What is the big deal about dongle hate?

[lagavulin16]

Originally Posted by drycounty

Really sucks that my car which is FULLY PAID OFF came with a key that I have to use all the time just to get to work and stuff. It also sucks that my wife INSISTS on us locking our house that we PAID FOR and using keys just to come and go. Sheesh!

Keys are for losers!

If you lose your key to your car or your house, do you have to buy your car or house again?

I didn't think so.

[lagavulin16]

I think what people on the pro-dongle side don't understand is that companies that don't require dongles are doing just fine. We don't live in a world where dongle based companies make tons of money and serial based companies all go bankrupt in two weeks.

I'm sure awesome companies like Fabfilter of FXpansion are doing just fine without dongles or other restrictive licensing policies.

Lots of dongle based software has been cracked.

[ebulb]

I think the irony of dongle protection is it presents a challenge to hackers and they love nothing more than being able to prove their skill.. So a dongle probably slows things slightly but in turn becomes more of a target..

[7rojo7]

because it can go seriously wrong

Dear customer service,

In May of this year I launched my ProTools HD3 Accel after a long
period of inactivity, none of my third party plugins were authorized.
All plugins asked to be authorized by means of the smart card which
inserts into the iloks. The smart cards that were in my iloks had been
removed by some nefarious prankster and someone gave me the advice to
start an RMA on my iloks, which I have done and this process is
undoable. However, later I learned that I only had to synchronize my
iloks to get my authorizations back, or something to that effect. My
mistake, I should have investigated further before panicking and
starting the RMA process, I deeply regret this.

I don’t why I lost my authorizations or who removed the smart cards
for Massive pack 4. I still have my iloks and Pace recommends that I
synhronize them to disable them, which I will do once I receive
confirmation that I can receive my authorizations from digidesign and
all of the third party plugin manufacturers.

The truth is, I still don’t understand how I lost my authorizations
and I don’t really understand how to get them back and reauthorize my
plugins, which I need deperately as soon as possible

As I have stated, I still have my iloks, I have the smart cards for
massive pack 1 but not for massive pack 4, I have the original
packaging for all other plugins.

Pace told me that I must contact the plugin manufacurers and that my
authorizations would be restored to my ilok account and that I could
buy new iloks to synchronize and I could use all my wonderful plugins
again.

The RMA numbers are:
RMA# SI 1333819 and
RMA# SI 1333811

these should have a list of all the plugins on the iloks, all of my
plugins have been registered with their manufacturers

I need advice about how to reauthorize my plugins as it is clear that
I don’t understand the process, I thought that once the authorizations
were on the ilok that that was permanent, I never dreamed that they
could ‘fall off’ the ilok and then there is not written anywhere that
this could happen or what to do about it when it does happen.

I am quite embarrassed about this as I am a professional engineer
since 1986 and have been using Pro Tools since 1994.

I await your prompt, cordial reply as this matter has become quite
urgent for me. please tell me what to do.

Thank you very much

Robert Johnson

rojourumita@gmail.com
+39 0743 55 04 85/ home telephone with answering machine

Hello Robert,

You are explicitly warned that submitting an iLok as Lost/Stolen is
irreversible by our company. Unfortunately, this is the case. When you submit
an iLok as Lost/Stolen, an email notification is sent to each software company
informing them that the iLok is no longer usable on iLok.com. Certain
software companies may replace licenses in these cases, others will not.

This RMA is not reversible by our company without the approval of each
software manufacturer. The authority to reinstate this iLok rests solely on
the approval of all involved software companies.

As this iLok contains licenses from software companies, we require their
approval prior to reinstating this iLok. Please contact these companies and
ask them to email us giving their express approval to reinstate this iLok.
They will need to put your support incident number (SI1351491) in the Subject
line of their email to us.

For RMA SI1333811 for iLok "iLok urumita 1" requires approval from:

Crane Songs Ltd
Digidesign
Eventide, Inc.
McDSP/McDowell Signal Processing, LLC
Sonnox Ltd.
TC Works Soft & Hardware Gmbh
Unique Recording Software, Inc.

For RMA SI1333819 for iLok "iLok urumita 2" requires approval from:

Digidesign
McDSP/McDowell Signal Processing, LLC
Sonnox Ltd.
Wave Mechanics, Inc.


