Logic Studio Virtual Instruments and Plug Ins compared to stock Digi

[Sean Sullivan]

I get a pretty insane academic discount on Logic Studio and I'm thinking about giving it a try. One of my main problems with Pro Tools LE is the need to buy some plug ins. Digidesign Velvet is expensive, as is Native Instruments B4, and although a lot of software developers give academic discounts I couldn't even buy Velvet for the cost of Logic Studio. So, how do the virtual instruments that come with Logic compare to others? How are the plug ins? In a nutshell, how many of you use the stock Logic plug ins even though you may have nicer, more expensive ones?

[barryjohns]

There is not comparison. Logic Soft Synths are stellar. Their plugs are top notch for stock plugs. I personally have no use for any Digi Plug, LE or HD. Some will say the EQ is ok, but I always found it lacking. Dverb is horrible.

Logic 8 is a no brainer when comparing to Protools LE.

[Nordkrog]

In my opinion the new low price for Logic is unbelievable. And if you can get it with an insane discount, just tke the bills out of your wallets NOW

I have used Logic for years and have used from time to time PT LE as well. Untill one year ago I almost only used Logic's own plug-ins - and when I had to do something in PT I was forced to use their stock plug-ins as well.

To me the PT stock plugs sounds not very good, and compared to Logic's plugs they fall behind.
Beside that the compressors and EQ's of Logic sounds way better that the PT ones, you also get the space designer (not as good as Altiverb that I use now, but still very nice, and sometmes use it over Altiverb) the delay designer (AMAZING), a nice sampler EXS (I still use this every day - but not with the stock sound library. The library is not bad, but, well...) a nice Rhodes/Wurlitzer EP88 (I use A LOT) and a very nice Organ. The guitar Amp Sim is actually more than okay (But I prefer Waves GTR3).
Not to mention the bunch of synths and the drum machine you get with Logic...

Today I use the Waves vintage stuff, Altiverb, URS Pro and Soundtoys when mixing. These plug's outshines the stock plugin's of Logic, but hey, they cost something like 4 times the price of the entire Logic Studio!!!!

[Energie]

D-verb

hahahahahahaa

what a joke of a plug



Though there is actually like an ambient setting on their, or very short reverb patch that isn't so bad to adding some room type sound for an efx for VO matching.

[Lwilliam]

I'm a pretty die-hard PT user, but I have to admit the stock plugins that come with Logic are better than the Digi stock plugins. They are certainly more plentiful. I do end up using the Digi EQIII and DynamicsIII a lot. They are as good as the "regular" (not phase linear) EQ and Compressors with Logic.

PT only comes with Expand! as a virtual instrument (and a limited version of Reason and Live). I do use Expand a LOT as it's got some really good sounds. However, the Logic VIs/Synths are way more versatile than Expand! Expand is nice, but no match for a real sampler like EXS, and the other synths that ship with Logic.

Space Designer, Delay Designer - nothing like it with PT. Unless you spring for the $495 Music Production Toolkit, you don't get a decent reverb or real synth with PT. D-verb is pretty much useless. Any sound I get with it would be as good or better with Space Designer (Logic's reverb), and the longer reverbs are really bad with D-verb.

I don't think you'll find anyone to contend that even at $499, Logic Studio is a great deal. At a student discount...yeah, just do it.

[Sean Sullivan]

The thing I'm worried about is I use a MacBook, which only has 1 firewire port, and a Digidesign 002R, and I'm pretty sure there is an issue with Logic and firewire interfaces, no? Or Firewire interfaces and external hard drives?

[jeremycox]

Originally Posted by upinflames

The thing I'm worried about is I use a MacBook, which only has 1 firewire port, and a Digidesign 002R, and I'm pretty sure there is an issue with Logic and firewire interfaces, no? Or Firewire interfaces and external hard drives?

Logic works great with a 002. The only limitation is going to be the processing power of your macbook.

[nativeaudio]

Some Logic newbies may not know this, but these plugins weren't originally stock plugins - several of these, like the sampler and the convulsion reverb were separate products that cost several hundred dollars each (and got stellar reviews when they were not free). They were later bundled with Logic after the Apple takeover (when Logic was $999 or whatever). Then Apple lowered the price by 50% and included a large sound library as well, and all this is of course only part of a 'war' - a desire to make Apple/Logic market leaders.

