Login / Register
 
Being an Engineer = Being a Studio Owner
New Reply
Subscribe
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#1
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #1
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Being an Engineer = Being a Studio Owner

When did being an engineer, become the same as being a studio owner? Seems like many on this site see owning gear as mandatory, to be an engineer.

Personally I am a fulltime profesional engineer, I own maybe 3-4k worth of gear and generally goes unused. Also most of the gear was given to me as collectors pieces, as a thank you for different gigs.

Just want to put it out there that you do not need to own gear to be an engineer. I rather spend my money on anything besides gear.
#2
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #2
Lives for gear
 
ambiguity's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Americas
Posts: 1,115

ambiguity is offline
Who cares what many on this site see as mandatory? I don't
#3
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #3
Moderator
 
psycho_monkey's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney via London
Posts: 22,505
My Recordings/Credits

Send a message via Skype™ to psycho_monkey
psycho_monkey is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by arrowood101 View Post
When did being an engineer, become the same as being a studio owner? Seems like many on this site see owning gear as mandatory, to be an engineer.

Personally I am a fulltime profesional engineer, I own maybe 3-4k worth of gear and generally goes unused. Also most of the gear was given to me as collectors pieces, as a thank you for different gigs.

Just want to put it out there that you do not need to own gear to be an engineer. I rather spend my money on anything besides gear.
Because most people don't get the opportunity to work commercially unless they have a facility - ie they're selling the studio space rather than themselves.

The difference is the key to moving up with the quality of artists you work with, in many cases.

Obviously there are exceptions.
__________________
Recent Indie credits include:

Jack Robert Hardman (New EP now on sale), Morgan Joanel, and High-Tails.

If I've helped you out, please consider supporting these artists as a favour to me!

Major label credits include Pharrell/Alicia Keys, Ricky Martin (Aus #3), John Legend, Samantha Jade, Di-Rect (Dutch #1), etc
#4
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Rick Carson's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Location: Omaha Nebraska
Posts: 1,395

Rick Carson is offline
I wish man! So do you work for a studio??? Which there are like 2000 positions in the world or do you record in other studios and get your client foot the bill for the room?


I'd love to not own my studio.
__________________
Rick Carson

Producer, Mix Engineer.
Make Believe Studios
www.makebelievestudio.com
#5
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Joe Haze's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 582

Joe Haze is offline
Getting clients to drop 1k a day for studio time + my day rate... (good luck).

Even working in a well stocked studio, there are pieces of gear I prefer to use (I own). But..Blowing all of your money on gear sucks..
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#6
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #6
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambiguity View Post
Who cares what many on this site see as mandatory? I don't
HA I don't care, generally GS is more of a funny read for me then really informative. More curious on where this became the same in people's mind.
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#7
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Haze View Post
Getting clients to drop 1k a day for studio time + my day rate... (good luck).

Even working in a well stocked studio, there are pieces of gear I prefer to use (I own). But..Blowing all of your money on gear sucks..
If clients can't afford a studio, then why should you volunteer your money to build the studio?
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#8
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #8
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by bwrecordings View Post
I wish man! So do you work for a studio??? Which there are like 2000 positions in the world or do you record in other studios and get your client foot the bill for the room?


I'd love to not own my studio.
Know my situation can't be everyone else's. Personally I have 1 client that keeps me too busy. As in instead of trying to shoot every fish in the pond I just went for one big fish. Also have had many other gigs before this one that did not involve me owning gear.

Either way my situation doesn't matter. I can think of many ways to work your way up or niches an engineer could work without owning gear. At the same time it seems most go with the buy myself in strategy. Which I would guess has a very bad success rate.
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#9
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #9
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Because most people don't get the opportunity to work commercially unless they have a facility - ie they're selling the studio space rather than themselves.

The difference is the key to moving up with the quality of artists you work with, in many cases.

Obviously there are exceptions.
If you are selling your studio space more then your engineering, aren't you just pretty much a studio owner then?

I must just be out of the loop these days. Know plenty that have tried the I'll buy gear first route, but don't run into too many (none really) of those people when working.

