I'm just guna freestyle that part...

[JoRillo]

Rap session yesterday - I am doing the engineer thing - Three artist - My Room mate, his boy from school, and that kids friend.

Song was planned two-three weeks in advance. Chorus was wrote and everything. We invite the two over to record, surprisingly they were on time, I get everything set up, load up the beat, play it, and ask "Who's going first?" The "friend of a friend" goes - "You got a pen and note pad - I'll have this shit done in five minutes" - instant in my head - but I kept it cool to keep the vibe going.

I give him an iPod and headphones to go with it so that I could get the session started while he wrote. Room mate goes first - nails first take - nails second take - nails all his dubs and adlibs, one down two to go. Room mates friend goes - nails first take - nails second take - nails dubs and adlibs, two down one to go. Sitting around waiting for third guy to get done... little while later he says he's done - alright lets do it.

Set him up - hit play - Me: "Ok this is where i'm starting it" - Him: "Alright" - completely misses his start like 5 times in a row - eventually gets it - then 6-8 bars into it - "Hold up I need to figure out how I'm guna do this" - goes back into the ipod/headphones - we casually sit around talking while we wait - ten minutes later "Aight I got this" - back up to the mic - 2-4 bars later "Aight i'm just guna freestyle the rest"

Lets just say his freestyling consisted of the three of us telling him lines that would work for coming after his previous ones. I didn't even want to waste my life telling him to do two takes of lead vocals, because I know he wouldn't hit them right and it would sound like shit anyway - so two rappers have near perfect vocals - back round vocals - dubs - and adlibs - then one has a main take and a mix of dub/adlibs in the second take.

I understand coming unprepared if your paying someone to do this shit - but being completely unprepared, and being recorded for free by someone you have never met before - WTF? The track was set to you weeks ago.

Rappers - please don't ever be the friend of a friend in this story. Just had to get that off my chest.

[morejaylesswar]

Story of my life. I go through this in EVERY session. I'm tired of recording rappers, lol.

[JoRillo]

Originally Posted by morejaylesswar

Story of my life. I go through this in EVERY session. I'm tired of recording rappers, lol.

More rappers need to be serious about their craft is the problem - I wouldn't think of going to a session like that.

[morejaylesswar]

Originally Posted by JoRillo

More rappers need to be serious about their craft is the problem - I wouldn't think of going to a session like that.

They do. It reflects poorly on every other rapper and it ruins the relationship that they have with the guy recording their music. It's to the point where I don't pick up the phone when some guys call because the little bit of money I get from them is not worth the headache. The experience is invaluable, but c'mon, I'm not going to stress myself over these dudes I record.

I'd rather work with a dedicated rapper for free, than take money from a bullshitter. Unfortunately, I only know of one dedicated guy in my area. Bullshitters begot bullshitters. That's why they all bring their friends along to record at my place.

[suedesound]

your story pretty much sums up my somewhat limited experience with rappers.

half of the sessions i've done they were in and out in a few hours with all doubles, ad libs etc. the other half were me sitting there forever while they stumbled through writing in studio and countless takes, then trying to double what they forgot they just said. i don't have a problem doing hip hop but i expect people to have their shit together.

one of my first hip hop sessions the rapper knocked out 8 songs with doubles and ad libs in less than 4 hours, session was booked for 8 hours and we went home early with bill fully paid. guess i got spoiled from that. he nailed it on first take abot 75% of the time and apologized when he didn't!

[JoRillo]

one of my first hip hop sessions the rapper knocked out 8 songs with doubles and ad libs in less than 4 hours, session was booked for 8 hours and we went home early with bill fully paid. guess i got spoiled from that. he nailed it on first take abot 75% of the time and apologized when he didn't!

I hope that my future experiences are like this. lol I know when it comes to me and my room mate - even if we can't knock it out in half the time planned - we are at least prepared and rehearsed.