If the iLoks are synchronized on iLok.com, the iLoks will be permanently
disabled by iLok.com. Notifications will then be sent to each software
manufacturer notifying them that iLok and all licenses on it has been
identified as disabled. Most software manufacturers will then directly
replace licenses into your iLok.com account. This second option would require
that you purchase a new iLok, but would be a quicker resolution to this issue.

Unfortunately, we are not authorized to operate around these limitations. For
this reason you are explicitly warned that the RMA is irreversible.



Best Regards,
Sam
iLok.com Technical Support
<www.ilok.com>

robert johnson wrote:

> iLok.com Support Incident Notification
>
> Incident:SI1351491
>
> Created:6/30/09 11:26 AM -0700
>
> User:robert johnson
>
> ID:urumita
>
> E-Mail:rojourumita@gmail.com
>
> iLok:Unspecified
>
> Message from the user:
>
> Operating System/version:OSX 10.3.9Browser/version:Safari 1.2Describe
> the
> problem you are having, including any error messages:I've started the
> RMA
> process on my 2 iloks, The iloks themselves were not stolen but the
> license
> cards were. RMA#SI1333811 - RMA#SI1333819When I launch PT 6.9.3cs2, it
> asks
> me for the license card for all of my already authorized plug ins, if I
> uncheck
> the use license card box, it brings me to the challenge and response
> window,
> of course i have no responses.I've reinstalled the client software which
> worked
> before and it brings me to the PACE ilok site for synchronization of my
> iloks
> which no longer show up under my profile, but I can see the licenses in
> my
> historycatch22how do I get my licenses back?I did not understand at
> first
> that the authorizations are stored on the ilok and not the cards, in my
> RMA
> applications I specified that the cards had been removed and that I
> still
> posessed the ilokshow do I get my licenses back?thanks very much
>

[7rojo7]

I use the EQ and the Dynamics quite a bit, the others I can use microphones to do

Dear Robert

Sony/Sonnox has never used the licence card method for Oxford plug-in authorisation. Instead, the authorisations are downloaded onto the iLok itself.

From our systems here, I can see that the licences are on your iLoks, as follows :

PTHREQG2 (MP2) Oxford EQ s/n 22202 : iLok s/n 0x000099AB
PTHDYNG2 Oxford Dynamics, PTHINFG2 Oxford Inflator & PTHTMDG2 Oxford TransMod s/n 43343 : iLok s/n 0x000064C4
PTHREQG2 (MP4) Oxford EQ s/n 45649 : iLok s/n 0x000064C4

I also can see that both iLoks have been marked as 'Stolen', meaning that they cannot be synchronised without the licences being permanently disabled.

If you have not synchronised the iLoks, then the licences may still be available to you.

We are able to issue you with replacement, full licences. Please note that these can only be downloaded onto another iLok(s) attached to iLok account 'urumita'.

There is a licence re-issue fee of GBP 25.00 per replacement licence, so that's GBP 125.00 in total for all 5 of your plug-in licences. If you wish to go ahead, please let me know and I will send a special payment URL for you to use. Once the transaction is complete, I will issue you with the full replacement licences.

I should point out that the version of licences you have are suitable for use with Pro Tools 6 only, and will not support Pro Tools 7 or 8, and are not compatible with Intel-based Mac (Mac Pro) computers.

Once you have downloaded the replacement licences onto a new iLok(s) it will be possible for you to upgrade your licences to the latest versions, suitable for Pro Tools 6, 7 & 8 and Intel Macs. These will also support native use, for RTAS, VST and Audio Units host DAW's.

The upgrade fee is GBP 25.00 per licence and you can upgrade at our website. I can provide further upgrade instructions if this is required.

Please do let me know if I can help you with replacement licences.

Finally, please note that you can access the plug-in software installers by using your download URL's, as provided in our original emails to you. If you have lost these, you can get a reminder of these from here :

www.sonnoxplugins.com/myinfo

I note that you have used two email addresses : urumita@kybalion.tv and info@urumita.com

If you no longer have access to these and would like me to change them, please let me know your preferred email address.

Best regards

Nick


Nick Wiggins
Sonnox Support

Ticket Details
===================
Ticket ID: ETS-931817
Department: Support
Priority: Medium
Status: Open

[7rojo7]

I miss the Fairchild 670 and the sound toys stuff
they're more flexible

Hello Robert,

It should be possible to pay with the rechargeable credit card, provided that it is a major card such as Visa or Mastercard.

