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#811
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #811
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Quote:
Dave has no right to complain about anything. He is part of the reason music is so cut and pasted and auto-tuned and processed. His late 90s records wrote the wrote the book on the subject.
First off, did he complain?

And if his earlier work really is part of the reason that the state of the recording industry is where it is today...and he decided to go back to the basics for this album...isn't he better qualified to make a statement like this than someone who hasn't used newer technologies? Or is it not all right for people to change their minds about things?

Quote:
Dude...he owns two personal studios and a crap load of gear...all that is private...he does not have a stake in any commercial studio...obviously...
Aaah...I was under the impression that 606 Studios (the studio they started to work in for this record) was a commercial facility.

In any case...I don't think he harbors any will towards studios or studio owners. He's doing a documentary on Sound City, isn't he? Doesn't sound like an "F You" to me.
#812
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #812
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really? they why did he give commercial studios the finger in while millions watched? If he loves commercial studios sooo much why didn't he pronounce how great all the studios down the street in Hollywood are?...and thank them for their hard work over the years.?...hmmm...right...that wouldn't have had as much impact would it...so you see it WAS intentional...and again really shitty on his part to point the finger at hard working guys who have taken a shitkicking over the last decade.
#813
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #813
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I have little doubt that it was not only intentional, but carefully crafted in an attempt to boost general DG awareness and album sales by portraying FF as an earthy, grassroots bunch of back-to-basics, off the grid, rock-n-roll renegades. I kind of doubt it did much of either.

I've mentioned to to a number of people over the past few days, and nobody knows (or seems to care) what I'm talking about.

I would certainly hope that music professionals would be smart enough to see the comment for what it was, and treat it as such.
#814
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleBubba View Post
really? they why did he give commercial studios the finger in while millions watched? If he loves commercial studios sooo much why didn't he pronounce how great all the studios down the street in Hollywood are?...and thank them for their hard work over the years.?...hmmm...right...that wouldn't have had as much impact would it...so you see it WAS intentional...and again really shitty on his part to point the finger at hard working guys who have taken a shitkicking over the last decade.
Got it the first seventeen times... sly bastard... you snuck it again!!
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#815
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kennybro View Post
I have little doubt that it was not only intentional, but carefully crafted in an attempt to boost general DG awareness and album sales by portraying FF as an earthy, grassroots bunch of back-to-basics, off the grid, rock-n-roll renegades.

I would certainly hope that music professionals would be smart enough to see the comment for what it was, and treat it as such.

yes we do Kenny...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher View Post
Got it the first seventeen times... sly bastard... you snuck it again!!
yes I did Fletch...
#816
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duardo View Post
First off, did he complain?

And if his earlier work really is part of the reason that the state of the recording industry is where it is today...and he decided to go back to the basics for this album...isn't he better qualified to make a statement like this than someone who hasn't used newer technologies? Or is it not all right for people to change their minds about things?


Aaah...I was under the impression that 606 Studios (the studio they started to work in for this record) was a commercial facility.

In any case...I don't think he harbors any will towards studios or studio owners. He's doing a documentary on Sound City, isn't he? Doesn't sound like an "F You" to me.
He will do or say anything that promotes Dave Grohl,would you do the same at any cost?I think at this point he thinks his opinion is validated by his success,just like the president and politicians we have.They forget they are servants of the people and the power becomes a weapon for them to push an agenda.Whether or not the people go along with it or not is another thing.Dave Grohl is a troll.

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#817
5th March 2012
Old 5th March 2012
  #817
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krheatman View Post
He will do or say anything that promotes Dave Grohl,would you do the same at any cost?I think at this point he thinks his opinion is validated by his success,just like the president and politicians we have.They forget they are servants of the people and the power becomes a weapon for them to push an agenda.Whether or not the people go along with it or not is another thing.Dave Grohl is a troll.