I guess this background is the reason that they have now have built up a reputation of including stock plugins that are much, much better that one would expect from stock plugins. You can easily produce an album without using additional plugins, and the focus these plugins have got from the developers is so high that some people even complain that these resources rather should have been put into making Logic more competitive in other areas (like elastic time). You can always buy an EQ, compressor or softsynth, but you can't integrate pitch or audio editing 100% into Logic's arrange window by purchasing a plugin.

Time will show if they have the resources to compete in all the relevant areas - but at the moment, I think the plugins combined with the revamped user interface are Logic 8's strongest selling points.

[Sean Sullivan]

So, I found out I don't get quite the discount I thought on Logic, just the standard 17% off that you get on all Apple products as a student. So, I can spend $449 for Logic Studio or I'm guessing this would be comparable equals in the Pro Tools world:

Logic: Delay Designer
Pro Tools: ???

Logic: Space Designer
Pro Tools: TL Space: $99

Logic: Guitar Amp Pro
Pro Tools: AmpliTube 2: $320

Logic: Creative and Production Effects
Pro Tools: Waves Gold: $600

Logic: Studio Instruments
Pro Tools: Reason 4.0 (I could break it down instrument by instrument, but I would guess that Reason 4.0 sounds are more comparable than say, EVP88 to Digidesign Velvet)

So, would it be far to say that I can spend under $500 on Logic Studio or nearly $1500 to get comparable plug ins for Pro Tools?

[H-Rezz]

Originally Posted by upinflames

So, would it be far to say that I can spend under $500 on Logic Studio or nearly $1500 to get comparable plug ins for Pro Tools?

Even more, don't forget Logic also comes with 3 other apps plus a 50gig Library above and beyond your Effects and SoftSynths, SoftSamplers,Convolution Reverbs...etc

[Stiff]

Logic Studio offers a lot more, some which are really good (Space Designer as mentioned). I like the Digirack EQ3 better than any EQ in Logic, the compressor is also good. Xpand! is an instrument that is really good for songwriting. But overall the Logic package is way more complete.

I don't, however, think it's really fair to list a couple of Logic instruments or effects and then compare them to other companies same type of plug-ins (i.e Guitar Amp Pro vs Amplitube or Eleven), because in most cases I certainly wouldn't go with the Logic ones.

[Roger Starr]

Logic has simply by far the best inhouse plugs and instruments in the market. Cubase (still lacking a lot on this), Nuendo, Sonar (also quite nice buy the way), Digital Performar are not getting close at all!

Protools LE is not to be put on one line with Protools HD by the way. LE is what has been mentioned here above, but HD is a total different league. HD has great plugs and especially is fully packed much better then Logic. But, a full blown HD is soooo much more expensive too. For low budget, Logic is the way to go...

Regards,

Roger

[tamasdragon]

For the record, I have used logic 8 only one time, didn't like it, but that's another story. But from my own experience the protools built-in plugs (namely eq and comp digirack 3) are very good plugs, beating many others. Dverb is not altiverb, that's for sure, but if you use it with a eq after, can do many things, just require more experimentation. For me the logic comp and eq just didn't cut it, although probably I would need more time before I can make a definate statement.
Tamas Dragon

[n8tron]

I switched to logic for this exact reason. I would have cost me about a grand to get the plugins I wanted, and logic had them all for half that price, plus... a new DAW. It also helped that I was frustrated with the limitations of LE even though I loved the pro tools work flow.

Honestly though, take a look at the work flow of logic and make sure if fits. I personally ended up liking it but you may or may not. That is what counts. If there is about a grand difference in switching or buying plugs for pro tools you have to keep in mind that whatever choice you make its better to stick with it. If you were to buy plugins for pro tools you'd be buying personalized individually selected plugs, whereas with logic you would be "stuck" with the original ones for awhile, because I'm guessing after laying down the money for it you wouldn't want to go purchase some other plugins right away. What I'm saying is if you don't like the Logic plugins this could be a problem. I'll definitely say space designer is fantastic, the compressor is great, EQ as well, but the guitar amp pro plugin is not. The pitch correction (while others will disagree) does the job for me, but then I only use a very mild amount of correction. The synths are all very usable. And lets not forget you don't have any silly LE limitations.

