Apogee Duet causes Kernal Panics - Page 2

hatzalam · 16th March 2008

The last I heard from Apogee was on February 11th, where Jay Wolf, a tech support specialist, wrote to me:

Engineering is the process of finalizing the driver for a new software release that should resolve the issue you experiencing.

Again, this was a month ago. I really hope they release this soon. It should have been released already, as far as I'm concerned.

kincept · 18th March 2008

Are you saying above that I cant plug the DUET into the macbookpro while its on?
I have to shut off the macbook pro? then plug it in at start up?

thats not what they show on the apogee website.

Virtuoso · 18th March 2008

I'm having the same problem - changing sample rate results in a kernel panic.

This is on a brand new 8 core 3.2GHz Mac Pro with 16Gb of RAM, running Logic Pro 8.01 on OS 10.5.2.

I was having the exact same issue with my Presonus Firepod, which is why I bought the Apogee Duet. Very annoying to find it's still happening, but perhaps this means it's an Apple rather than an Apogee problem?

Either way, I don't know what to do now - should I return the Duet or hang tight and hope for a fix?

halcyo · 18th March 2008

I also have the 'missing pop up screens' problem on occasion. It usually stays 'broken' until the computer is restarted.

On a WAY more irritating note - my Duet seems to be sending pretty SEVERE radio wave/noise through my monitors. At first I thought it was just a shitty unshielded cable, or perhaps my monitors themselves (but I never had this problem before with them). Basically I have a kind of white noise with something that sounds like radio interference. Strangely, certain actions in my system cause the noise to cut in and out or skip, like loading up samples into ram, and opening applications.

I have discovered only ONE thing that makes the noise go SILENT - If I have a Stickies note open on screen, and I go to drag the note, the noise goes quiet while I am holding down the mouse button on the 'move bar' of the Stickies note! WEIRD! (Doesn't seem like a bad cable to me?!)

The Duet is the only new addition to my system, which had no noise before this. Don't get me wrong, I like the Duet alot (in theory, at least), but I guess I'll have to contact apogee and figure out what to do.

halcyo

Dysanfel · 19th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by kincept

Are you saying above that I cant plug the DUET into the macbookpro while its on?
I have to shut off the macbook pro? then plug it in at start up?

thats not what they show on the apogee website.

No, the Duet can be unplugged and replugged in while the Macbook Pro is on, and with out issue. Maestro always detects the Duet.

Dysanfel · 19th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by halcyo

On a WAY more irritating note - my Duet seems to be sending pretty SEVERE radio wave/noise through my monitors.

Check other electronics that could be emitting RF. When the dishwasher is on in my kitchen I get slight pops and clicks.

Francis Vaughan · 19th March 2008

Quote:

On a WAY more irritating note - my Duet seems to be sending pretty SEVERE radio wave/noise through my monitors.

I doubt it is the Duet of itself here. I have come across similar totally weird noises in Mac laptops. Not even being sent to speakers, but quite literally coming out of the Mac. The answer seems to be issues with switching power supplies in the Mac. They can change their operation conditions - especially pulse width - very quickly, and will do so in response to changing power demands in the machine. Quite literally as the processor, memory, graphics system, and subsystems all change activity, the power draw can change dramatically. And in response to different patterns of user activity. There are lots of such power supplies in machines now.

My suspicion is that you have a leakage path that allows energy from the Mac to make it to your monitors via the Firewire cable and the Duet. You might find that a couple of clip on ferrite suppression cores kills the interference. Try on both the FW cable and the audio cables.

hatzalam · 19th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dysanfel

No, the Duet can be unplugged and replugged in while the Macbook Pro is on, and with out issue. Maestro always detects the Duet.

It doesn't on my computer. There have been times that my computer had a kernel panic when I plugged in the Duet while already powered on. And even a few times that I didn't get a kernel panic, Maestro--which I set to automatically open when the Duet is plugged in--didn't open.

Right now, for example, I have my Duet plugged in. There are no pop-ups. Where is Apogee in all of this? I still haven't gotten an email response. I know other manufacturers read these forums... what about Apogee?

morebutter · 22nd March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by xaipemw

It doesn't on my computer. There have been times that my computer had a kernel panic when I plugged in the Duet while already powered on. And even a few times that I didn't get a kernel panic, Maestro--which I set to automatically open when the Duet is plugged in--didn't open.

Right now, for example, I have my Duet plugged in. There are no pop-ups. Where is Apogee in all of this? I still haven't gotten an email response. I know other manufacturers read these forums... what about Apogee?

I too have kernel panics when I hot plug my Duet into my Macbook Pro/4GB RAM. I think this has been happening since I installed Leopard although maybe I didnt how plug it before I dont recall.