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You are getting pretty off in the weeds there, dude. You are starting to come off more like someone who Dave Grohl broke up with for another guy than someone who has a disagreement with what he said.
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#818
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #818
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post
You are getting pretty off in the weeds there, dude. You are starting to come off more like someone who Dave Grohl broke up with for another guy than someone who has a disagreement with what he said.
I am entitled to my opinion.You don't have to agree with it,and thats OK.I must have struck a nerve though.People with a little power have done this since the dawn of time,Julius Ceaser to The Catholic Church to England to Hitler to Obama to Fletcher.You may agree with them or not,but not all do,and they have a right to their opinion whether you think so or not.Majority rules though so regardless what I say or think,Dave Grohl lives on and the people either except him or not.For me it's not.
#819
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #819
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You are entitled to an opinion, but you are getting into ad hominem attack territory in a lot of cases, more so than any sort of thoughtful opposition to what he said or didn't say.
#820
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #820
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#821
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #821
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post
You are entitled to an opinion, but you are getting into ad hominem attack territory in a lot of cases, more so than any sort of thoughtful opposition to what he said or didn't say.
I am also entitled to form that opinion also,with which you may not agree.Just as well as I may not like your music or your opinion or any other thing I will.Maybe you should take it up with a moderator if you think I have overstepped my bounds.

Anyone who think's Dave Grohl was not out of line by stating what he did,the way he did regarding the studios in hollywood,is wrong IMO.He should be a man and apologize to the people that have taken the hit from the statement.All the studio owners out there trying to eek out a living.We all have said things wrong,but not in front of the music world and fans like that.A real man would get some humility,not try to twist it back around and not really admit the mistake.All you guy's are explaining what you think he meant by it,let him do it.Unless of course like I said in my previous statement he feels above an apology because of his status.
#822
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #822
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JP11 View Post
Hey,if the shoe fits.......
#823
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #823
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krheatman View Post
I am also entitled to form that opinion also,with which you may not agree.Just as well as I may not like your music or your opinion or any other thing I will.Maybe you should take it up with a moderator if you think I have overstepped my bounds.

Anyone who think's Dave Grohl was not out of line by stating what he did,the way he did regarding the studios in hollywood,is wrong IMO.He should be a man and apologize to the people that have taken the hit from the statement.All the studio owners out there trying to eek out a living.We all have said things wrong,but not in front of the music world and fans like that.A real man would get some humility,not try to twist it back around and not really admit the mistake.All you guy's are explaining what you think he meant by it,let him do it.Unless of course like I said in my previous statement he feels above an apology because of his status.
There's studios in Hollywood that are not privately rented out or owned by a corporation or a rich guy that made his money else where? Didn't know there was any left to worry about. Wouldn't think most would care what he said about studios in hollywood because they are either all private or the money comes from else where.

I don't really subscribe to worrying about the "poor studio owners." The poor engineers, assistants, musicians and producers yes, but "studio owners in hollywood," naw not worried.
#824
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick_Money View Post
There's studios in Hollywood that are not privately rented out or owned by a corporation or a rich guy that made his money else where? Didn't know there was any left to worry about. Wouldn't think most would care what he said about studios in hollywood because they are either all private or the money comes from else where.

I don't really subscribe to worrying about the "poor studio owners." The poor engineers, assistants, musicians and producers yes, but "studio owners in hollywood," naw not worried.
And you find these mutually exclusive somehow?

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#825
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #825
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krheatman View Post
And you find these mutually exclusive somehow?

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You were the one mentioning Studios in Hollywood. Yes I do find it different worrying about a starting out engineer then I do Henson. One will run out of money the other will not. Last time I checked he didn't say anything about engineers, and still used an engineer/producer.

I mean my comment was pretty pointless, but so is this thread. Just found it very funny when you mentioned the "poor hollywood studio owners." If you worked much in the LA area, you would know why that is funny comment these days and even generally in the 90s also.

But what do I know, I actually work in LA in music and have made my living from it for years.
#826
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #826
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Actually he said the best studio in the world down in Hollywood.This could be taken as any decent studio anywhere.You can run off on your own tangent but don't twist it into being about the Hollywood studio scene.Stick to what he said.
Don't go to great studios,just get a tape machine and some mics then hire an engineer.