Just make sure your know the tools your getting into, it worked out for me and many others but not for everyone. In the end its better to have the better tool for you than to spend less money.

[Stick]

I use both for different things.

Velvet is the best Rhodes/Wurli VI anywhere. It smokes EVP88 by a mile. Eleven is WAY better than Guitar Amp Pro. But, like has been stated, these aren't included with ProTools. Bang for the buck, Logic is a no-brainer.

For track production/programming/sequencing, Logic is much faster for me. And the access to samples and VIs is much simpler and faster in Logic. When I'm ready to track live stuff, edit audio, or mix. ProTools (HD3 Accel, in my case) is the only way to go for me.

[nativeaudio]

Originally Posted by n8tron

If you were to buy plugins for pro tools you'd be buying personalized individually selected plugs, whereas with logic you would be "stuck" with the original ones for awhile, because I'm guessing after laying down the money for it you wouldn't want to go purchase some other plugins right away.

Since Pro Tools isn't free either, and since Logic costs less than it done befor eit had anhy plugins at all, I'm not sure I think this makes sense....

I believe that all Logic users I'm aware of (except one or maybe two) have bought additional plugins.

[n8tron]

Originally Posted by nativeaudio

Since Pro Tools isn't free either, and since Logic costs less than it done befor eit had anhy plugins at all, I'm not sure I think this makes sense....

I believe that all Logic users I'm aware of (except one or maybe two) have bought additional plugins.

I'm talking about the initial investment. If your thinking of buying logic for the plugins, your not going to want to go out and fork over more cash for more plugins after you buy it.

[Sean Sullivan]

Originally Posted by n8tron

I'm talking about the initial investment. If your thinking of buying logic for the plugins, your not going to want to go out and fork over more cash for more plugins after you buy it.

That's my thoughts exactly. If the Logic plug ins are just so so and I'm going to be replacing them in the long run, it might be a better initial investment to upgrade the stock Pro Tools LE plugs in, like say with Velvet, Waves Musicians 2, and TL Space.

[JPeters86]

Logic's stock plugins are decent imo. I especially like the EQ. It's the only stock plugin I frequently turn to. The DeEsser is quite okay as well. Never worked a lot with Digi's stock stuff. Logic's synths kick ass though.

[.kAy]

if you're like the rest of us you'll be getting plugs as long as they they'll be making them

[H-Rezz]

Originally Posted by n8tron

I'm talking about the initial investment. If your thinking of buying logic for the plugins, your not going to want to go out and fork over more cash for more plugins after you buy it.

Huh? Logic Studio costs less than CSP by URS, in fact the price you pay for Logic enables you to afford more 3rd party plugs to go with the excellent plugs provided.....

[oudplayer]

people can complain all they want about the other digirack plugins, or the "limitations" of LE...

... but the EQ3 and Compressor3 are really good plugins. They are incredibly versatile and DSP-efficient, and IMHO are superior to Logic's (nonlinear) EQ and compression plugins. I use them all the time without hesitation. The compressor's interface is a bit unusual and takes getting used to, but it works well as a limiter, extreme compressor, or as a light compressor with nearly no compression artifacts.

DVerb is only (barely) useful for a trashy 80s reverb emulation.

[cane creek]

Originally Posted by upinflames

I get a pretty insane academic discount on Logic Studio and I'm thinking about giving it a try. One of my main problems with Pro Tools LE is the need to buy some plug ins. Digidesign Velvet is expensive, as is Native Instruments B4, and although a lot of software developers give academic discounts I couldn't even buy Velvet for the cost of Logic Studio. So, how do the virtual instruments that come with Logic compare to others? How are the plug ins? In a nutshell, how many of you use the stock Logic plug ins even though you may have nicer, more expensive ones?

whats an insane discount as i bought logic 8 off ebay for £195....

[mohthom]

£120 for the Academic version . . . or £130 for the upgrade from a previous (non-academic) version.

You have to be a student (or staff member) in a qualifying higher education institution to qualify for the preferential pricing.

MohThoM

[Igotsoul4u]

Logic pro is way better in the plugin game. The soft synths are incredible and the stock dynamics,FX, and EQ are in a different league then the digi stock plugs. I only use the delays from Digi. The rest is total trash.