intel or amd for ptle?

[fenn]

im looking at getting another dell desktop to record on exclusively, ive heard mixed reviews on the better processor, what do you guys think?

[backplay]

Intel is the way to go now.
Build your DAW around the Q6600 for the best bang for the buck!

[ABGen]

Wrong bro - fastest currently is the the new AMD Opteron (code named Barcelona and just released on 9/12/07) - its the first native quad core workstation processor. The Intel quad cores are 2 duo cores stamped on each other and they rely on the FSB whereas the Opteron 8350 is a true quad core with Integrated Memory Controller / IMC. You can pick up 2 Opteron 8350's for about $2200 + mobo & memory etc.

The 2Ghz Opteron 8350 is 15% faster in floating point then the next generation intel Xeon Quad Harperstown - and that wont be out til November and will cost about $2400 / quad core.

More bang for your buck - if you are looking to build the most powerful thing avaialable.

Good luck.

-Andrew

PS - dont get a dell - have one custom built - i recommend www.alvio.com - call them on the phone Mon-Fri 8-5pm. They were able to build my current DAW for $100 less than I could buy the individual components using pricegrabber and ebay.

[jrtme]

Originally Posted by ABGen

Wrong bro - fastest currently is the the new AMD Opteron (code named Barcelona and just released on 9/12/07) - its the first native quad core workstation processor. The Intel quad cores are 2 duo cores stamped on each other and they rely on the FSB whereas the Opteron 8350 is a true quad core with Integrated Memory Controller / IMC. You can pick up 2 Opteron 8350's for about $2200 + mobo & memory etc.

The 2Ghz Opteron 8350 is 15% faster in floating point then the next generation intel Xeon Quad Harperstown - and that wont be out til November and will cost about $2400 / quad core.

More bang for your buck - if you are looking to build the most powerful thing avaialable.

Good luck.

-Andrew

PS - dont get a dell - have one custom built - i recommend www.alvio.com - call them on the phone Mon-Fri 8-5pm. They were able to build my current DAW for $100 less than I could buy the individual components using pricegrabber and ebay.

The problem with using an AMD with almost any software program is they are all pretty much tested on how they behave on Intels. So going outside the box could lead to problems.

[backplay]

Originally Posted by ABGen

Wrong bro

Read: BEST BANG FOR THE BUCK, Q66OO cost $240

Originally Posted by ABGen

The Intel quad cores are 2 duo cores stamped on each other and they rely on the FSB whereas the Opteron 8350 is a true quad core with Integrated Memory Controller / IMC.

So what's your point?




Turn it how you want, building a Opteron based DAW will set you back alot more than with a Intel one.

It was only for recording, what is the point of so much headroom then?

Stick with the Q6600, for $800 you'll have a killer machine.

[ABGen]

Originally Posted by jrtme

The problem with using an AMD with almost any software program is they are all pretty much tested on how they behave on Intels. So going outside the box could lead to problems.

Not sure where you got this information but it is completely false.

Steinberg, Cakewalk, Digi, UAD, etc all test their applications on AMD and Intel - in fact in their support sections they each have lists of chipsets / motherboards that are compatible or not compatible.

Going with a motherboard that supports ECC ram - whether intel or AMD - in other words do not buy their consumer based product lines (athalon, duo core) - rather get either the Opteron for AMD or Xeon for Intel. If you are running Cubendo (Cubase or Nuendo) - check their compatibility with various motherboards - spec everything out first - go on pricegrabber.com and get your best price - then add it up and call alvio or another custom workstation builder - and get them to quote the price.

Good luck.

PS - Thankfully we are not stuck with only Intel - the competition keeps each other sharp and we all benefit.

[NetXteN]

Originally Posted by ABGen

More bang for your buck - if you are looking to build the most powerful thing avaialable.

Those are really two different scenarios you bring up in that statement. A system that is built "best bang for the buck" is not going to be the same system that someone will build if they are going for the "most powerful thing available".

The 8 core Apple Mac (dual intel quad) is probably the best cantidate for "most powerful thing available" at this time. There is a guy on the Digi forums that posted his benchmarks with an 8 core Mac Pro ... DVerb test came out in the 400's. $5k-$8k cost on a Mac Pro loaded up.