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#827
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #827
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleBubba View Post
yes we do Kenny...
Well... it seems not all.
#828
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #828
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UncleBubba is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick_Money View Post
There's studios in Hollywood that are not privately rented out or owned by a corporation or a rich guy that made his money else where? Didn't know there was any left to worry about. Wouldn't think most would care what he said about studios in hollywood because they are either all private or the money comes from else where.

I don't really subscribe to worrying about the "poor studio owners." The poor engineers, assistants, musicians and producers yes, but "studio owners in hollywood," naw not worried.

and that is the perpetuated myth...right there...

like somehow studio owners deserve to be treated unfairly...or don't need to make anymore money...that is a bunch of horsehite right there...

Folks have been busting their balls trying to hang on to recording studios...and you sit there with your thumb up Dave's arse pointing the fingers on your other hand at studio owner's...which also happen to be engineers and producers BTW.
#829
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #829
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the myth in this thread is that he said anything AGAINST anyone. He actually something "PRO" ( "pro" here, meaning "towards" or "in favor" ) a method, an experience, a way of doing things he used and enjoyed using. He didn't give the finger to anyone, he didn't say studio owners, engineers and alumni were scum and they could all go f**k themselves or anything even remotely close to this, and I don't agree that his past approach of using computers to fix things was even close to what the producers of Britney, Kesha, Bieber, or Rihanna or various so called DJs do on a daily basis. You wanna point the finger at people ruining what music is supposed to be about, then look that way, and look hard. It ain't pretty, be warned. What he said was true from a musician standpoint. The fun element needs to reinvest the creative process and being in a huge studio, with tons of insanely great gear CAN be counterproductive and yield less than desirable results.

The only thing I'm going to say that he was a little off about was talking about "a bunch of nice gear" when he obviously still used a shitload of very nice gear. An API 1608 is definitely not a Mackie, that's for sure, and not everyone has access to this level of gear. But that's a perceived level. To a small band a Ghost Spirit is a very nice console. To a huge band, an SSL Matrix is a small home studio geeky toy. It's all about perspective.
#830
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #830
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Words don't matter,most people on here are talking out of their ahole anyway,just like Dave Grohl.What you or I say can't change a thing either way.His words have angered many out there,not just on Gearslutz.So whatever I have said is not something others are not saying.Thats why he had to try to do damage control right away.We all can get in trouble with our mouths.
#831
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #831
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Quote:
really? they why did he give commercial studios the finger in while millions watched?
He didn't give commercial studios the finger.

Really, if you think about it, these days it's much easier to record in Pro Tools than it is to track a full band to tape. As he said, the human element is the most important thing, and it's easier to do that in a "real" studio than it is in the average home/garage studio these days. Just about anyone can run out and grab and M Box and Pro Tools, but it's a little more involved to get into a setup that can track a full band all at once.

Quote:
If he loves commercial studios sooo much why didn't he pronounce how great all the studios down the street in Hollywood are?
Doing a documentary about one is a bit more than most have done, wouldn't you say?

Did he cancel a session in your studio? Or did a bunch of your clients cancel their sessions and run out and put their own studios together the day after the Grammies aired? It's still perplexing to me why you've taken such offense to things your perception of what one guy said.
#832
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #832
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UncleBubba is offline
Duardo...no ...I'd love to have Dave come and record at my studio...as would anyone...and no he didn't cancel on me...i have no relationship with him whatsoever...not the point here at all...if I were in a private conversation with any artist, they wouldn't be talking at me like they were on awards ceremony and I wouldn't be yapping at them like I am in here.

...but really his words carry weight and have ramifications...

I'm not sure WHY anyone in the studio business would stick up for Dave's FU to the biz...

If you don;t think it has ramifications...well...I guess if this thread didn;t convince you, nothing will...so...keep that head buried in the sand


I have seen too many good folks lives get messed up pretty good...all because of a few opportunists with an unbelievable ability to market a perception of the music industry as a whole, took advantage of an emerging technology, and made billions while standing on the neck of the music business while holding a gun to its head at the same time...


never underestimate the power of a well constructed marketing plan...that's how millionaires are made....