I always thought that hot plugging firewire devices was OK.

hatzalam · 23rd March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by morebutter

I too have kernel panics when I hot plug my Duet into my Macbook Pro/4GB RAM. I think this has been happening since I installed Leopard although maybe I didnt how plug it before I dont recall.

I always thought that hot plugging firewire devices was OK.

One of the original tenets of the IEE 1394/Firewire was that hot-plugging would be fine. I do it all the time on other firewire interfaces, such as camcorders and hard drives.

Also, I never had a problem hot-plugging my Presonus Firebox in my computer.

flwehr · 23rd March 2008

One more with the same prblem here - Mac Pro with 16 GB, Ensemble. Worked flawlessly under 10.4, since Leopard upgrade I get the multilingual kernel panics consistently when (1) Ensemble is powered up after Mac is up and running (2) CPU wakes from deep sleep with Ensemble on.

Other than that it it very stable - no issues within Logic or any other app. Still annoying, hoping for a fix soon - I liked leaving the computer to sleep, since it is a power hog.

Fred

kingswood6 · 23rd March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by flwehr

One more with the same prblem here - Mac Pro with 16 GB, Ensemble. Worked flawlessly under 10.4, since Leopard upgrade I get the multilingual kernel panics consistently when (1) Ensemble is powered up after Mac is up and running (2) CPU wakes from deep sleep with Ensemble on.

Other than that it it very stable - no issues within Logic or any other app. Still annoying, hoping for a fix soon - I liked leaving the computer to sleep, since it is a power hog.

Fred

Fred, have you run Cubase or Nuendo 4.1 on your rig?

My Logic experiences with the Ensemble are the same as you report, but I get more kernel panics in Cubase and Nuendo under Leopard (when starting or restarting the apps, or changing sample rates). Apogee says it is a known issue with some users with over 2GB(!) of RAM, and they've been working on a fix for a while.

Thanks and regards,

Bill

Mac Quad (2 x dual 3ghz), 4 gigs RAM, Leopard 10.5.2.

Virtuoso · 25th March 2008

Getting very pissed off with this issue now. I've just sent this to Apogee support...

"Since moving to the Apogee Duet, I'm getting very frequent kernel panics. I am running a new 2008 8 core 3.2GHz Mac Pro with 16Gb of RAM under OS 10.5.2 using both Logic 8 and Cubase 4. This is a studio machine in a video production environment and no non-essential software is installed. The problem seems to be connected in some way to the sample rate - just changing the rate ALWAYS triggers a kernel panic and switching applications triggers a panic EVERY time. This is driving me mad - I bought the Apogee expecting it to be rock solid and it's the worst hardware experience I've had on either the Mac or the PC platform. So far tonight, trying to finish a project, I've had EIGHT kernel panics."

GCL · 25th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virtuoso

Getting very pissed off with this issue now. I've just sent this to Apogee support...

"Since moving to the Apogee Duet, I'm getting very frequent kernel panics. I am running a new 2008 8 core 3.2GHz Mac Pro with 16Gb of RAM under OS 10.5.2 using both Logic 8 and Cubase 4. This is a studio machine in a video production environment and no non-essential software is installed. The problem seems to be connected in some way to the sample rate - just changing the rate ALWAYS triggers a kernel panic and switching applications triggers a panic EVERY time. This is driving me mad - I bought the Apogee expecting it to be rock solid and it's the worst hardware experience I've had on either the Mac or the PC platform. So far tonight, trying to finish a project, I've had EIGHT kernel panics."

This is exactly the reason why I started this thread, I'm still having the exact same problem.

Apogee, can you please show that you respect us and give us a progress report?

hatzalam · 26th March 2008

Seriously. No progress report for over a month. I'm getting close to bailing and getting a Fireface 400.

Virtuoso · 26th March 2008

Vague response from Apogee below. Are they basically just waiting for Apple to fix this in 10.5.3? Wonder if I should just return it and buy one when their advertised Leopard compatibility actually works...

"Hello,

I apologize that you are having problems. This is a known issue that some users are experiencing. Most often, it is happening to users with large amounts of RAM installed. We are working hard on a fix and there should be a release that addresses this problem. Again, I apologize for the inconvenience and I appreciate your patience."

GCL · 27th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virtuoso

Vague response from Apogee below. Are they basically just waiting for Apple to fix this in 10.5.3? Wonder if I should just return it and buy one when their advertised Leopard compatibility actually works...

"Hello,

I apologize that you are having problems. This is a known issue that some users are experiencing. Most often, it is happening to users with large amounts of RAM installed. We are working hard on a fix and there should be a release that addresses this problem. Again, I apologize for the inconvenience and I appreciate your patience."

Thanks for that, but this is the same response we've gotten for months from them. How long does it take, I wonder, to fix this type of thing? 5 months so far since the October release of the last Duet driver. Maybe they are rewriting the driver from scratch.