At about $250 a processor, the Intel Q6600 quad offers 280-320 Dverbs of performance on Protools LE, even without overclock. You can get the motherboard, ram and bare essentials needed for the system including the processor for $800 total cost. This is widely accepted on the Digi forums as being the "best bang for the buck".

Originally Posted by fenn

im looking at getting another dell desktop to record on exclusively, ive heard mixed reviews on the better processor, what do you guys think?

Protools LE is a picky application. Not sure if you've had any problems in the past, but Protools likes some hardware combinations and not others. One of the biggest concerns is making sure first and foremost that you are on a known stable combination of hardware. If you don't try something that's already known to work, you are the guinea pig. I don't know of any DVerb performance/stability tests with the new AMD quad-core chips on PTLE. Noone has posted any information like that in the Digi forums so take all this Barcelona AMD-quad for PTLE with a grain of salt in that aspect.

I highly recommend the Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 at $250. I overclock to 3ghz with air cooling and get 368 Dverbs.

Check out one of the official threads about quad-core status over at the Digi forums ...

DUC: Best Core 2 Series Desktops-Results and Specs

[ABGen]

Originally Posted by NetXteN

Those are really two different scenarios you bring up in that statement. A system that is built "best bang for the buck" is not going to be the same system that someone will build if they are going for the "most powerful thing available".

The 8 core Apple Mac (dual intel quad) is probably the best cantidate for "most powerful thing available" at this time. There is a guy on the Digi forums that posted his benchmarks with an 8 core Mac Pro ... DVerb test came out in the 400's. $5k-$8k cost on a Mac Pro loaded up.

At about $250 a processor, the Intel Q6600 quad offers 280-320 Dverbs of performance on Protools LE, even without overclock. You can get the motherboard, ram and bare essentials needed for the system including the processor for $800 total cost. This is widely accepted on the Digi forums as being the "best bang for the buck".



Protools LE is a picky application. Not sure if you've had any problems in the past, but Protools likes some hardware combinations and not others. One of the biggest concerns is making sure first and foremost that you are on a known stable combination of hardware. If you don't try something that's already known to work, you are the guinea pig. I don't know of any DVerb performance/stability tests with the new AMD quad-core chips on PTLE. Noone has posted any information like that in the Digi forums so take all this Barcelona AMD-quad for PTLE with a grain of salt in that aspect.

I highly recommend the Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 at $250. I overclock to 3ghz with air cooling and get 368 Dverbs.

Check out one of the official threads about quad-core status over at the Digi forums ...

DUC: Best Core 2 Series Desktops-Results and Specs

If he is trying to build the fastest system available for the best bang for the $ - then the Opteron Quad Core is the best deal. The Q6600 is nowhere as fast as a Xeon let alone the new Quad Opteron. With the Opteron Quad you can scale up to 8 Quads = 32cores.

Each Quad Opteron will run about $1K.

BTW - Lucasfilm is migrating to the new Opteron Quad cores for their gaming, audio and graphics for film stuff.

[NetXteN]

Originally Posted by ABGen

If he is trying to build the fastest system available for the best bang for the $ - then the Opteron Quad Core is the best deal. The Q6600 is nowhere as fast as a Xeon let alone the new Quad Opteron. With the Opteron Quad you can scale up to 8 Quads = 32cores.

Each Quad Opteron will run about $1K.

BTW - Lucasfilm is migrating to the new Opteron Quad cores for their gaming, audio and graphics for film stuff.

You are pointing someone to a product that has not been tested and verified to work correctly with a Protools LE rig. I still put emphasis on there being no official Dverb performance and stability tests done on the platform that you mention. Anyone who is the first person to run and document a specific hardware combination may run into issues with a specific mainboard or other such hardware combinations. The 680i motherboard platform for example ... hangs Protools. Stability is key first, then performance.

[jrtme]

Originally Posted by ABGen

Not sure where you got this information but it is completely false.

Steinberg, Cakewalk, Digi, UAD, etc all test their applications on AMD and Intel - in fact in their support sections they each have lists of chipsets / motherboards that are compatible or not compatible.

Going with a motherboard that supports ECC ram - whether intel or AMD - in other words do not buy their consumer based product lines (athalon, duo core) - rather get either the Opteron for AMD or Xeon for Intel. If you are running Cubendo (Cubase or Nuendo) - check their compatibility with various motherboards - spec everything out first - go on pricegrabber.com and get your best price - then add it up and call alvio or another custom workstation builder - and get them to quote the price.

