work? Pittsburgh?! whhhhhatt?!

[xmostynx]

I'm living in Pittsburgh, and i'll tell you what..

this city is killing its own people...

I've busted my ass through school, and i've interned for 8 months for barely any money, and now there is not one single opportunity to get my hands in any other studios.

Nobody wants to pay, and not to sound like a ****** bag..but how can you ask someone to work for 2 months for free so you can 'see what they can do'

Is this normal politics? this is foolish!

I have a great resume' and very reputable demo reel.. I'm willing to relocate-somebody please tell me of some good opportunity...or where i can start looking?

[DontLetMeDrown]

Sign me up too!

I think this is the problem. There is a LOT of competition. There are also a lot of very talented guys (in my area, anyway). Understand that this is common for a lot of jobs- "anyone need a web designer?" -ouch Why do you say it is killing Pittsburg or its people? That is a rather harsh way of putting it. I think it is rough this in every major city- especially a large music hub (LA, NY, Nashvillle)

Good Luck though-- We are in the same boat.

[xmostynx]

where are you located?

[xmostynx]

to just show you what i mean...

this so called producer for a show called 'street heaters' that airs on fox 53 in pittsburgh expected people to work for him 25 bucks a day to run audio..

25 bucks a day...i'm sure thats against the law..
thats less than 5 bucks an hour on 8 hour days..
25 bucks...lol..these people have no idea what it really takes to make a production to go foward...

crying out his ass that he's got no money because fox is charging him 30 grand for 6 spots and he's spending all his sponsor money on hookers and coke..

this is the pittsburgh mentality...and this is what i'm talking about...
what happened to professionalism? or is this the new way to be a pro?
i mean..coke and strippers..sure what producer doesn't love them both...

but don't expect your hired help to take the risks...i hope i never see this guy again in my life.

[heyman]

My girlfriend is originally from Pittsburgh. Here family still lives there.. I heard that it has been really bad, economy wise for the past few years... maybe the problem you are having is a direct result of that?

Even though you have been busiting your ass, alot of places want you on a trial period (internship).. Try to make Lemonade out of lemons..!

Agree to work an internship for 2 months on the premise that you will have your job re-evaluted at the end of the 2 months. Try to get them to give you a pay range that they would be willing to pay you at the end of 2 months if it works out. If they cant agree to that they are probibly not going to keep you around anyway.

If you work hard enough and they see it, they will keep you around at the end of the internship. Even though there are a ton of prospects out there, the ones that are dependable with no hangups will win out. Noone wants a crack addict with keys to the front door working for them.

Hang in there..

JIm

[xmostynx]

its almost easier to just save up for an HD system and freelance while working an easy waitor gig to pay the bills...

working for a big studio almost seems like a lose lose situtation..i'm sure it has its perks..but the smaller home studios with the right engineer kick just as much ass..

i love to mix music and make music...but to be dependent on it..almost seems like a stable life style as a crack head...

and how there are so many of those in this city...

so much potential wasted here in pittsburgh...its a shame..HD system then moving the hell outta here...woo! back home to new york!

[Beauarts]

Well, welcome to the modern music biz and recording bizless. I was talking to a mediocre singer today, nice lady but so-so artist. She is coming out with a CD. Where did she record? She knows someone very well and got a great deal. That's how it goes today. 10 or 20 years ago, 50-100k+ was needed to have a studio. Now you can walk into GC and buy some kind of recording setup for under $1000, so at least one band member has one. I can't imagine it's much different anywhere else.

For the most part, there's mostly one man operations around. Not enough buisness to hire anyone. Besides, you need to add value or bring in enough work to justify your pay. Are you doing that? I never found anyone to do anything for me unless I was really doing something for them. I had to create my own niche. And anytime i was successful, there was usually 1/2 dozen others hanging on me, duplicating or undercutting me, but that's another rant.

Give me your name + number, I occassionally need an assistant for live sound or session.

Henry Shapiro
BigShotRecording
Pittsburgh, PA

[DontLetMeDrown]

wow- that was easy. Ask and you shall receive. Any L.A. offers?

[I C LIGHT]

I'm from Pittsburgh
Hence the name I C LIGHT
IRION CITY LIGHT BEER HA ha
whats your degree
The city is confusing, just look at the road ways an bridges.
Isin't there a name for that -fung shwa or fung way. Idunno
They want to put in gambling an take more of the old money laying around.
Still I think this place falls through the ground be it mine subsidence or flow of energy. (take your pick)Or good oll boys politics.
see ya later.

[Jay Kahrs]

It's like that EVERYWHERE.

Last week I got two or three resumes froms kids living in & around Nashville saying they can't get a gig...