Dave should have kept the puck under control when he crossed the blue line...instead he went in offside...
#833
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #833
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duardo View Post
and it's easier to do that in a "real" studio than it is in the average home/garage studio these days.
is that really true?
#834
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #834
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleBubba View Post
Duardo...no ...I'd love to have Dave come and record at my studio...as would anyone...and no he didn't cancel on me...i have no relationship with him whatsoever...not the point here at all...if I were in a private conversation with any artist, they wouldn't be talking at me like they were on awards ceremony and I wouldn't be yapping at them like I am in here.

...but really his words carry weight and have ramifications...

I'm not sure WHY anyone in the studio business would stick up for Dave's FU to the biz...

If you don;t think it has ramifications...well...I guess if this thread didn;t convince you, nothing will...so...keep that head buried in the sand

.
If you want more musicians to go to commercial studios and less musicians to record at home, then please post accordingly here on GS- talk about it everywhere, not just the moan zone. You are very passionate about it and YOU have an incredible opportunity here to make your case- this is where hundreds of DIYers are looking for advice.

The couple of times that I've created threads here to encourage folks to not record at home, and to focus on writing and practicing, and THEN go to a real studio, I witnessed at least 95% of the respondents saying that recording at a 'real studio' would be a waste of money, or would cramp their style. Yep. Never did see anyone arguing too hard to support commercial studios. Just the opposite, in fact.

Of course, home recording by artists of all levels of notoriety has been going on for a VERY long time, let's not act like this is some new thing that the kids might discover because of DG. Goodness, it's like Tascam never existed. Or the digi 001, 002, 003....

Or www.gearslutz

Just look at the way this forum has changed over the past 5 or so years. From pro-on-pro action to what we see now- DIY.

All way before this get-your-Grammy's in a bunch speech by DG.
#835
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #835
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duardo View Post
Really, if you think about it, these days it's much easier to record in Pro Tools than it is to track a full band to tape.

Why is that?Just did it over the weekend in Nashville.Wouldn't have mattered at home either.People have made stuff at home for years.Boston comes to mind.
#836
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #836
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleBubba View Post
DG is in the fake business...trying twist shit up makin it sound like the rest of aren't in the "real" business...we are...that's the problem

Quote:
RE: my statement that more studios home and pro are Protools HD systems to support pro "toolz" who can't play or sing.

Have to disagree somewhat Memph...lots of guys are insisting on good performance on the floor..and getting it ...the nightmare of wading through heaps playlists is a headache that some are reusing to do...for the betterment of the project...3 vocal takes with punches is it over here...punch till we keep..I don't exist to comp ...I'll do a reasonable amount...oh that is with a ProTools rig..
I know I do insist on good takes over a ridiculous amount of editing to get one good-ish take.
Quote:



He did say that...for whatever unknown reason...and he's hearing about it here...I don't know the situation personally, but I'm sure that every studio he's walked into was real happy to have him and worked real hard to please him...there was absolutely no reason for him to lip off about studio owners like that. he already achieved the benefit of his embellished recording story...which everyone has to do...again why kick guys who work hard to make rock an roll in the nuts ????
Maybe he meant his own studio down the street? It could be his opinion of it.
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#837
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #837
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisindie View Post
Maybe he meant his own studio down the street? It could be his opinion of it.
That is possible.

Then I would just have to say sorry Dave.
#838
6th March 2012
Old 6th March 2012
  #838
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleBubba View Post
and that is the perpetuated myth...right there...

like somehow studio owners deserve to be treated unfairly...or don't need to make anymore money...that is a bunch of horsehite right there...

Folks have been busting their balls trying to hang on to recording studios...and you sit there with your thumb up Dave's arse pointing the fingers on your other hand at studio owner's...which also happen to be engineers and producers BTW.
Ha don't think you get my point. Honestly I find the thread silly and I'll be the first to admit my point is equally as silly.

Just was pointing out the humor when people mention "the poor studio owners in Hollywood." Yes I understand this could be implied as anywhere. But if you were part of the LA recording industry you would know that the struggling, individual studio owner left Hollywood a long time ago. Even before the drop in the industry, minus corporation owned and playboy owned. Sure there are some smaller studios, but few and far between in actual Hollywood. Again I am stressing music studios not post.