Temporary licenses normally last for 30 days but if they run out before, I will renew them for you as a gesture of goodwill. This case can last indefinitely provided it is kept open, I will keep an eye out and reopen it if it closes due to inactivity.

I'm sure the dealer will be willing to send you an iLok to save you the drive to San Marino and, speaking plainly, they should, if they take care of the their bigger customers.

The licenses did not fall off the iLok; from what you've told me, it sounds like they were never permanently on the iLok because they were authorised every time you used Pro Tools through the smart cards, although I could be wrong since I am not very familiar with the smart cards.

Best Regards,

Benjy
Entered By : Customer (robert johnson) Entered on : 9/8/2009 2:11 PM
Thank you for your prompt response,
I'll take the advice
Since I have no bank account anymore. how would it be possible to pay?
I have a rechargeable credit card
How long will the temporary licenses last? how long can this case last?
I thank you for your understanding.
I am passing a really rough time, tragedies etc... this being one of them, divorce, bankruptcy, I'll probably have to return to the staes and leave my kids here with their mother etc...
I can swing a new ilok somehow, the vendor I bought the HD3 and control 24 (sold) broke off from their parent company and is independent and I have a good relation with them but they're in San Marino (300km)
Any idea as to why all my licenses fell off the ilok? It hadn't been plugged in for a while
Thanks again
rojo
Entered By : Benjamin Schmidt Entered on : 9/8/2009 1:52 PM
Hello Robert,

I understand your position is very awkward and I sympathize with your circumstances.

If you can find a spare iLok, I can deposit temporary licenses to use until you can afford to replace the permanent ones. The dealer that you purchased your Accel cards may be willing to help here, it may be worth asking them if they can lend or loan you an iLok, since there is such serious money changing hands where HD systems are concerned!

Additionally, whilst I do not wish to come across as patronising or condescending, we strongly recommend that in future, the Zero Downtime option for your iLok would be an essential purchase, particularly where studio functionality must be maintained at all times.

Please let me know if there is anything further I can do for you.

Best Regards,

Benjy
Entered By : Customer (robert johnson) Entered on : 9/8/2009 1:15 PM
Thanks for the response.
this is really bad news for me as my studio is basically out of business and I'm in bankrupcy
I've been finding small jobs here and there, but nothing solid
my second ilok held my double plugins, so Iyou can put them on one ilok
I have to buy new ilok also, I don't expect this to change. Is is possible to put the licenses in my ilok account ready for me to synchronize when I can afford to buy a new ilok, which at the moment I can nat. The only thing left to do is to beg. I've used digidesign products since 1994 and I am a customer since 1996, there has to be a little heart left there, I hope
It was not anyyone from digidesign
thhanks again for the response
rojo
Entered By : Benjamin Schmidt Entered on : 9/8/2009 11:09 AM
Hello Robert,

We are able to replace the licenses for you but unfortunately, since you started the RMA process, there is a flat fee of $125 per iLok so this will cost you $250 in total.

May I ask who gave you the advice, since if it was someone from our company, they will need to be told that this was totally incorrect.

Please let me know how you wish to proceed.

Best Regards,

Benjy

[7rojo7]

Can't live without MC2000, everything else is nice too
The only company that has actually contacted ilok

Hi Rojo,

I hope you get everything worked out with the other companies. For now iLok.com told me to do nothing. If all the other companies agree, they will reinstate your iLok. If not, then please let me know that you need new licenses. I can then confirm that with iLok.com and give you new licenses.

Good luck!
Aja

[7rojo7]

see the three posts before this and you'll understand


I'm still waiting for Cranesong, Pheonix is just stupid and I really like what it does, nothing else does anything like it
Eventide hasn't answered yet
TC (and I really need Master X3, always) is still with the question floating around

[lagavulin16]

That really sounds like a nightmare, 7rojo7. Hope you get it all sorted out soon.

[Smithers]

I actually like dongles. What I DON'T LIKE is that there is no "standard". iLok is the most popular, but I just wish everyone would get on the same bandwagon. I cant imagine having an iLok, Syncrosoft, Yellow Tools, Steinberg, Vienna etc.... Just to mix one song. If iLok is it, then everybody just needs to use iLok and save my USB ports for other things. There is a lot of software I want to buy but I refuse because I don't want a new dongle every time I buy a plugin.

