but these 2 seem to be the closest to the type of acoustic sound I use. Currently I mainly record acoustic drums with some samples as layers.

The original post was asking about Sonic reality vs Slate so I didn't think BFD or Superior was a consideration in this case,and could not be purchased for $100.

Peter

You're entitled to your opinion. It's amazing when some of our users happen to like OWD or Drum Masters better than say BFD or another drum platform there are other sound developers who use those formats who quickly come in and put them down or smear some negativity on them to discourage expressing their opinion. I think that's ridiculous. No one should be intimidated by that. You don't see anyone from SR or Steve Slate discouraging anyone talking about how they prefer BFD, Superior or Addictive Drums!

Look, I like BFD, Superior and other formats too. There are plus and minus points to developing in those formats vs. an open sampler format like Kontakt which Steve and I have done. I just talked to him about it in person last month. It's not as easy to convey that using Kontakt the way that we have can actually have some benefits to the user that you don't find in any of the competing dedicated drum product formats. Just the same there are features in those that we can't do in Kontakt. If in the end a user prefers one over the other is that not what threads like this are asking? Granted this particular thread is about OWD, Drum Masters and SSD (not BFD or others... and certainly I don't recall anyone mentioning C&V at all) so, okay, if you deleted your post out of respect to being on topic, fine. But, otherwise, if ANYONE is a user who prefers the way we've developed the sounds in Kontakt or the qualities of the sample content itself which is unique to each company then I don't want to see that squandered by jealous competitors. Sorry but that's what it appears to be. I realize that itself is an assumption as well but... for what other reason is this thread relevant to someone like Chrisso who is not even a user of either SR or Slate products?

Let people express their opinions. If they don't like your product and don't explain it then ask them why? It's subjective. People are entitled to have their preferences. As long as they aren't based on false information about the products (which I agree warrant clarification from anyone who knows - such as a developer) then I don't see how anyone can say anything. Jumping to conclusions just makes one look like a fire starter... surely going to offend the person being accused. I think Peter took it lightly and politely. Bravo. Others would have gone ballistic but you handled it with class.

Anyway, I am off to do some real world things like take my kids to the playground. From one playground to another!

Let's get back to the topic. It's a good topic because they ARE both in Kontakt and there is a certain amount of convenience if you were to get both. Steve and I have even talked about him possibly supporting iMap or doing other cooperative things such as us carrying his products on esoundz etc. His approach is different than ours but that also makes it more diverse to have both and I think that's why a lot of SSD users are getting in on this group buy - from what I've read anyway.

[Squids]

Originally Posted by RTR

Does this set come with midi loops, ya know how ez and AD come with a shit load of loops you can just drag and drop to get a nice beat going to write to?

Yes, and it comes with some "more expressive than normal" midi loops that involve real left/right snare rolls and ghost notes of the iMap (which aren't in GM or any other standard map that I know of but iMap). So for that part of the product it is going to be a step forward for realism and feel. I will be showing that this week. As far as how many are included, it depends. Right now there are at least 100-200 but the bigger the group buy gets the more we're going to do. So it could be several times that. Plus we may be bundling some from Groove Monkee and Odd Grooves as well since there are not audio grooves in this, we're going to focus on midi. On top of that we are offering EZ Player Pro as a freebie if it reaches 300 people (and we're only about 12 away from that). It comes with hundreds of its own midi based on GM format.

All in all... there could be over 2,000 midi grooves bundled with this or more! But it is a group buy and a living custom product that changes. Only getting better though.

Ok I'm late! Gotta go. Ttyl.

[pw2005]

The Sonic Reality drum products are much more like my own acoustic kit sound and are very well recorded. That is why I like them the most. The velocities for the drums are scaled closer to the way I play as well,which makes them work well from my E drum kit.

The Slate drums are hit harder and work great for modern rock or as extra layers in my case for punch in the mix.

Both companies are very responsive to E drummers. Toontrack has a great engine but were not responsive at all to any of my requests. Maybe they are too big of a company. Fxpansion did not respond to any of my requests either.

I would rather use products from a company that does work on development that will be useful to me. I play world music and like a modern type of kit sound that is hit medium hard with resonance. The OWD and drum masters kits work for this very well.