It was no different when I started out years ago...did an internship that went unpaid for several months while I learned the ropes in a great room with great engineers.

On days when the studio wasn't booked they'd let me raid the tape vault and mix whatever I wanted...

White Zombie. Rollins Band. Nirvana. Soundgarden.

We also did HBO bumps & local bands too...ALL kinds of stuff.

Yup...I was unpaid for several months but the education was & IMO still IS priceless.

I NEVER would've learned what I did if I had worked out of a home studio or some other "demo" shop.

It turned into a paying gig when the guy ahead of me quit.

You gotta decide whats important to you.

If it's money then I'd suggest taking that waitors gig or finding something else like real estate sales.

If you want to make records, then bite the bullet & realize that you're going to make almost nothing for a long long time before there's ANY kind of 'payoff' which in all reality...might NEVER come.

You move to NYC with an HD rig and you're gonna be no better off...walk into any music store or pick up one of the weekly rags & there's a bajillion ads for "studios" with some kinda Toolz HD rig & rates as low as $20 an hour.

Unless you can offer your prospective clients something entirely different you'll be just another dude with an HD rig doing bottom feeder stuff.

In that case you might be better off in smaller city.

Big fish in a little pond? Or little fish in an ocean?

Or maybe you'd be happier selling cars or something...

[xmostynx]

i'm kinda stuck..

these college loans are making me go get a waitor job and do bullshit work so i can pay them off..

what do you do when you have loan collectors breathing down your throat at 21?
its going to take me YEARS to pay off this schooling

-so i have to have some kind of income to keep myself floating..

i'm so bummed tho-and i know dues are dues and they must be paid.
but at the same time-i know my way around a studio-and i'm not being a dickhead about it-there is alot more to learn...but i know my ability is worth more than scrapping around hoping to get paid..and i'm sure this is the same story for alot of young adults..

but what do you do when you know if someone gave you a pay check and a good crew to work with you'd do amazing things?

maybe this is a young way of thinking..maybe not..but any advice would be great..

[iluvatar]

Howsabout joining the stagehands union? Good way to make contacts, too.

-Dan.

[PoorGlory]

While I was earning my Bachelors Degree in music from Drexel University in Philly, I worked freelance for a bunch of different regional audio and lighting companies. This continued all throughout college and afterward as well, eventually leading to a full time job at a live audio company, where I currently still work. I would much rather work in a studio, which is where my main interest lies. I've had more side business in recording so far in 2006 than any other year, so thats keeping me happy, even if it doesn't turn into anything more than a side business.

You learn a ton doing live audio. In fact, I think every studio engineer should be experienced in live work. You need to be able to recognize every frequency on that 1/3 octave and identify them with lightning accuracy. I believe this does translate to studio mixing in a very real way.

You do make a lot of contacts, but not really with people in the recording world. Live audio is way more of a "lets make money any way we can" industry than studio work is. Flying line arrays and clusters is no fun, believe me. Nobody likes a 4 am load out in the rain. But thats where the money is.

As much as I'd rather be making records for a living, I'm making a decent living doing the live thing and I get to play with insane gear every day. Most of the high paying work is in the corporate world unfortunately, so you're not always doing bands. But that doesn't matter... after a while sound is just sound, whether its speech or music. The job is to make either sound good and please the person paying you.

[xmostynx]

man...i don't even know where to start on how bummed out and pissed-i am...

i just got hired doing a shitty ass food job-and they took at the girls put them as front of the house- and shoved all the guys in the back cooking- whaatt thee ****kkk..damnit! figures tho-this world is toast-and i'm not pleased with this system at all..now i'm working with 40/50 year olds confident in their bar food skills...jesus christ

i'm so upset man...i'm wasting my talent and skill-i've spent the last 4 years training my ears -taking care of them-working for scraps off a table..day in and out like 50-60 hours a week just working in a studio-doing anything and everything i can to learn-busting my ass-i'm drained...and now i'm at the bottom of the barrel with an LE system and hopes that someone will give me a chance...

man i'm just so bummed out-

[xmostynx]

i can't even emphasize how ****ing bummed out i am... feeling like a failure-
relentless this life is..

[De chromium cob]

You're only 21? Sorry to be harsh, but quit whining like a little bitch, get out there and hit the streets or you'll be in the same situation when you're 31. You think because you've been to school, did some interning and know something about audio you've payed your dues? Not even close. You really need to loose the attitude and double your efforts. It could take YEARS to pay off and if you're not willing to tough out the lean times at 21, you will NEVER make it.

Of course, YMMV......