[Umami Uni]

They're a waste of space,a pain in the ass, and cost the loyal consumer more money.

fuuck

[rydan]

Originally Posted by lagavulin16

If you lose your key to your car or your house, do you have to buy your car or house again?

I didn't think so.

WORD!

[che_guitarra]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

It's the internet and people like to complain.

Touche! Ha ha - too funny.

[rydan]

Originally Posted by che_guitarra

Touche! Ha ha - too funny.

Well, if you had spent your hard earned cash on software, and then not been able to use it due to dongle driver issues, with pace and motu blaming each other and you not getting any help, perhaps you wouldn't laugh quite as loud.

[lagavulin16]

I've been dongle free my whole life and plan to keep it that way. I came close to getting a great deal on Largo which would have broken the streak.

Oh well, maybe I'll check out Zebra2 instead.

[rydan]

Originally Posted by lagavulin16

I've been dongle free my whole life and plan to keep it that way. I came close to getting a great deal on Largo which would have broken the streak.

Oh well, maybe I'll check out Zebra2 instead.

Largo works without a dongle. You can "lock" it to a specific computer instead.

[lagavulin16]

Originally Posted by rydan

Largo works without a dongle. You can "lock" it to a specific computer instead.

Can I later deauthorize it from that computer and then reauthorize it to another computer?

[rydan]

Originally Posted by lagavulin16

Can I later deauthorize it from that computer and then reauthorize it to another computer?

Yes, but in that case you need to move the license to a syncrosoft dongle, and then back to the other computer. Guess if your computer crashed and burned Waldorf would give you another unlock, but that's the easy way to do it.

[colinmiller]

I am constantly thankful for dongles.

For example last week my system took a dump. Pro Tools simply wouldn't launch. Reinstalling with a clean install had no effect and the problem was clearly with the OS. Clean reinstalling the OS had no effect meaning the problem was clearly outside of the System folder. I was able to wipe the drive, install a new OS, PT, simply drag my plugins folder to the new system and was back up and running again.

Had it not been for dongles, I would have had to spend another day re-registering, getting codes, etc etc. And as someone who likes to often wipe everything clean and start new, the dongles are critical. As someone who travels from place to place the dongles are critical. As someone who often likes to have multiple OSes to try new versions of software and OSes while still having a known stable one to rely on dongles have been critical.

My life would be miserable without these dongles, so I kind o chuckle every time someone gripes about them being a burden for consumers.

[rydan]

Originally Posted by colinmiller

I am constantly thankful for dongles.

For example last week my system took a dump. Pro Tools simply wouldn't launch. Reinstalling with a clean install had no effect and the problem was clearly with the OS. Clean reinstalling the OS had no effect meaning the problem was clearly outside of the System folder. I was able to wipe the drive, install a new OS, PT, simply drag my plugins folder to the new system and was back up and running again.

Had it not been for dongles, I would have had to spend another day re-registering, getting codes, etc etc. And as someone who likes to often wipe everything clean and start new, the dongles are critical. As someone who travels from place to place the dongles are critical. As someone who often likes to have multiple OSes to try new versions of software and OSes while still having a known stable one to rely on dongles have been critical.

My life would be miserable without these dongles, so I kind o chuckle every time someone gripes about them being a burden for consumers.

Oh, really. Take Cytomic The Glue for instance. A prime example of a really good plugin with great customer policies. If my computer broke down, I would reinstall, copy the plugin to the new plugin folder, and it would work. Gee. Without a dongle. Strange, isn't it?

[Nuno_F]

Originally Posted by rydan

Guess if your computer crashed and burned Waldorf would give you another unlock, but that's the easy way to do it.

guessing these things is not always a good idea.

[Nuno_F]

Originally Posted by lagavulin16

Lots of dongle based software has been cracked.

And lot's haven't.

[rydan]

Originally Posted by Nuno_F

guessing these things is not always a good idea.

Nopes. And you will not always get a straight answer from the manufacturer, which is yet another reason to stay clear of software with dongles or other "only one use" copy protections.

[lagavulin16]

Originally Posted by colinmiller

I am constantly thankful for dongles.