Peter

[PlatinumSamples]

Originally Posted by Squids

You're entitled to your opinion. It's amazing when some of our users happen to like OWD or Drum Masters better than say BFD or another drum platform there are other sound developers who use those formats who quickly come in and put them down or smear some negativity on them to discourage expressing their opinion.

Sorry Dave,

The reason I asked is only because I have emails from Peter expressing opinions directly opposed to some of his posts in these threads... otherwise I wouldn't have said anything. I have no problems with folks expressing their opinions about any product - but I'd like them to be truthful about their motivation, and be consistent. If Peter had simply said his personal favourite sounding is OWD and not said something about BFD opposed to what he'd emailed me (combined with his recent postings) I wouldn't have had cause to ponder.

Regards,

Rail

[chrisso]

Originally Posted by Squids

for what other reason is this thread relevant to someone like Chrisso who is not even a user of either SR or Slate products?

I think you see Gearslutz as a private forum for various companies to explain and promote their wares. Threads drift off topic more often than not in my experience.
That's the nature of a lightly moderated, open forum.
As for me, I've been a member of Gearslutz since 2002, three years before the first versions of BFD and Superior were released, neither of which I had any involvement in. I have over 7,000 posts to my name, and I think you'll find about 5% of those pertain to virtual drum products.

I'm here to learn about recording, and to pass on any insight I have on recording from my years in the studios. In recent times I've had an interest in the software drum sample scene.

I think Peter took it lightly and politely. Bravo. Others would have gone ballistic but you handled it with class.

I guess on a basic forum level I don't really associate 'class' with writing off a company in public, while requesting a role as a beta tester in private.

Originally Posted by pw2005

I do not use BFD or Superior any more because SSD ,Drum masters and OWD are so much better sounding........
Toontrack has a great engine but were not responsive at all to any of my requests. Maybe they are too big of a company.
I would rather use products from a company that does work on development that will be useful to me.
Peter

[RTR]

Originally Posted by Squids

Yes, and it comes with some "more expressive than normal" midi loops that involve real left/right snare rolls and ghost notes of the iMap (which aren't in GM or any other standard map that I know of but iMap). So for that part of the product it is going to be a step forward for realism and feel. I will be showing that this week. As far as how many are included, it depends. Right now there are at least 100-200 but the bigger the group buy gets the more we're going to do. So it could be several times that. Plus we may be bundling some from Groove Monkee and Odd Grooves as well since there are not audio grooves in this, we're going to focus on midi. On top of that we are offering EZ Player Pro as a freebie if it reaches 300 people (and we're only about 12 away from that). It comes with hundreds of its own midi based on GM format.

All in all... there could be over 2,000 midi grooves bundled with this or more! But it is a group buy and a living custom product that changes. Only getting better though.

Ok I'm late! Gotta go. Ttyl.

Thanks a lot man..I appreciate your time..I am the person that started this thread in hopes of getting some info on this group buy and USERS input and, you have been most helpful..but some of these other people..GOD DAMN..I did not intend for all this other BS..GS is really starting to fu*in suck lately..you get 2 or 3 nice answers/opinions and the rest is just bull shit man.. ..SSD or this group buy? THATS WHAT I ASKED...Please stay on topic or start your own thread..thank you

[Squids]

Originally Posted by chrisso

I think you see Gearslutz as a private forum for various companies to explain and promote their wares. Threads drift off topic more often than not in my experience.
That's the nature of a lightly moderated, open forum.
As for me, I've been a member of Gearslutz since 2002, three years before the first versions of BFD and Superior were released, neither of which I had any involvement in. I have over 7,000 posts to my name, and I think you'll find about 5% of those pertain to virtual drum products.

I'm here to learn about recording, and to pass on any insight I have on recording from my years in the studios. In recent times I've had an interest in the software drum sample scene.

Obviously I don't see this place as a private forum. That is just another false assumption. But, I do see a pattern of you being quick to chime in with negativity like flies on poop. If that is what you gravitate towards and stirring things up is what you enjoy doing then go ahead. Don't be surprised if someone finds it odd when at this moment in time (regardless of your varied forum history) you still DO have self interests in a competing product that you gain from financially. So, again, a thread that has nothing to even to do with that product or yours is "open season" for you to try to bring it down somehow. You think it is justified because it is an open forum. Maybe you don't realize how classless that looks. Does anyone do that to you? I don't. Who has the time to do that anyway? Why not find something positive to talk about?

