Is there a software version of an arranger keyboard?

[rolfeilert]

Please someone ....... I will soon play in a pianobar and need some arranger stuff.

BAnd in a box , do not to my knowledge read chords in realtime. There is a software called "One man band", it has some advanced ways of reading chords from a keyboard in realtime, but u must operate it fram a pc keyboard.


I'm wondering buying a solton/ketron module for this, but have no idea how they'll react on my chords.

[manning1]

Farshad
biab does indeed change in real time.

you choose a style , enter your chord arrangement..
then play the whole shebang.
it creates your traks for you.
a new feature is called realtraks...basically like haveing
session musicians to create songs with.
you really need to check out the demo and all the vids at
pgmusic.com .
there are also lots of threads with how people use it live
with lots of triks at pg's site.
it will even generate solos and melodies also.
also check out real band while your there.

a final tip..biab will only sound as good for midi traks
as the midi to audio sound generator you use.
use a nice generator like roland sonic cell or ketron
and youll hear great results.
or if you have a decent pc (or mac) you can use plug ins.
check on the pg forums for recommendations.

also ask on the pg user forum for the advantages of biab over arranger keyboards.
you might get some intersting answers n save yourself some money.

[theblue1]

Manning, I suspect he wants to be able to 'improvise' chord changes while the music is playing, as you can do (to varying success, I suspect) on some 'arranger' type keyboards that will wing arrangements off of chords (or melodies, in some cases, I believe).

BiaB doesn't require much input at all from the musician to generate an arrangement, but, unless they've extended it substantially in the last version or two, I believe you still need to enter the chords on the song grid before you hit the go button.

[jeamsler]

Yes there is. One Man Band can import yamaha styles and has the functionality of the yamaha boards if you have a controller to use with it. They just came out with a new version. You can get it fairly cheap. Mac & Win

MIDI software for musicians

[manning1]

theblue1
i thought i saw a thread awhile ago bout what your describing on the pg forums.

please excuse my senior moments. lol.
i thought he meant sumpin else.
how would one wing it tho in a technical sense ??
wouldnt there be some kind of lag after the user did a change ??
even a teensy one ?? this would require a highly optimised
real time process to be operating on the puter...?

[rolfeilert]

Thanks for your input , I for sure did learn a lesson today

[theblue1]

Originally Posted by manning1

theblue1
i thought i saw a thread awhile ago bout what your describing on the pg forums.

please excuse my senior moments. lol.
i thought he meant sumpin else.
how would one wing it tho in a technical sense ??
wouldnt there be some kind of lag after the user did a change ??
even a teensy one ?? this would require a highly optimised
real time process to be operating on the puter...?

Yeah... that's true but it's pretty quick.

I remember watching a sax and electronic keyboard duo (doing conventional standards!) where the keyboardist had a keyboard (think it was a Yamaha) that could improvise chords and bass around a melody line. I was skeptical and talked to the keyboardist (one of those guys who'd been playing forever) and he said, no, it's surprisingly usable. And it seemed to be, I guess. I listened as he played melody lines and had it "guess" the chords around them.

Microsoft, of all folks, have that silly little song arranger software (I forget the name of it -- I think I blanked it out) where you sing a capella across a beat and it will -- not in realtime -- develop an arrangement around your singing and fill it in so that you can play back your singing, now with a MIDI arrangement wrapped around it. If one has good pitch and time, it can come surprisingly close to almost usable...

[manning1]

theblue1
you mean MS songsmith. ??
its a partnership i understand tween MS n pg music ..biab folks.
yes heres the blurb i found..i wasnt aware of the fact.
PG Music Inc. - News and Notes

i notice pg are selling add on styles also for songsmith.

i personally if i had the buks would go for the big brother pg's realband.
cos ya got 48 traks to build a song with the session musician quality.
cos of all the real session players n instruments.
you might be intersted to know i see more than a few sonar users useing it for bed tracking
fast then importing the traks into sonar. saves a bunch of time mucking with midi etc etc.
i'm a past midiot myself...but its a pain. RB saves all that biz.
i view songsmith as like sorta a intro to the whole concept of RB and biab.
but for me and i think its 350 buks for the ultrapak with everything from pg i feel is a bit steep for me. i need to win the lottery..lol.

mebe the idea is to get the kids hooked on songsmith ,
then they will upgrade to biab and/or rband.