For example last week my system took a dump. Pro Tools simply wouldn't launch. Reinstalling with a clean install had no effect and the problem was clearly with the OS. Clean reinstalling the OS had no effect meaning the problem was clearly outside of the System folder. I was able to wipe the drive, install a new OS, PT, simply drag my plugins folder to the new system and was back up and running again.

Had it not been for dongles, I would have had to spend another day re-registering, getting codes, etc etc. And as someone who likes to often wipe everything clean and start new, the dongles are critical. As someone who travels from place to place the dongles are critical. As someone who often likes to have multiple OSes to try new versions of software and OSes while still having a known stable one to rely on dongles have been critical.

My life would be miserable without these dongles, so I kind o chuckle every time someone gripes about them being a burden for consumers.

You should really read 7rojo7's posts on page 9 of this thread. If you're still chuckling then, you've gotta be pretty heartless.

While I understand that some people prefer dongles, I can very clearly understand why many people don't. I have never used and don't plan on ever using dongle based software.

[lagavulin16]

Originally Posted by Nuno_F

And lot's haven't.

The only one I know of is the newest version of Cubase.

[colinmiller]

Originally Posted by lagavulin16

You should really read 7rojo7's posts on page 9 of this thread. If you're still chuckling then, you've gotta be pretty heartless.

While I understand that some people prefer dongles, I can very clearly understand why many people don't. I have never used and don't plan on ever using dongle based software.

Heartless? Nonsense. As I said, my life would be miserable without dongles. That's not heartless. I will never use non-dongle based software again. If something is not available with dongle support, I absolutely will not buy it.

And if a software company does not offer some type of copy protection, I will NOT buy it.

[colinmiller]

Originally Posted by rydan

Oh, really. Take Cytomic The Glue for instance. A prime example of a really good plugin with great customer policies. If my computer broke down, I would reinstall, copy the plugin to the new plugin folder, and it would work. Gee. Without a dongle. Strange, isn't it?

Yes and I am sure that if my business depended on that sole obscure plugin then I would be set. But it doesn't. And only obscure software companies who's product is not in high enough demand can not worry about large scale piracy.

I refuse to use software by such companies because they are not looking out for me as a customer. if they offer no protection for their software, then they become a liability. I cannot have my business depend on a company who could easily be put out of business by piracy or who's support could easily be stunted due to piracy. If they aren't serious about protecting their product, then they aren't serious about protecting me.

In the example you provided it's more likely due to that company being a one man operation that can't afford such protection. And not enough of a customer base for it to be an issue. But if everyone were using that company which makes only one plugin, then they would be forced to use copy protection like everyone else. So far from a fair comparison.

[lagavulin16]

Originally Posted by colinmiller

Yes and I am sure that if my business depended on that sole obscure plugin then I would be set. But it doesn't. And only obscure software companies who's product is not in high enough demand can not worry about large scale piracy.

I refuse to use software by such companies because they are not looking out for me as a customer. if they offer no protection for their software, then they become a liability. I cannot have my business depend on a company who could easily be put out of business by piracy or who's support could easily be stunted due to piracy. If they aren't serious about protecting their product, then they aren't serious about protecting me.

In the example you provided it's more likely due to that company being a one man operation that can't afford such protection. And not enough of a customer base for it to be an issue. But if everyone were using that company which makes only one plugin, then they would be forced to use copy protection like everyone else. So far from a fair comparison.

Reminder: Dongles don't prevent piracy. You can like them for all kinds of reasons, but that is not one of them.

Reminder: Plenty of very successful, high end, and popular software companies are able to protect their products and their customers without treating their customers as suspected criminals or insult them with dongles.

FXpansion, Fabfilter, Apple, Native Instruments, u-he, PSP, etc.

[lagavulin16]

Originally Posted by colinmiller

Heartless? Nonsense. As I said, my life would be miserable without dongles. That's not heartless. I will never use non-dongle based software again. If something is not available with dongle support, I absolutely will not buy it.

And if a software company does not offer some type of copy protection, I will NOT buy it.

I'm just saying that you said you chuckled whenever someone said they were inconvenienced by them. Go read that guy's posts on page nine, sounds like a complete nightmare, and one that would be completely avoidable without draconian dongles.

I think the best companies can give their customers a choice between a dongle (so people like you are happy) and serials (so people like me are).

[kreeper_6]

I can't stand how long it takes for ilok plugs and such to load up once they are inserted!