protools gain structure

[Ken Breezy]

I have a few questions regarding confingurations for optimal gain structure in protools. here it goes.
1. I'm using a digi 002, how do you know what the configuration is? {-18dbV = 0 dbFS} What I mean is how do I set this configuration.

2. with this configuration does it mean that if I clip [protools meter], whille tracking, it is actually at -18dbV

3. I track mostly synths and some vocals, I know that synths are line level. I also heard that they have an output of -20dbV , do I need a preamp before the DI to get optimal gain. If so, which one is good for synths.

3. Then whille mixing should I lower the faders so peaks only hit at -6db, thus giving enough head room to add dynamics and for mastering.

4. Whille recording synths on my protools 002 should i have the switch in the back at +4 pro or -10 semipro

Thanks in advance
Ken Breezy

[Ken Breezy]

anyone?

[JonCraig]

Originally posted by Ken Breezy
I have a few questions regarding confingurations for optimal gain structure in protools. here it goes.
1. I'm using a digi 002, how do you know what the configuration is? {-18dbV = 0 dbFS} What I mean is how do I set this configuration.

i believe it is set factory... not sure.

2. with this configuration does it mean that if I clip [protools meter], whille tracking, it is actually at -18dbV

theoretically, if you clip in pro tools, you've clipped the hardware output... ie you're squarewaving there. now i'm not sure whether or not you're clipping because you've hit the voltage rails of the box, or, (more likely) you've simply run out of bits in the summing bus, and pro tools can't tell a sample to be louder. either way, the effect is the same: squared off output.

3. I track mostly synths and some vocals, I know that synths are line level. I also heard that they have an output of -20dbV , do I need a preamp before the DI to get optimal gain. If so, which one is good for synths.

try it both ways and see! i would imagine that the output will vary from synth to synth. a pre is probably a good idea, though. which one is good? there are about 632,845,658,451 threads on preamps. search for 'em.

3. Then whille mixing should I lower the faders so peaks only hit at -6db, thus giving enough head room to add dynamics and for mastering.

there are two number threes!!! your master fader will let you know how you're doing there. i've never heard a -6dB rule; i'd imagine you'd want to use all the bits you have (ie get the signal hot and close to 0), and let the mastering guy turn it down later. (of course, he's just gonna compress the hell out of it and boost 3k, )

4. Whille recording synths on my protools 002 should i have the switch in the back at +4 pro or -10 semipro

if your input is +4 (as in a preamp), then use the +4 switch. if you're trying the synths plugged straight into the 002, use the -10. if it's too hot, switch to +4.

hope this helps,

--jon

[maxiemixer]

The reference level in 002 is set at -18. That means that if you send a sine wave at the operating level of the mixer (ie 0dB VU on your VU meter) and the mixer is at +4dB you'll get a voltage of 1,23 volts as reference level. To lip the input or the output of your 002 you have to reach the maximum level (in your case 18dB above the reference level. This margin is allocated for the peaks that your program will have. A bass drum or snare will peak at +24 if you don't control it with a compressor so to get an undistorted or unclipped recording you will have to reduce the gain by 6dB. or you can use a compressor prior the interface to reduce the peaks by 6 dB so that you'll be able to record at 0dB VU (-18dB) without clipping the peaks.

[Mike Brown]

Originally Posted by Ken Breezy

I have a few questions regarding confingurations for optimal gain structure in protools. here it goes.
1. I'm using a digi 002, how do you know what the configuration is? {-18dbV = 0 dbFS} What I mean is how do I set this configuration.

2. with this configuration does it mean that if I clip [protools meter], whille tracking, it is actually at -18dbV

3. I track mostly synths and some vocals, I know that synths are line level. I also heard that they have an output of -20dbV , do I need a preamp before the DI to get optimal gain. If so, which one is good for synths.

3. Then whille mixing should I lower the faders so peaks only hit at -6db, thus giving enough head room to add dynamics and for mastering.

4. Whille recording synths on my protools 002 should i have the switch in the back at +4 pro or -10 semipro

Thanks in advance
Ken Breezy

Originally Posted by JonCraig

there are two number threes!!! your master fader will let you know how you're doing there. i've never heard a -6dB rule; i'd imagine you'd want to use all the bits you have (ie get the signal hot and close to 0), and let the mastering guy turn it down later. (of course, he's just gonna compress the hell out of it and boost 3k, )

Lots of good info in JonCraig's post.... but ignore this section!


My advice for setting levels:

On a typical console, hitting around 0 VU will leave you 20+ dB of headroom before it even STARTS to distort (and then the distortion could sound pretty good!).

Averaging your level in pro tools so its around halfway up the meter will only leave you 10 dB of headroom before HORRIBLE clipping happens!

Set your levels so the absolute LOUDEST thing that will happen will "peak" around -6 (like you mentioned in your first post). Not only will this prevent you from clipping, but it will also allow you to mix without worrying too much about overloading your mix buss.

While mixing, route all your tracks to an aux input (this becomes your mix buss) and then have a monitor fader monitoring the physical output to your monitors.

Keep your mix below "using all the bits" (peaking around -3 to -6) and then let the mastering engineer bring the level up to 0 dBFS for CD duplication.



I PERSONALLY GUARANTEE to all those out there who are "using all the bits" that by recording a lower signal into your digital systems your resulting mix will be much easier to do, and much much clearer sounding. The difference will be night and day.

Lots and lots of reasons why... do some searches and you will come up with tons of info.

[Mike Brown]

Originally Posted by maxiemixer

The reference level in 002 is set at -18. That means that if you send a sine wave at the operating level of the mixer (ie 0dB VU on your VU meter) and the mixer is at +4dB you'll get a voltage of 1,23 volts as reference level. To lip the input or the output of your 002 you have to reach the maximum level (in your case 18dB above the reference level. This margin is allocated for the peaks that your program will have. A bass drum or snare will peak at +24 if you don't control it with a compressor so to get an undistorted or unclipped recording you will have to reduce the gain by 6dB. or you can use a compressor prior the interface to reduce the peaks by 6 dB so that you'll be able to record at 0dB VU (-18dB) without clipping the peaks.

?

You don't "need" a compressor to record a kick or a snare. And you are confusing 0VU, dBFS, dBu etc

[s.d.finley]

The original post was 6 years ago!!!

[Mike Brown]

Originally Posted by s.d.finley

The original post was 6 years ago!!!

Yowza! My bad.

At least I wasn't the guy who dug it up!

[Raw-Tracks]

Originally Posted by maxiemixer

The reference level in 002 is set at -18. .

Original post may have been 6 years ago, however, for the sake of good information, the reference level of the 002 as well as the 003 is -14dBfs = +4dBu = 0dBVU