[rolfeilert]

I asked at PGMUSIC , if BiaB could function as an arranger keyboard , here's the result:


---------------------------------
Completely false. Biab is great software but you have to enter the chords, breaks, create the ending and pick a style first before you can play the song. The Conductor feature does give some real time control by allowing section looping, jumping to different parts but that has nothing to do with you're basic question.
I have a high end Korg arranger, the Pa1x Pro, and I've been using Biab for years. They both have plusses and minuses. The big minus of the keyboard is trying to get it to pick up fast chord changes on something with a quick tempo. It's basically impossible. For that, I use Biab to create a midi file and the Korg reads that fine plus I can still use the arranger functions along with the midi.
Google OneManBand. It's software that allows a regular midi keyboard to act like an arranger when hooked up to your PC using Yamaha styles. I've never used it but it looks interesting.

Bob
------------------------------------------


Conclusion:


There are no product from pgmusic that will mimic the functionality of an arranger keyboard!!!!





thanks

[manning1]

rolfeilert
as i said up in the thread i'm highly doubtfull that anything can
do this on a standard pc. there has to be some lag to the user due
to how the OS works.
arranger keyboards prolly have their own custom operating systems,
and custom vlsi/logic chip technology.
i wont use an arranger keyboard myself for the same reason i dont use custom control
surfaces with flying faders etc.
they sound good in theory..but...
the problem is that if that vlsi/chip custom technology in an arranger keyboard
(or control surface ) goes wrong...what do you do if you cant get support in the future ??
such technology you cant fix yourself like we could in the old days often of analog consoles.
ive been burnt like this is the past.
whether digital mixing console or control surface or arranger keyboard..
before buying, my advice is always ask the manufacture how long future support and service will be offered. also ask how much such will cost once out of warranty.
in summary imho all these type of products sound great in theory, but its no good if one cant get future service on them..particularly if one lives in a country where service is difficult to get in the future.

[rolfeilert]

Originally Posted by manning1

rolfeilert
as i said up in the thread i'm highly doubtfull that anything can
do this on a standard pc. there has to be some lag to the user due
to how the OS works.
arranger keyboards prolly have their own custom operating systems,
and custom vlsi/logic chip technology.
i wont use an arranger keyboard myself for the same reason i dont use custom control
surfaces with flying faders etc.
they sound good in theory..but...
the problem is that if that vlsi/chip custom technology in an arranger keyboard
(or control surface ) goes wrong...what do you do if you cant get support in the future ??
such technology you cant fix yourself like we could in the old days often of analog consoles.
ive been burnt like this is the past.
whether digital mixing console or control surface or arranger keyboard..
before buying, my advice is always ask the manufacture how long future support and service will be offered. also ask how much such will cost once out of warranty.
in summary imho all these type of products sound great in theory, but its no good if one cant get future service on them..particularly if one lives in a country where service is difficult to get in the future.

====================

Great point sir, I will try software and add some controllers to a laptop , make use of soft plugins /midimodules instead. Speaking as an software developer, I don't see any lag problems , the computation of chords will go fast, I see more problems playing sounds using plugins. But a modern OS will have a preemtitive time sceduling mecanism , and not direct interrupts as old systems, thus there will always be a delay.

[manning1]

rolfeilert
frankly i dont like any of the OS's these days on home computers.
too big imho. but we are stuck with them.
as your a software developer (background ??...)
go check out a nice small elegant OS.
that i respect.
MenuetOS
sadly no music apps for it.
mebe you could write some clever real time arranger software for it.
asm routines etc etc.
but the other problem is sound device driver support.
me..i just like small elegant OS's.

ps..one advantage i forgot to mention of biab is thousands of songs have been done i biab format.
so if you need to say sing over standards at gigs. its pretty esasy.
just google for the biab version of the song.