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Why do so many hit 80s records sound like crap?
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#301
26th April 2009
Old 26th April 2009
  #301
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Certainly there are some really good sounding records but I think the percentage of bad sounding hit records was lots higher than anything before.
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#302
26th April 2009
Old 26th April 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
Certainly there are some really good sounding records but I think the percentage of bad sounding hit records was lots higher than anything before.
+1 Thanks Bob
#303
27th April 2009
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nickelback and co. are the epitome of 80's cock rock in the 00's.
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#304
27th April 2009
Old 27th April 2009
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Wow I just watched Armageddon and teared up at the end...what an over-the-top cheese grater for a movie. I can't believe it got me.

Anyway, I'll say this about the 80s...despite some cringers, there were some VERY amazing things happening, especially the fact that there was a particular sound to many acts that was totally new and unheard. This is in contrast to so many acts today that are either throwbacks to the 60s, 70s or incidentally, the 80s.

I wonder if Rap-Rock will ever make a strong comeback...
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27th April 2009
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#306
27th April 2009
Old 27th April 2009
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The OP probably just made the thread because back then when he started it he had just learnt how to use some of the lingo like amazing reverb, forgot how to engineer, early stuff sounds thin, later stuff sound big, washy.

I think he was just pumped about being able to classify some music as being thin, or as being washy and all that...so he started the thread.
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#307
27th April 2009
Old 27th April 2009
  #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
APIs and Neves were '70s high-end consoles. The high-end console that dominated the '80s was the SSL. Everybody I knew considered it a step down in sound quality but automation that actually worked and dynamics processing on every channel expanded the amount of studio time used for a typical album from six weeks to six months. Instead of hiring a session musician who could knock out a part in a half hour, keyboard players would spend ten hours massaging a DX-7 part to work.
It seems that every decade has a different sound that is imprinted in the audio, no matter what genre. I think it has to do with the audio gear they are using and how each decade wants to "Rebel" from the previous. For instance, the 70's saw the rise of API, NEVE, TRIDENT etc. Which are big, warm sounding mixing consoles. The reverb that they used was still Analog spring type stuff which is rich as well. In the 80's they wanted to rebel against this by using SSL consoles and focused on more highs and less warmth/Deepness. It was all about Crazy in your face presence. The keyboards that they used such as the DX7,DS,CZ series and such were new generation digital synths that were very harsh and bright to begin with, same with new Digital Reverbs. (That they caked on btw)

All of the previously listed Mixing consoles are still used today but they are used more conservatively to create a more well rounded sound. And the reverbs and keyboards of today are also more realistic and used more intelligently in my perspective. However, probably the issue of modern recordings is the fact that everyone wants to have super loud mixes/masters. (Over-Compression) I think thats what people will look back on our generation of music and shake their heads.
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#308
27th April 2009
Old 27th April 2009
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I never heard of anybody wanting to rebel!

There has only been one trend:

1. cheaper

1a. making somebody sound better than they really are

In many ways it has just been a race to the bottom.
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#309
27th April 2009
Old 27th April 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
I never heard of anybody wanting to rebel!

There has only been one trend:

1. cheaper

1a. making somebody sound better than they really are

In many ways it has just been a race to the bottom.
Well-put as evidenced by much of today's production techniques and gear.

But then again, I think all industries will gravitate to cheaper and easier when money is on the line.

True artists will always care about sounding good, and it is the audience that rebels against a certain sound once they're fed up with it.

Look how Nirvana absolutely beheaded mainstream Metal in the 90s, and that album could play on the radio tomorrow and sound fresh. Can't say that about Bullet Boys or Warrant, but we've come to the point where those acts can play simply on nostalgia.

All of a sudden the Rainbow Room is cool again! stikestikestike
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#310
27th April 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hello people View Post
The OP probably just made the thread because back then when he started it he had just learnt how to use some of the lingo like amazing reverb, forgot how to engineer, early stuff sounds thin, later stuff sound big, washy.