[Stg]

id tell em Go home and come back when your ready, Same thing with lead guitar players in "heavy, cut myself, cry in the corner rock"
With my prices and location i get alot of tbhis crap

[Freematik]

Jorillo, you did a session for free for your roommate and your friends, and you are surprised it didn't go more professionally?

I've worked on rap for years, and I don't have these problems.... because now I don't work for friends and don't do free sessions... and I have EXTREMELY talented friends, but I will not spend my hard earned time to record them.

You need to define what is business and what is a hobby, and then these types of problems go away. It might sound nebulous but it's true.

Yes you can have paid sessions where the rapper is unprepared, but this is much more rare than a free session. Why would you expect someone you don't know to care about a free session?

[JoRillo]

I do the production for my room mate - he is my business partner - it was a song on his mixtape - he got two people to be features on his song. I couldn't exactly tell them they have to pay to record here - well i could have - but then the features either wouldn't exist or would have been recorded on their laptop mic. lol (They showed me like 2-3 songs of theirs all recorded on the MBP) Lets just say I don't wana mix a song that sounds good for the first verse and chorus then like shit for the second two verses.

I understand you 100% - and I agree - but I was hoping for at least some kind of professionalism. Maybe I am crazy? The second guy - friend of my room mate - had a verse ready - hit two full takes perfect first try *seemed he had done it more then once* - even had a second verse he started prior to the one he laid down, got half way, and got writers block so he didn't finish - he ended up rapping it to us while we waited on his friend.

I guess not everyone is going to be professional - and that's just something we all have to deal with.

[suedesound]

I hope that my future experiences are like this. lol I know when it comes to me and my room mate - even if we can't knock it out in half the time planned - we are at least prepared and rehearsed.

that session made up for all the horribly unprepared bands i had worked with before. i considered doing alot more hip hop after that even though it's not my forte, then i got the types of clients you complained about. doesn't matter the genre there's always those people.

i did put that rapper and producer on first priority list from then on after that. i think i did 3 or 4 sessions with them and all ran as smoothly. i even knew what mic and chain they liked and had it ready to go when they walked in the door, we'd spend the rest of the booked time at the bar buying each other rounds. ahh, dream clients, so rare.

[Freematik]

I totally understand that some collaborations are going to be free, but what I have learned is to minimize these to only people that are known quantities.... just a suggestion...

I only have one guy that I still let come through, record for free, and take his sweet ass time writing the vocals in the booth and totally waste my time, and that is because his voice is so deep and smooth that sometimes I can't resist, he's doing a freestyle to start this mixtape track:

Automatic | Freematik

BTW- I am only heated about this because I've been burned a lot in the past, and have had to get quite good at dodging bad sessions... like the Zen people say, you need to keep your cup empty

[Ward Pike]

I don't do rap. Never have, never will.

[JoRillo]

I love rap. Always have, always will. You shouldn't let a few people form your entire oppinion on a genre of music. We aren't all unprofessional and ignorant.

[Freematik]

Originally Posted by Ward Pike

I don't do rap. Never have, never will.

I've worked on Latin, Rock, Jazz, Ethiopian, Indian, Country, Taiko, Christian, and many more styles of music, but there is nothing like tracking a great rap verse...

This session had that feel: Hustle To The End | Cali Hit Patrol

[Torea]

I've twice recorded a rock band that has this same issue. Recorded em twice because they're not looking for much and they at least sound good in the end.

The first time we couldn't do the vocals in the first session cause they hadn't written a melody. Vocal session, they hadn't written the lyrics for 2 of 3 songs so they needed another session. 2nd vocal session the singer still couldn't quite get the lyrics to fit the melody and had to have the drummer feed him his lines (surprisingly, this wasn't ghastly, as you might assume with a drummer )

Second time, the bassist was singing the track, kept asking the guitarist how to sing the melody the guitarist had written. Guitarist keeps going "no, I'm not gonna tell you cause you should make it up... but ya know, sing it sorta like I did". That track actually came out really well too, the vocals are my favorite part