I don't claim to be the rule setter but there is such a thing as common courtesy and tact in a social environment such as this. I am entitled to express my opinion and my feeling is that it is one thing if someone is talking about your product and they've got the facts wrong. By all means anyone, no matter what the thread topic and who it is - manufacturer or user - should clarify the info. But, to be hovering over topics about competing products and finding things you "think" are the case and start accusing people... who do you think you are the sample police? You happen to be incorrect about your assumption. As I told you we haven't done any official outside beta testing. The most we've done is allowed people that use our products to try some new patches referencing the samples they already own. We did that as a public beta test offered in our company forum on KVR (and mentioned in other places). The feedback given was also done openly. At most you could call it a public beta but even then it was just for people that owned the product so that's even less than if we had given people the product.

That's the second time I've explained it. I hope it is now clear. We don't have anyone else affiliated with the company here. Just me. We may have some fans. I certainly hope so! We work hard enough to please our customers, listen to the features they want and capture sounds musicians might be looking for. Even suggesting that they might "just be Sonic Reality Beta testers" which implies there should be some sort of discredit to their posted questions or opinions is insulting to them and also to me. If you don't know for sure that's the case then that is a bold move to make! Just finding a post where someone says they got the Drum Masters 1.5 patch to try out before release does NOT tell the whole story. Investigate further and you'll find that what I am saying is correct... not to mention that the DM 1.5 stuff has only a small part of what DM 2 and this particular bundle is all about! Trust me NO ONE has tried it yet outside of the company so all questions about it from anyone on the forum are valid.

[pw2005]

RTR: Thank you for clarifying what this thread is about! You obviously were not considering anything except the $100 SSD or the SR group buy so I do not know why the other companies are here.

Let us know if you intend to use an E kit at all. This is what I have the most experience with.

I regretted the wording of my comment about Toontrack and FX [which did not include Platinum Samples by the way] so I deleted it to show respect for your companies! For some reason Chrisso has decided to repost it to continue some kind of argument. I would prefer you and Rail to remove my comment from your posts that I already deleted.

Peter

[Squids]

Originally Posted by RTR

Thanks a lot man..I appreciate your time..I am the person that started this thread in hopes of getting some info on this group buy and USERS input and, you have been most helpful..but some of these other people..GOD DAMN..I did not intend for all this other BS..GS is really starting to fu*in suck lately..you get 2 or 3 nice answers/opinions and the rest is just bull shit man.. ..SSD or this group buy? THATS WHAT I ASKED...Please stay on topic or start your own thread..thank you

Yes, you're right and I apologize to you for getting sucked into the off topic discussion myself. There's a bit too much vulture-like activity between competitors here sometimes... and to be fair it can be a touchy subject. Ironically, I think Steve would say many of the things I'm saying about the plus and minuses of why he chose Kontakt. I'm sure he'd be the first to talk about the benefits of having both our products and his as well. More options, especially if you like both approaches and can imagine mixing and matching the sounds.

I'll talk to him and see if there is something we can even do where you get some kind of cross-grade discount between the two product lines. That might help people who might be asking the same question have their cake and eat it too. We couldn't do it on the Group Buy bundle product because that one is at its lowest possible price already but maybe the full versions. Something like a discount to all SSD owners if you want to get Drum Masters 2 or OWD Silver, Gold etc. and visa versa. Although if you're talking about the two $99 products... that's about as low as it gets already! But, it'd still be a nice option. I'll let you know.

In any case, I don't have a problem with Rail for the record. I think what he does and who he works with is cool! A different approach I don't fully agree with but I have respect and admiration for him and the Platinum team. Plus I know they are are all friends with the Ocean Way people so I really don't think there's a problem there. As far as Chrisso... well, it might seem that I'm bent out of shape from his posting recently. But, actually it's not that big a deal. Maybe I could work on ignoring it though for the benefit of the person who started the thread. I like to think that anyone who has played with Paul McCartney would be cool but... actions speak louder than credits. In other words, I think he could be cooler about this and not rain on other people's parade.