I think he was just pumped about being able to classify some music as being thin, or as being washy and all that...so he started the thread.
+1 thumbsup

-The OP
#311
29th April 2009
Old 29th April 2009
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Obviously personal taste is exactly that... and I think more great music was made in the 80s than in the 90s or now. That might just be a childhood nostalgia thing... I mean, Pantera and Radiohead made some landmark albums in the 90s, but you know, self-loathing gets tiring after a while... sometimes it is just fun to put on some Def Leppard, Van Halen, Bon Jovi or Guns 'n Roses and just bop your head and party!

Also, listen to Hysteria (Def Leppard) and tell me where it sounds 'thin'? Yes, it was mixed on an SSL, used an AMS sampler, programmed drums (bear in mind the drummer had just lost his arm), gated snare, reverb for days and every guitar part has chorus or some form of processing on it, yet it sounds huge, totally immersive and even though it is the epitome of 80s production, doesn't sound overly forced or trite.
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#312
29th April 2009
Old 29th April 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kats View Post
The decade of decadence, everything was over the top. You know, "go big or go home", "greed is good" etc.

Not everything was that bad though - just the mainstream reflecting mainstream attitudes.
+1 Life imitates and ..
So happy we're over the 80ies. But we still need more humanity in modern pop productions.
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#313
29th April 2009
Old 29th April 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by headwerkn View Post
Obviously personal taste is exactly that... and I think more great music was made in the 80s than in the 90s or now. That might just be a childhood nostalgia thing... I mean, Pantera and Radiohead made some landmark albums in the 90s, but you know, self-loathing gets tiring after a while... sometimes it is just fun to put on some Def Leppard, Van Halen, Bon Jovi or Guns 'n Roses and just bop your head and party!

Also, listen to Hysteria (Def Leppard) and tell me where it sounds 'thin'? Yes, it was mixed on an SSL, used an AMS sampler, programmed drums (bear in mind the drummer had just lost his arm), gated snare, reverb for days and every guitar part has chorus or some form of processing on it, yet it sounds huge, totally immersive and even though it is the epitome of 80s production, doesn't sound overly forced or trite.
I'm the OP, and I totally am on the same page as you other than a few things.

First of all I LOVE Hysteria, and yes it does sound big. A little washy but big and a great album. Appetite for Destruction...very thin to me...don't know why they wanted it like that but whatever.

The records I'm referring to in this thread are the likes of Bobby Brown, Kate Bush, early Police (anorexic-sounding), then you got the horribly-overdone bands like Warrant, Bullet Boys and all the hair bands.

I mean, even compare the sonic quality of Dark Side of the Moon to The Wall and you'll hear a huge change in sound. You even start to hear that dated Bradshaw rig-esque lead guitar creeping in!
#314
4th May 2009
Old 4th May 2009
  #314
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hi

I have vinyls of both periods, and i'm not sure on what you can name as "thin".
I bet it's a total personal mater of taste, and you prolly gonna make fun of me, but I find that Prince's Lm-1 is sounding more punchier and warmer than John Bohnam drum kit . I was raised on New Order Blue Monday beat, and maybe I spent (and still spending) far too much time in nightclubs, but I usually find 70's record very poor on the kick drum. Well sure I more than love the thing labelled as Synth Pop, and it hardly existed in the 70's, exept maybe Giorgio Moroder or Kraftwerk. I do own all Roxy Music LP's as well as Bowie's till Let's Dance, some Led Zep and the fantastic Chic ones. The Chic sound is one of my favorite ever, especially the Bernard Edwards bass sound, and way of playing. As for Roxy Music, the early work sounds amazing (Bogus man), but to my ears less warm than Avalon.
As for a typical 70's hit, I can think of Abba's Dancing Queen, and I find the bass and drum parts very "thin", the overall mix sounds too much bright to me, but it's multi platinum isn't it ?
You gonna think I'm a freak but of all songs and record I own and have listened to, I haven't found anything as warm to my ears as Billy's Idol Eyes Without a Face, just love that bass sound, whenever I play it it does dudududududum to my belly, I think it was mixed on a Neve (and yes it's a LinnDrum).