[xmostynx]

Originally Posted by De chromium cob

You're only 21? Sorry to be harsh, but quit whining like a little bitch, get out there and hit the streets or you'll be in the same situation when you're 31. You think because you've been to school and know something about audio you've payed your dues? Not even close. You really need to loose the attitude and double your efforts. It could take YEARS to pay off and if you're not willing to tough out the lean times at 21, you will NEVER make it.

Of course, YMMV......

i think you took me wrong man..but i'll take your advice-
sorry i'm stuck in a rut man-you made a few assumptions and alot of cheap shots...
i've been busting my ass on the pavement-and in the studio-and i've been living on a few bucks a day-and i'll tell you what- i'll gladly pay my dues and i'll pay them for plenty of years to come--a little pat on the back woulda been cool-not a kick in the teeth man..shitt

[De chromium cob]

Originally Posted by xmostynx

i think you took me wrong man..but i'll take your advice-
sorry i'm stuck in a rut man-you made a few assumptions and alot of cheap shots...
i've been busting my ass on the pavement-and in the studio-and i've been living on a few bucks a day-and i'll tell you what- i'll gladly pay my dues and i'll pay them for plenty of years to come--a little pat on the back woulda been cool-not a kick in the teeth man..shitt

I guess I'm more of a 'Mick' from the Rocky movies, or 'Pei Mei' from Kill Bill than the pat on the back type. Plus, I don't know if you actually deserve a pat on the back.

Your comment about the line cooks makes it sound like you think you're better than them and reeks with bad attitude. Now, you're probably just in a bad mood and blowing off steam, but that's how it reads to me. And if a potential employer gets even the slightest whiff of bad attitude, that internship or whatever will go nowhere. Just some free advice from an old curmudgeon...Take it (or leave it) for what its worth.

[xmostynx]

your right..it does-but at the same time-i'm just really fustrated..

i appriciate your honesty and your response-thats why i'm here
to learn from people who have been there..

[PoorGlory]

As an addendum to my previous post, I will say that in a field such as this where there is a ton of people wanting to work and not enough of it to go around, no one, and I mean no one is gonna hand you shit. You have to go out and make it happen. Do the line cook thing for a while, who cares? Make some dough, get ****ed up, bang the hot waitresses, and build up your audio rep on the side. Relax dude, you're young. Younger than I am (25). Enjoy this age while you can. At this point in my life, all I do is work, and I feel like I've missed out somewhat by taking on a lot of responsibility early in life.

[heyman]

xmostynx , I know you are frustrated.. This is life.. Try to keep your head up. Like cob said, if you gotta claw your way thru, then do it.. You are a young guy..

Give it time.. I know it seems like this is do or die right now, but find a part time job to pay the bills and use your free time to scour for what you really want to do.
'
Noone is holding a Golden Willy Wonka ticket with your name on it.. You have to go out and unwrap all those chocolate bars on your own..

Best of Luck.. Ps- Please send me some Primanti's sandwhiches out this way..

[xmostynx]

so yesterday i was pretty down in the dumps..
today brings some new light...

and i really appriciate all the support here at gearslutz...****ing great place

my manager for the new cook job-told me i'll be making 9 bucks an hour and i'll be put at the head of the kitchen-helping her with the schedule and shit...

then the current project i'm working on for the art institute of pittsburgh, they are doing a comp. cd of musicians from within the school, offered me some cabbage to continue working on the project. i'm working with a well known engineer here in pittsburgh- and he's also the head of the audio/video/photo department at the art institute.

so...with a little bit of bitching it looks like slow but steady i'll claw my way around this business and learn the ropes..

like i said before-all the comments and advice is ****ing great!
really happy there is a firm backbone here at gearslutz!


dfegad on poor times tho haha i guess this is growing up huh.
relax day..again thanks guys!

[matyas]

Ahh, Pittsburgh. I live and work here as well. Left originally at 16, vowing never to come back, returned to do an MA in composition and theory at Pitt and have been here ever since. At the moment, I have a decently-paying day job working with computers, but I really miss doing music and audio professionally and would really like to start doing it again, if only on a part-time basis.
Anyway, it's always surprised me just how much musical talent there really is in this town. It really is a veritable embarassment of riches for a city this small. I know people of the highest caliber working in every genre from baroque music on historical instruments to punk rock, from Indonesian gamelan to free jazz. The mass exodus of younger people and the depressed economy of the region hasn't put a damper on musical activity, it's just made it harder to make a living doing it and find an audience for your work. From an audio/recording standpoint, there really are a lot of people recording in this town - the supply might exceed the demand. I suppose that's true everywhere, though. I wouldn't want to be an engineer in New York, for example (much as I love New York) - it seems everyone there either makes records or wants to. To the original poster - hang in there. Believe me, I know where you're coming from!