Anyway, back to the topic... I would imagine you might want us developers to pipe down a bit and get some user's POV in here? Sorry. It is kind of immature. That is why I made the playground/sandbox analogy.

[pw2005]

Originally Posted by chrisso

I think you see Gearslutz as a private forum for various companies to explain and promote their wares. Threads drift off topic more often than not in my experience.
That's the nature of a lightly moderated, open forum.
As for me, I've been a member of Gearslutz since 2002, three years before the first versions of BFD and Superior were released, neither of which I had any involvement in. I have over 7,000 posts to my name, and I think you'll find about 5% of those pertain to virtual drum products.

I'm here to learn about recording, and to pass on any insight I have on recording from my years in the studios. In recent times I've had an interest in the software drum sample scene.




I guess on a basic forum level I don't really associate 'class' with writing off a company in public, while requesting a role as a beta tester in private.

I am just a guy with a home studio and no big time credits like you. I don't really like being attacked by a manufacturer and I can't imagine how it will help your sales of custom and vintage. The request as a beta tester was not yesterday. I can change my opinion every day if I want to,and may like something different next week if there is a new release.

I recently mixed a roots rock band and found that the Platinum Samples Jim Scott drums Steve Ferrone kit was perfect layered over the acoustic drum tracks. It turned out that the drummer had used a 1920's vintage black beauty snare and that was why the Steve ferrone snare blended perfectly.

For my own bands the Sonic Reality sounds are the most suitable. I mainly do my own bands only.

I removed the post about something being better than another but I am going to relay my experiences about Toontrack and FX if someone wants to hear it, to explain why I have been interested in another product. This does not include Platinum Samples and Rail is a very helpful, great guy. He actually solved my installation problem with Superior even he was not working with them at the time!

Peter

[CGBMike]

Just adding my 2 cents, but I think there's a lot of subjectivity when it comes to things like this.
Everybody likes different things, and most people will defend and promote what they like. Which is a real bugger when it comes to things like drum sounds - so whereas someone may like a huge deep snare that sounds like Satan farting others might like a tiny piccolo. And some people might like huge rooms whereas others want the drums mic'd as close as possible. And there's no right or wrong answer to which is "Better", and the different companies and engineers and producers all have their own idea of what they like best, so they record it.
But the trouble starts when we as users start arguing about which is better, and then the companies chime in over what they think is better and why, and it can so easily turn into a massive (or passive-aggressive, which I'm not saying is happening, don't get me wrong) "brawl", with no-one being in the right or the wrong, just defending their own opinions.

I like collecting drum sounds - I get new vst's and librarys whenever I can, because as I only have a small space to record in I like having the option to get as many different sonic possibilities as possible. The same goes for amp-sims too. And when I record others I like having all my options open. Again, no one sound is better than any other, it's just what fits the song.

So essentially what I'm saying is... let's all have a cup of tea and a sit down, cos that's the good stuff.

[Bang]

Originally Posted by RTR

Just curious about what YOU all would get..either the "Ocean Way Drums, Drum Masters 2 and Infinite Player" for $99.00 with that group buy OR the "SSD EX" for $99.00..OR would you not even bother if you already have ezdrummer and Addictive drums! I have both of those..do you think one of the other 2 would be a step up..I do mostly pop/rock and R&B!! Thanks for your thoughts!!

If you have to get only one, I'd say you have a very tough decision on your hands. Oceanway Drums and Drum Masters are really good libraries. My only advice is to listen to the demos from each product and decide which sounds work for your music.

Or you can ditch the drum software idea all together and get $99 worth of porn

Choose wisely my friend.

[pw2005]

Get both! I always add the SSD kick 1 to the OWD kick[usually 16] and it is my current favorite big punchy kick sound. In the future you could add Steven's deluxe kits and drum masters Ken Scott to get a very wide variety of options. I think the single kit downloads will be inexpensive but maybe Steven and Dave could let us know.

Peter

[Squids]

Nah, there's plenty of porn and it's not going anywhere either. Much less great drum samples out there!

There's a few jokes I could make involving Marcia Brady but I think... maybe given the sensitivity of the thread perhaps to just keep it simple. Nice to see you Steve. Ttys.