Personally for me engineering is an apprentice occupation, not a buy your way in occupation.
#10
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #10
Lives for gear
 
unitymusic's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 1,956

unitymusic is online now
I wish it were still like that. The problem is there are so many people that "really like music, and want to do something in that field" types these days, and not enough of the "I can't do anything but follow my own vision and do whatever it takes to learn/get there" types. It's hard to get a job in a studio; even the people deserving have to do something to try to show other people that.

With that said, I think the hype of owning your own gear has come mostly from people who want to record themselves, which I kind of am, but I also respect the art of engineering and definitely want to engineer a project in a commercial facility one day. I've given up recording anyone but myself in my own space, but I do better recordings when I record other people.
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#11
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by unitymusic View Post
I wish it were still like that. The problem is there are so many people that "really like music, and want to do something in that field" types these days, and not enough of the "I can't do anything but follow my own vision and do whatever it takes to learn/get there" types. It's hard to get a job in a studio; even the people deserving have to do something to try to show other people that.

With that said, I think the hype of owning your own gear has come mostly from people who want to record themselves, which I kind of am, but I also respect the art of engineering and definitely want to engineer a project in a commercial facility one day. I've given up recording anyone but myself in my own space, but I do better recordings when I record other people.
Yep don't think most would want to go through what I have to get where I am at. In fact from interviewing people for positions I KNOW most won't go through what I have. Not that where I am at is anything great or anything to write home about.

If you are a musician wanting to record demos, or get ideas down I understand also. This is not what I was referring to.

The funniest thing is the look I get when I meet "an aspiring" engineer and they start listing all their gear. Then I get asked what I own, when I reply nothing, the look is classic.
#12
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #12
Lives for gear
 
unitymusic's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 1,956

unitymusic is online now
I personally think the biggest problem is that at some point the music industry seems to have taken a turn to pacify people who really have no business associating themselves with a representation of 'music'. But they've got the dough, and the industry needs that more.

If it were as simple as weeding out the folks who don't have the dedication to really learn, the average project would be of much higher quality all around.
#13
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #13
Lives for gear
 
Joe Haze's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 582

Joe Haze is offline
Since I can't rely on my rich parents to float me while I look for the "perfect" client...I must get creative. Having my own modest space allows me to work with a variety of clients not just those who have 50k for an album. If the client can afford to go to a real studio I am happy..

Yes, it's frustrating...most people want an album at 100k quality and want to spend $100.00
#14
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #14
Gear Guru
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: New York
Posts: 15,170

joeq is online now
Quote:
Originally Posted by arrowood101 View Post
When did being an engineer, become the same as being a studio owner? Seems like many on this site see owning gear as mandatory, to be an engineer..
It may not be 'mandatory' - but it sure is easier to get hired as the staff engineer at a place when you "know the owner".
__________________
.

“What you ask about is music. What you like is sound. Now music and sound are akin, but they are not the same.”
— Confucius
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#15
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #15
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Haze View Post
Since I can't rely on my rich parents to float me while I look for the "perfect" client...I must get creative. Having my own modest space allows me to work with a variety of clients not just those who have 50k for an album. If the client can afford to go to a real studio I am happy..

Yes, it's frustrating...most people want an album at 100k quality and want to spend $100.00
Hmm assume the rich parents was a stab at an insult to me? Well didn't mean this thread to necessarily be about me personally, but if you want to go there. Personally I am from a dairy farming family, born and raised in a small town in the midwest that most haven't heard of. Now I live and work in Los Angeles. So no I am not from rich parents, shoot even if my family was the "rich family" where I am from that would amount to being poor in LA. Generally I would say the lucky rich kids would start off just buying gear instead of cleaning toilets in a studio to start.

When I started I knew I could never afford gear, and owning gear wasn't what I wanted to do. So I made a decision that I would get to where I wanted to be by out working anyone.

Also I did not just wait around for that "perfect client." I have had many audio gigs over the years. I would say the more "creative" option would be to not buy gear.
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#16
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #16
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
It may not be 'mandatory' - but it sure is easier to get hired as the staff engineer at a place when you "know the owner".
Ha funny good one!!
#17
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #17
Lives for gear
 
Joe Haze's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 582

Joe Haze is offline
N0 stab, but in the real world even getting lame bands with no money to drop 5k on an album is tough. The only people I know who are not "veteran" engineers doing things in L.A are only able to play "engineer" due to their parents.