Apogee sure knows how to make hardware, but software is another story.

Every time I see an Apogee Duet or Ensemble ad in a music mag, I'm thinking how everything they say sounds simply wonderful, but we all know the real story. I just won't trust anything they say anymore. Their Ensemble issues from DAY 1 are legendary now. Thank God for forums like this.

kingswood6 · 27th March 2008

Yes, I got almost the same reply from Apogee. No fix for months.

Nice sounding units--when they work.

I will never buy another thing from Apogee, and I regret my purchase.

Regards,

Bill

Max · 27th March 2008

Quote:

I doubt it is the Duet of itself here. I have come across similar totally weird noises in Mac laptops.

Quote:

I was having the exact same issue with my Presonus Firepod, which is why I bought the Apogee Duet. Very annoying to find it's still happening, but perhaps this means it's an Apple rather than an Apogee problem?

We are aware of this issue with non-specific FireWire interfaces resulting in a Mac kernel panic. As we have stated before, the issue is exacerbated when greater than 2 GB of memory is installed in the Mac.

We are working to help resolve the issue and hope to see an update in the very near future.

hatzalam · 28th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max

We are aware of this issue with non-specific FireWire interfaces resulting in a Mac kernel panic. As we have stated before, the issue is exacerbated when greater than 2 GB of memory is installed in the Mac.

We are working to help resolve the issue and hope to see an update in the very near future.

It's good to finally hear from Apogee in this regard.

Is this update also going to address the spotty performance of the Duet pop-ups?

Virtuoso · 28th March 2008

Yay! Today's Mac Pro EFI update has fixed this issue for me. I can swap apps and sample rates without problems now.

SaxJordan · 28th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virtuoso

Yay! Today's Mac Pro EFI update has fixed this issue for me. I can swap apps and sample rates without problems now.

Same here, and it also made the fan on my Mac Pro significantly quieter. I'm a happy camper. Thank you Apple for actually doing something right in the post-iPhone era

unvs · 28th March 2008

Hope they put out a fix for iMacs and MBPs too.

GCL · 28th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virtuoso

Yay! Today's Mac Pro EFI update has fixed this issue for me. I can swap apps and sample rates without problems now.

Apparently this update does not cover first generation Mac Pro 8-cores, so I'm STILL having all the same problems with the Apogee DUET.

John_McEnroe · 28th March 2008

How does one know if they have a first generation mac pro 8-core?

I was excited to see this issue was resolved as I am about to buy an Ensemble, but now im nervous that I have a first gen 8-core.

Is there anything i can look at to see what generation 8-core mac I have?

GCL · 28th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_McEnroe

How does one know if they have a first generation mac pro 8-core?

I was excited to see this issue was resolved as I am about to buy an Ensemble, but now im nervous that I have a first gen 8-core.

Is there anything i can look at to see what generation 8-core mac I have?

The 8-cores that were release Spring '07 are first gen, as opposed to the early '08 models. Different specs too.

John_McEnroe · 28th March 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by GCL

The 8-cores that were release Spring '07 are first gen, as opposed to the early '08 models. Different specs too.

Ok great thanks for the reply. Guess im safe to get an ensemble.

cali316 · 29th March 2008

Well guys, don't celebrate too soon. After a night of working with zero kernel panics, I got one this morning... Woohoo!!!

Chain of events:
Ensemble - off
Launched Logic (forgetting that the Ensemble was still off - hey... it's early...)
Ensemble - powered on
Weeeeeeeeeee - kernel panic!

And this is a recent Mac Pro tower purchased about 2 weeks ago.

Nothing like spending over $2500 on a new Mac Pro tower / around 2 grand for the Ensemble / another $1400 on the Big Ben and I can't even use the $150 worth of extra ram I purchased...

This is what I feel like doing to my rig right now... dfegad

kingswood6 · 29th March 2008

"apogee quality. apple integration. absolute simplicity."

tutt

hatzalam · 30th March 2008

Macbook Pro here... still getting kernel panics. And actually now, getting crashes with both Garageband AND Logic. Grrr..

29th March 2008	#59
kingswood6 Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 132	"apogee quality. apple integration. absolute simplicity." tutt Last edited by kingswood6; 29th March 2008 at 10:16 PM.. Reason: typo, brevity

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16th March 2008	#31
hatzalam Gear nut Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Milwaukee Posts: 95	The last I heard from Apogee was on February 11th, where Jay Wolf, a tech support specialist, wrote to me: Engineering is the process of finalizing the driver for a new software release that should resolve the issue you experiencing. Again, this was a month ago. I really hope they release this soon. It should have been released already, as far as I'm concerned.

18th March 2008	#32
kincept Gear maniac Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 290	Are you saying above that I cant plug the DUET into the macbookpro while its on? I have to shut off the macbook pro? then plug it in at start up? thats not what they show on the apogee website.

