Ebay Shill Bidding?

[robertshaw]

that's why I always use a 'buy it now' with best offer if I buy or sell. Id say most highend reserve auctionswith gear and stuff are shill. But ebay isn't stupid either. They have software that monitors this. Obviously they look for identical ip's but they also look at 0 bidders with ip's in the same regions. They have many ways of determining shillers since new accounts now require a credit card. Sure there are ways around everything but it's not as bad as it was 5 years ago before they required positive identity.

but it still goes on. Ebay is a scam. Sellers can't leave negative feedback? that's a joke in itself.
I hate ebay now. It's getting out of hand with rules. And the rules are one sided.

[PhilipCohen]

More food for thought ...

"How to become an eBay Diamond PowerSeller"
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=6502763

[PhilipCohen]

Why is “Noise” Donahoe trying to destroy eBay?
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=6502877

[T_R_S]

Originally Posted by robertshaw

that's why I always use a 'buy it now' with best offer if I buy or sell. Id say most highend reserve auctionswith gear and stuff are shill. But ebay isn't stupid either. They have software that monitors this. Obviously they look for identical ip's but they also look at 0 bidders with ip's in the same regions. They have many ways of determining shillers since new accounts now require a credit card. Sure there are ways around everything but it's not as bad as it was 5 years ago before they required positive identity.

but it still goes on. Ebay is a scam. Sellers can't leave negative feedback? that's a joke in itself.
I hate ebay now. It's getting out of hand with rules. And the rules are one sided.

There is no perfect system - eBay is faced with a very leaky dyke.
As soon as they plug one hole three other leaks spring up somewhere else.

3 years ago I bought an expensive flat panel TV. I thought I saved $500.00 of the store price. He claimed it was new - I got a clearly used TV complete with a nice huge scratch on the screen.
I left Neutral Feedback I really should have left neg feedback. The seller left negative feedback for me. I later found out that eBay had a huge problem with sellers leaving negative feedback for any reason at all so ebay changed it's policy.
Sellers can leave Negative feedback for Nonpaying bidders but if you pay - a seller can't leave neg feedback. I agree it's not perfect but you have a problem with a buyer you can block him and still leave a nasty comment. In the several hundred selling transactions I have only had to block non-paying bidders. I have never really had the need to leave neg feedback to someone who has paid for the item in full.

[ampcabinets]

your page on shill bidding on ebay is horribly out of date and is not entirely correct.
http://www.auctionbytes.com/cab/abu/...11/abu0025/s06

I have been on ebay since it began and things have changed dramatically. It has only gotten worse, as ebay now hides the identity of bidders, and therefore you cannot look up someone locality and see if they are in the same town, etc. Ebay has taken many any steps in hiding this because ebay is all about the money and not user friendliness.
anyone who says they are, is 1) working for ebay, or 2) an idiot.
Just pay attention

Shill bidders, now, have complete anonymity.
TRUE sellers will not allow anyone with 0 feedback to bid on an item, unless contacted and then, if they put in more than, say, 10 bids, they will be canceled, as they are most likely kids bidding on items, just to bid on them. As a seller,. I do not allow zero feedback buyers on my items, period. I'm sorry, but I could care less about their money, rather than running a clean auction.

Shill bidders can have family members or friends put in bids to drive up the price and already know that if they win the item, it will be canceled and relisted.
so, re-listing of the item after someone has put in many bids, is most likely shill bidding.
Shill bidders do NOT necessarily have 0 feedback. They may actually sell back to themselves, a few times, to build a feedback profile, and will buy very small items, while shill bidding on higher dollar items.
I have seen time after time, after time, someone sell an item, just to see it show right back up the next day, for sale, again...the exact same item, and you guessed it, after I put in a bid, here comes the same jerk, who supposedly won the item the last time, come back and bid on it, once again.
I have also seen time after time after time, some shill bidder come in and bid on an item, 10-20 times, WITHOUT ever going over my bid, just to drive it up. I have reported it and ebay just shrugs their shoulders. When you make THAT MANY bids on an item, and never go over my bid you are a shill bidder in my book and I will cancel my bid, period. I do NOT out up with that crap, lone bit. Yet another reason, REAL bidders bid in the last few seconds, each and every time. This ELIMINATES the shill bidder, most of the time. Anyone who bids early is 1) going out of town and doesn't care about how it ends up, 2) is a newbie, or 3) is the seller of the item, in another identity, just to get it started .

Also, REAL bidders, who have been on ebay for ANY length of time, will wait until the very last minute or seconds before bidding on an item, as 99.9% of the time, if you put in an early bid, someone will ALWAYS bid it up to your max, or bid over it, in an attempt to see if you will go higher, with that "gotta have it" mentality.

Rule #1 on ebay, if an item has shown up on ebay, you can bet your ass there will be another.
If I even get a WHIFF of a shill, I will not bid on the item, no matter how much I want it, period. Let the others get ripped off, not me.

I attend REAL auctions all the time ,(ebay is not a REAL auction , and is not registered anywhere as a legitimate auctioneer, actually they are a joke), and they will NOT put up with this crap. I have had people try to pull this, LIVE and I will stare them down and let them have the item, without hesitation. I have already done my homework on it's value, and once I hit that limit, I stop, period. REAL auctions do not allow "hidden" reserve prices, period. It MUST be disclosed or the item will not go to auction. It is LAW!!! No one will go to an auction if they have to GUESS what the opening bid is for an item.