I agree that buying gear doesn't make you an engineer. I would rather mix at a studio stocked full of the tools I need, but in the real world it often doesn't work out that way. We all are in our own worlds...
arrowood101
Thread Starter
#18
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #18
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,138
My Recordings/Credits

Thread Starter
arrowood101 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Haze View Post
N0 stab, but in the real world even getting lame bands with no money to drop 5k on an album is tough. The only people I know who are not "veteran" engineers doing things in L.A are only able to play "engineer" due to their parents.

I agree that buying gear doesn't make you an engineer. I would rather mix at a studio stocked full of the tools I need, but in the real world it often doesn't work out that way. We all are in our own worlds...
Ohh I defiantly agree on the getting bands to drop 5k part, hence why I went the route I did. Also I am not a good schmoozer so I would be dead in that arena.

HA well maybe you are hanging with the wrong engineers in LA.

Honestly I am so relaxed about what gear I "need." You can get the job done either way. Having the "right" instruments is way more important in my book, then what preamps I have access to. At the same time I am lucky and get the opportunity to work on nice gear.

Didn't mean this thread to be about me or one way being the "right" way. Everyone needs to choose their own path. Just putting it out there because it seems like a view point that gets forgotten these days.
#19
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #19
Gear nut
 
ksound's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Location: Phuket
Posts: 124

ksound is offline
I own very little gear, basically a DAW, an audio interface, converters, a pair of monitors and a couple of mics.

A lot of my work comes from other studio owners who require my abilities as an engineer and/or a musician. My gear gets used for recording my own personal projects and serving clients via the internet (mostly mixing & mastering).

I often get to work with some nice gear that I don't have to spend money on, but it would be nice to have the money to be able to choose whether to buy it or not. I'd probably spend any extra cash on guitars to be honest.
#20
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #20
Lives for gear
 
rhythmtech's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Dublin , Ireland
Posts: 2,186

rhythmtech is offline
i have a small mix room that has to be stocked with gear... for mixing

the client will rent studio and pay my day rate for tracking but having my own gear and room cuts back some cost for the client when it comes to editing/mixing time which = more take home pay for me.
#21
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #21
Gear Guru
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 10,252
My Recordings/Credits

Jim Williams is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by arrowood101 View Post
Personally for me engineering is an apprentice occupation, not a buy your way in occupation.
Where else can you spend as much time as a medical doctor learning your craft and still get paid less than the manager at McDonalds?
#22
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #22
Lives for gear
 
Ward Pike's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,601

Ward Pike is offline
Working at a commercial studio can be likened to working in a factory

Your own personal studio is more like your mad science laboratory where you can experiment and work to your heart's content.

I work in my own studio which is everything i could hope for. All the tools and toys I want are at my fingertips and I have no worries about pleasing the owner, just the clients.
__________________
--
What signature?
#23
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #23
Gear Guru
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: New York
Posts: 15,170

joeq is online now
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ward Pike View Post
I have no worries about pleasing the owner, just the clients.
It's still the same gig.

Owners who are 'pleased' when their clients are NOT, rarely stay in business very long.
#24
26th May 2012
Old 26th May 2012
  #24
Lives for gear
 
Joe Haze's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 582

Joe Haze is offline
I agree that having good musicians and good instruments is key!

Most of what I do "in the proper" studio goes agents opinions here. I do however enjoy having my "producer" rig, it allows me to be consistent with my work flow.




Quote:
Where else can you spend as much time as a medical doctor learning your craft and still get paid less than the manager at McDonalds?
Story of my life!
#25
27th May 2012
Old 27th May 2012
  #25
Banned
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 174

sportyspice is offline
Home studio, enough said. Unless your on a lable willing to front you cash, your on the cheep.
New Reply Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook  Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter  Submit Thread to LinkedIn LinkedIn  Submit Thread to Google+ Google+ 
 
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
jdjustice / So much gear, so little time!
35
Remoteness / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
12
MWP / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
43
StringMike / Bass traps, acoustic panels, foam etc
14
delay / Mastering forum
31

Forum Jump

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.