Then I do agree some things sounded really "poor" and thin, though we may not have same references as North America and Europe were different markets. But I own a bunch of italo dance records which were summer hits in europe and are obviously low rent gear, studio and personnel. So maybe that's where it is, as 80's went by, a lot of affordable japanese recording gear and instruments were on the market for some wealthy hobbiests with some primitive knowledge in recording/engenering/mixing and voilĂ ...but that doesn't explain your point of view on Appetite for Destruction which I too own on vinyl and wasn't low budget. It doesn't sound "thin" to me, it just sounds "metal" though i'm not a metal expert.

cheers
#315
4th May 2009
Old 4th May 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Zick View Post
The records I'm referring to in this thread are the likes of Bobby Brown, Kate Bush, early Police (anorexic-sounding), then you got the horribly-overdone bands like Warrant, Bullet Boys and all the hair bands.
Michael: I'm afraid we now have no choice but to duel to the death at dawn.

I will shed my last drop of blood in support of Miss B., right down to the most minute Fairlight lick on Hounds of Love, which in my fervent opinion is the great work of genius of the '80s. "Genius" not being a word I use much. Gated reverbs be damned.

Swords, or pistols? Or maybe LARCs at 50 paces?
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#316
4th May 2009
Old 4th May 2009
  #316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgesMaraudeur View Post
hi

I have vinyls of both periods, and i'm not sure on what you can name as "thin".
I bet it's a total personal mater of taste, and you prolly gonna make fun of me, but I find that Prince's Lm-1 is sounding more punchier and warmer than John Bohnam drum kit . I was raised on New Order Blue Monday beat, and maybe I spent (and still spending) far too much time in nightclubs, but I usually find 70's record very poor on the kick drum. Well sure I more than love the thing labelled as Synth Pop, and it hardly existed in the 70's, exept maybe Giorgio Moroder or Kraftwerk. I do own all Roxy Music LP's as well as Bowie's till Let's Dance, some Led Zep and the fantastic Chic ones. The Chic sound is one of my favorite ever, especially the Bernard Edwards bass sound, and way of playing. As for Roxy Music, the early work sounds amazing (Bogus man), but to my ears less warm than Avalon.
As for a typical 70's hit, I can think of Abba's Dancing Queen, and I find the bass and drum parts very "thin", the overall mix sounds too much bright to me, but it's multi platinum isn't it ?
You gonna think I'm a freak but of all songs and record I own and have listened to, I haven't found anything as warm to my ears as Billy's Idol Eyes Without a Face, just love that bass sound, whenever I play it it does dudududududum to my belly, I think it was mixed on a Neve (and yes it's a LinnDrum).

Then I do agree some things sounded really "poor" and thin, though we may not have same references as North America and Europe were different markets. But I own a bunch of italo dance records which were summer hits in europe and are obviously low rent gear, studio and personnel. So maybe that's where it is, as 80's went by, a lot of affordable japanese recording gear and instruments were on the market for some wealthy hobbiests with some primitive knowledge in recording/engenering/mixing and voilĂ ...but that doesn't explain your point of view on Appetite for Destruction which I too own on vinyl and wasn't low budget. It doesn't sound "thin" to me, it just sounds "metal" though i'm not a metal expert.

cheers
+1! The Billy Idol "Rebel Yell" record sounded amazingly huge! Keith Forsey did a great job on that record. "Thin" is on another planet from this record. The Clearmountain stuff (Let's Dance, Roxy Music, Chic, etc) was of course very good, not thin (most were mixed on SSL, but tracked on a Neve). I thought Appetite was not thin, Barbiero's mix had plenty of huevos!
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#317
4th May 2009
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The 80s make me sick

Ok i just hate the 80s, as some people say there are a bunch of good albums made in that time, but most of them suuuck!!!!

Everytime i hear those 80's huge reverbs, those crapy beatbox sounds, and those nasty bass lines i feel sick, like wanting to puke, the feeling is similar to what happens when you are trying to read a novel, inside a moving car, on a very bumpy road at 7:00 pm twilight, after eating a lot of chilli and shrimps.

I mean i dont get it, those days were like "ahhh can you make my drum set sound more midi man?" WTF????