Let's address feedback.
ANYONE who has (and I don't care of they have 10,000 feedbacks) more than 5 or 10 negative feedbacks in their profile, within a month,. has broken ebay rules, but, hey ebay doesn't do jack crap about it, ever. READ the ebay rules, it states it very clearly. So many negative feedbacks in a certain amount if time and you are automatically suspended. I have seen sellers with more than 100 negs in a month and they are still allowed to sell. 100 people cannot ALL be wrong. 200 even less and more then 500 they should never be allowed to sell again, as they are obviously selling crap or not sending items, etc.
So how come they are still pulling this, or even ABLE to pull this?
WHY?
Like I said before, ebay is about the money and not about user friendliness, period. They are ALWAYS about the money.
Ebay won't even allow my "about me page". because I outline the reasons I give negative feedback, so I keep it on my own website and just have a link (ebay has canceled it several times and even barred me from the site until I removed the link). I still have it ,and just give the link to it, on a random basis, to make it harder for ebay to find. Reporting it just shows you what kind of illegal folks are REALLY on ebay. If they were legit, they wouldn't have any problem with it.
The fact that ebay doesn't like it shows you how corrupt ebay really is. Legit folks, also, don't give retaliatory feedback, either. My feedback as a buyer is SUPPOSED to be based solely on how I pay (which I always do immediately following any auction I win) NOT based on the feedback I leave after I receive the item., And, again, this is against ebay rules, but they let everyone get away with it....and you must yourself WHY?
I would dearly love to get my hands on ebay's books and see just how many bidders they have on their payroll. I would imagine, several hundred.

Like I said, anyone who has been on ebay for any length of time, especially years, has seen all of this more than a few times.
If you haven't, you are blind, stupid, or choose to ignore the facts.

to the originator of the article:
Next time, do your homework..................
Address the REAL issues...............
Just like a politician, you won't, I'll bet on that.............

I am on ebay, perusing, EVERY day.....................
I also, get about (or on average) 10 auction flyer's each week, from all around the US from REAL auctions.

[famousbass]

It's easy to do, shill bidding.

Basically, if you don't set yourself a buying price and stick to it, you will get angry at this sort of crap.

Not all sellers conduct business this way.

Regardless, the only way to protect yourself is know what you want, know what it's really worth, set yourself a price and stick with it. That alone should make you immune to the stuff. Otherwise you're just an unmoored boat floating around the harbour.

[AllAboutTone]

Originally Posted by roxxon

It happens all the time.
You will often find out later, when you get a second chance offer! LOL!

I stopped taking second chance offer because of this very topic. It's all BS.

It is sad but 99 percent of my ebay days are over soon it will just another craigslist, and we all know what that is. If I cannot see it I don't buy it.

[AllAboutTone]

Originally Posted by T_R_S

There is no perfect system - eBay is faced with a very leaky dyke.
As soon as they plug one hole three other leaks spring up somewhere else.

3 years ago I bought an expensive flat panel TV. I thought I saved $500.00 of the store price. He claimed it was new - I got a clearly used TV complete with a nice huge scratch on the screen.
I left Neutral Feedback I really should have left neg feedback. The seller left negative feedback for me. I http://www.gearslutz.com/board/image.../bold.giflater found out that eBay had a huge problem with sellers leaving negative feedback for any reason at all so ebay changed it's policy.
Sellers can leave Negative feedback for Nonpaying bidders but if you pay - a seller can't leave neg feedback. I agree it's not perfect but you have a problem with a buyer you can block him and still leave a nasty comment. In the several hundred selling transactions I have only had to block non-paying bidders. I have never really had the need to leave neg feedback to someone who has paid for the item in full.

TRS you should have sent the TV back with signature required and requested your money back from ebay/PP reverse the charge with your bank.
There is a way to get you money back if you are not happy, also signature required is GOLD....

[Jack P]

Originally Posted by ampcabinets

your page on shill bidding on ebay is horribly out of date and is not entirely correct.
eBay: Shill Crazy After all These Years

Shill bidders can have family members or friends put in bids to drive up the price and already know that if they win the item, it will be canceled and relisted.
so, re-listing of the item after someone has put in many bids, is most likely shill bidding.

I'm having to re-list a couple of items, not because of shill bidders but dreamers who don't have the money - there's a lot of that, more so
than in the past..

[spiral]

Originally Posted by joeydego

Cant say I'm innocent. Ive had friends bid on stuff to ensure it doesnt sell below XXX dollars.

+1 same here. After all the fees and such, sometimes auctions end at the wrong time.

The flip side is retracted bids. I've had 40-50 people watching an auction, someone (that i don't know) bid the auction up in the last 2 days, then retract their bid on the last day. That does 2 things: 1. drives watchers away as it makes the price go above what they want; 2. when they retract the bid, it makes the price go way back down from where it would have gone naturally. There is nothing you can do about it! So, the pain goes both ways i'm afraid.

Originally Posted by AllAboutTone

It is sad but 99 percent of my ebay days are over soon it will just another craigslist, and we all know what that is. If I cannot see it I don't buy it.

I understand your ebay frustration but if there is anything worse than than ebay it is craigslist. People way overvalue their stuff and if you are selling something is it a colossal waste of time waiting around for people, and most never show up. I'd rather eat the shipping and send it to a forum member or ebay it.