18th March 2008	#33
Virtuoso Gear nut Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Seattle Posts: 86	I'm having the same problem - changing sample rate results in a kernel panic. This is on a brand new 8 core 3.2GHz Mac Pro with 16Gb of RAM, running Logic Pro 8.01 on OS 10.5.2. I was having the exact same issue with my Presonus Firepod, which is why I bought the Apogee Duet. Very annoying to find it's still happening, but perhaps this means it's an Apple rather than an Apogee problem? Either way, I don't know what to do now - should I return the Duet or hang tight and hope for a fix?

18th March 2008	#34
halcyo Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Cincinnati Ohio Posts: 739 2 Reviews written	I also have the 'missing pop up screens' problem on occasion. It usually stays 'broken' until the computer is restarted. On a WAY more irritating note - my Duet seems to be sending pretty SEVERE radio wave/noise through my monitors. At first I thought it was just a shitty unshielded cable, or perhaps my monitors themselves (but I never had this problem before with them). Basically I have a kind of white noise with something that sounds like radio interference. Strangely, certain actions in my system cause the noise to cut in and out or skip, like loading up samples into ram, and opening applications. I have discovered only ONE thing that makes the noise go SILENT - If I have a Stickies note open on screen, and I go to drag the note, the noise goes quiet while I am holding down the mouse button on the 'move bar' of the Stickies note! WEIRD! (Doesn't seem like a bad cable to me?!) The Duet is the only new addition to my system, which had no noise before this. Don't get me wrong, I like the Duet alot (in theory, at least), but I guess I'll have to contact apogee and figure out what to do. halcyo

23rd March 2008	#41
flwehr Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Perth Australia Posts: 41	One more with the same prblem here - Mac Pro with 16 GB, Ensemble. Worked flawlessly under 10.4, since Leopard upgrade I get the multilingual kernel panics consistently when (1) Ensemble is powered up after Mac is up and running (2) CPU wakes from deep sleep with Ensemble on. Other than that it it very stable - no issues within Logic or any other app. Still annoying, hoping for a fix soon - I liked leaving the computer to sleep, since it is a power hog. Fred

25th March 2008	#43
Virtuoso Gear nut Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Seattle Posts: 86	Getting very pissed off with this issue now. I've just sent this to Apogee support... "Since moving to the Apogee Duet, I'm getting very frequent kernel panics. I am running a new 2008 8 core 3.2GHz Mac Pro with 16Gb of RAM under OS 10.5.2 using both Logic 8 and Cubase 4. This is a studio machine in a video production environment and no non-essential software is installed. The problem seems to be connected in some way to the sample rate - just changing the rate ALWAYS triggers a kernel panic and switching applications triggers a panic EVERY time. This is driving me mad - I bought the Apogee expecting it to be rock solid and it's the worst hardware experience I've had on either the Mac or the PC platform. So far tonight, trying to finish a project, I've had EIGHT kernel panics."

26th March 2008	#45
hatzalam Gear nut Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Milwaukee Posts: 95	Seriously. No progress report for over a month. I'm getting close to bailing and getting a Fireface 400.

27th March 2008	#48
kingswood6 Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 132	Yes, I got almost the same reply from Apogee. No fix for months. Nice sounding units--when they work. I will never buy another thing from Apogee, and I regret my purchase. Regards, Bill

28th March 2008	#51
Virtuoso Gear nut Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Seattle Posts: 86	Yay! Today's Mac Pro EFI update has fixed this issue for me. I can swap apps and sample rates without problems now.

28th March 2008	#53
unvs Gear interested Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3	Hope they put out a fix for iMacs and MBPs too.

28th March 2008	#55
John_McEnroe Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 329	How does one know if they have a first generation mac pro 8-core? I was excited to see this issue was resolved as I am about to buy an Ensemble, but now im nervous that I have a first gen 8-core. Is there anything i can look at to see what generation 8-core mac I have?

29th March 2008	#58
cali316 Gear interested Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 5	Well guys, don't celebrate too soon. After a night of working with zero kernel panics, I got one this morning... Woohoo!!! Chain of events: Ensemble - off Launched Logic (forgetting that the Ensemble was still off - hey... it's early...) Ensemble - powered on Weeeeeeeeeee - kernel panic! And this is a recent Mac Pro tower purchased about 2 weeks ago. Nothing like spending over $2500 on a new Mac Pro tower / around 2 grand for the Ensemble / another $1400 on the Big Ben and I can't even use the $150 worth of extra ram I purchased... This is what I feel like doing to my rig right now... dfegad

30th March 2008	#60
hatzalam Gear nut Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Milwaukee Posts: 95	Macbook Pro here... still getting kernel panics. And actually now, getting crashes with both Garageband AND Logic. Grrr..