Good luck.

PS - Thankfully we are not stuck with only Intel - the competition keeps each other sharp and we all benefit.

You are quick to tell me I'm false. But if you think for a second that software companies are testing on all processors that is crazy. They do not have the time or money to test on all platforms. I have worked in the computer industry for over 10 years. So that is where i get my information from. I don't care if they say they always do. That documentation I would like to see. So if you can show me that I would like to see it. But even with that don't believe Everything you see unless you work on it first hand.

[ABGen]

Originally Posted by jrtme

You are quick to tell me I'm false. But if you think for a second that software companies are testing on all processors that is crazy. They do not have the time or money to test on all platforms. I have worked in the computer industry for over 10 years. So that is where i get my information from. I don't care if they say they always do. That documentation I would like to see. So if you can show me that I would like to see it. But even with that don't believe Everything you see unless you work on it first hand.

I'm sorry if what i stated was offensive - im not trying to be contentious - simply trying to enlighten the original poster. I've been working on and with computers since 1984 (apple IIe to start).

If Lucasfilm is migrating to the latest Opteron (3rd generation / Barcelona) for music, games, film, etc. - and these applications have been tested for the 1st and 2nd generation Opterons - I personally feel pretty safe about buying. Are users going to wait for Digi to say that the Harperstown Intel Xeon's coming out in November are going to work? I doubt it - because they are based on the same but next generation build of the current Xeon's. Similiarly with AMD's Opterons. 50% of corporations rely on Opterons for their servers and workstations - that's nothing to bat an eye at.

I'm not planning to build my next DAW until June '08 - as AMD will be releasing the Opteron Barcelona at 3Ghz with DDR3, HT3, and DC2. Intel will finally release their first true native quad core with IMC (integrated memory controller) sometime mid to late '08 - so the competition will be fierce but my experience tells me that even over time the best bang for the buck will be with the Opteron Barcelona B and C revisions.

My current DAW by the way is a 1st Generation Opteron - Duo Opteron 270 Duo Cores (2Ghz) = Quad cores. It is extremely fast and was the fastest thing available in April, 2006. But please note I'm not anti Intel - i have a Intel Core laptop (toshiba) and have bought many many intel computers for my kids and company. For music production I've found the best deal with the Opteron. I would be pleasantly surprised if Intel could provide the same or better power for a better price now or when I buy in June '08.

To the original poster - set your budget - research your options - go with the best for the $.

-Andrew

[jrtme]

Originally Posted by ABGen

I'm sorry if what i stated was offensive - im not trying to be contentious - simply trying to enlighten the original poster. I've been working on and with computers since 1984 (apple IIe to start).

If Lucasfilm is migrating to the latest Opteron (3rd generation / Barcelona) for music, games, film, etc. - and these applications have been tested for the 1st and 2nd generation Opterons - I personally feel pretty safe about buying. Are users going to wait for Digi to say that the Harperstown Intel Xeon's coming out in November are going to work? I doubt it - because they are based on the same but next generation build of the current Xeon's. Similiarly with AMD's Opterons. 50% of corporations rely on Opterons for their servers and workstations - that's nothing to bat an eye at.

I'm not planning to build my next DAW until June '08 - as AMD will be releasing the Opteron Barcelona at 3Ghz with DDR3, HT3, and DC2. Intel will finally release their first true native quad core with IMC (integrated memory controller) sometime mid to late '08 - so the competition will be fierce but my experience tells me that even over time the best bang for the buck will be with the Opteron Barcelona B and C revisions.

My current DAW by the way is a 1st Generation Opteron - Duo Opteron 270 Duo Cores (2Ghz) = Quad cores. It is extremely fast and was the fastest thing available in April, 2006. But please note I'm not anti Intel - i have a Intel Core laptop (toshiba) and have bought many many intel computers for my kids and company. For music production I've found the best deal with the Opteron. I would be pleasantly surprised if Intel could provide the same or better power for a better price now or when I buy in June '08.

To the original poster - set your budget - research your options - go with the best for the $.

-Andrew

Thank You for the clarification. And the other info is good to know.