When people say this its funny and shows lack of understanding of studios in LA. Hollywood has not been the hub for music studios for a long time. It moved to the valley and else where years ago.

Know I am being nit picky, but it's funny to me. As an example Sound City, is not in Hollywood but the valley.

That no one gets this point kind of shows how much people are talking out their arse. Also would not think Mr. Grohl is enemy number 1 for studios, there is much bigger fish to fry, cough cough google. When people quit discussing ideology and begin talking from experience in the relative scene let me know.
#839
7th March 2012
Old 7th March 2012
  #839
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Quote:
I'm not sure WHY anyone in the studio business would stick up for Dave's FU to the biz...

If you don;t think it has ramifications...well...I guess if this thread didn;t convince you, nothing will...so...keep that head buried in the sand
Probably because I don't see it as an FU to the biz. He chose not to make this record in a studio but in his home, yes...that doesn't constitute an FU to me. Again, why would he make a documentary about a studio...which, to me, shows quite a bit more respect than recording an album in one, and shows a love for the studio industry in general...if he wanted to say "FU" to the studio biz?

If he was saying FU to anything, I'd say it would be computer recording, or more specifically computer editing and manipulation. Secondarily, and what seemed to cause the bigger backlash pretty much everywhere but in our little world, would maybe be to electronic music in general (which is what he seemed to try to clarify a bit in his later statement). What I got from his speech was that learning to play, sing and/or write is more important than making your recording sound "perfect" or "correct". The recording in his garage and not a studio thing I saw more as a passing statement to show what was most important...not an FU to the studio business.

Quote:
and it's easier to do that in a "real" studio than it is in the average home/garage studio these days.
is that really true?
Well, sure...you can buy a two-channel interface, a microphone and software for a couple hundred bucks. More inputs and more microphones cost more money.

And with that two-channel interface you can record, edit, quantize, tune, and do all sort of unnatural things easily. Pulling in loops or a drum VI is easier, and cheaper, than recording a kit, let alone a full band.

Quote:
If you want more musicians to go to commercial studios and less musicians to record at home, then please post accordingly here on GS- talk about it everywhere, not just the moan zone.
I'd say that you should go way beyond GS...after all, most of "us" are involved in recording already. It's the musicians who aren't here who probably need to hear this sort of thing more, although once you start recording at home it doesn't take too long to learn how much easier it is to do certain things in a professional studio.

Quote:
Why is that?Just did it over the weekend in Nashville.Wouldn't have mattered at home either.People have made stuff at home for years.Boston comes to mind.
As I said earlier, it's cheaper and easier to record just a track or two at home than it is in a studio. Recording more tracks requires more equipment/money and more skill. Which I would never discourage people from doing...but that doesn't make it easier.

I never said that it couldn't be done either...obviously it has been done for years. Boston is a good example, although like Grohl's studio Scholtz's studio was fairly elaborate. And you do read a lot of major-label artists doing a lot of recording in both places...I recall reading that Maynard from Tool did most or all of his vocals for the latest album at home, whereas the band recorded their tracks in a studio (or several, wasn't it? An API-based studio for drums and a Neve-based studio for everything else?) and I don't recall any studio owners taking offense to that. I believe that Alex Lifeson actually tracked some guitar parts for the latest Rush album direct through an MBox that wound up on the final record as well...
#840
7th March 2012
Old 7th March 2012
  #840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajbianco View Post
he's talking about people needing to put more effort into developing their craft
yeah Dave is a true musical 'crafstman' I mean he's up there with Lennon/ McCartney Jaggar/Richards, Pete, Elton and Bernie He may even be as crafy as James and Lars and Boyce and Hart!!! I think wasting light is a perfect example of handcrafted artistic genius!!! up there with the likes of Page/Plant and Brian Wilson. His lyrical genius is only second to Bob Dylan and Neil Peart

Dave has single handedly carried the songwriting torch into this decade!!! even Tupac would be proud
Hi production makes Mutt lange and Martin Birch want to bow at the altar of Dave and scream "we are not worthy"
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