And can someone explain this to me please: What could be so wrong, or WTF happened, to make a bunch of hippies from the 60s and 70s transform into a bunch of drag queens in the 80s? i just dont get it.....
#318
4th May 2009
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80s

Nine Inch Nails - Pretty Hate Machine
Janes Addiction - Nothing's Shocking
Ministry - Land Of Rape & Honey
Depeche Mode - Black Celebration
The Cure - Head On The Door
U2 - War, Unforgettable Fire, Joshua Tree
Peter Gabriel - So
Daniel Lanois - Acadie
Van Halen - Diver Down, 1984
Replacements - Pleased To Meet Me
Kraftwerk - Computer World

all this before I even get to this list:
Pitchfork: Top 100 Albums of the 1980s
#319
4th May 2009
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70's = great sound
80's = more modern sound but great
90's = begin of bad homerecording sound...

2000= loudness war
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#320
4th May 2009
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The question is, at any given time, do they make it sound like they want it to sound ?
#321
4th May 2009
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Why do so many hit 80s records sound like crap?
COCAINE !!!!!
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#322
4th May 2009
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Originally Posted by Beyersound View Post
+1! The Billy Idol "Rebel Yell" record sounded amazingly huge! Keith Forsey did a great job on that record. "Thin" is on another planet from this record. The Clearmountain stuff (Let's Dance, Roxy Music, Chic, etc) was of course very good, not thin (most were mixed on SSL, but tracked on a Neve). I thought Appetite was not thin, Barbiero's mix had plenty of huevos!
Let's Dance is a 5-star record, and I love Bowie. I'd say it's the pinnacle of his career. After that? In my opinion, he fell into oblivion save for the Labrynth stuff with Trevor Horn.

Honestly I think it's the use of reverb and the lack of lowend on so many records that makes me wonder what was going on. Songwriting-wise the decade was on another level.

Oh yeah, and the hair and clothing styles...yuck. I'd say reverb was used like their hairspray...too much.

I did revisit Naked Eyes' "promises promises." Fun song, great hook, TOTALLY 80s.
#323
4th May 2009
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Okay....I admit that I haven't read all the posts in the previous 12 pages, so I apologize if this is redundant. I think in addition to the synth thing, there was also a trend towards, "Who wants that old equipment?" Most consoles were IC based with mediocre VCA's and electronically balanced outputs instead of transformers. Then....not nearly as many opto compressors, mostly somewhat cheesy VCA comps. (Again a HUGE generalization) Yeah, some people were into tube mics, but that craze had not yet had a resurgence. There was, in many cases, just more of a focus on the new technology, and much of it was thin sounding. Adding to that, the creeping in of digital. Bad fx, some 14 bit A/D's.....Oh, and then thngs like the Simmons drum kit being popular. Dx7 has already been mentioned. It all added to make new sounds that seemed really cool for about 15 minutes, until you never wanted to hear them again because you realised how ANNOYING THEY ARE.

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#324
4th May 2009
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  #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Zick View Post
70s...great.
90s...great.

In between? So many crap sounding recordings!! Why? They had amazing reverb on Dark Side. Why all of a sudden it's 1981 and bands start to sound like people forgot how to engineer?
I am coming in waaay late. I think that this is purely subjective and biased. Personally, I think the 90s sucked.

If you are talking sonics and the whole analog vs. digital thing, then I would say that there were no engineers really versed in digital audio production before the 80s. So when digital came we had that inexperience, people using bright gear fashioned for analog tape and consoles, using bright mics, etc. Then we had crappy first gen A/D and D/A, etc.

There is something to be said for the SSL sound contributing too. Back in the day, people were not holding the SSLs up on high because of their sonics. They were holding them up for the recall and automation.
#325
4th May 2009
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It's interesting to hear some of the deluxe/bonus cd sections today, many of them are throwing some demo songs, so you can compare the path from the initial start to how they (the band ? the A & R ? the producer ?) made it finally sound.
#326
5th May 2009
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No offense, but I think that generalizing and saying things like "'80s music sucks", "I hate the '80s" and so on maybe denotes a bit of musical ignorance.

Really. So much great music was created in the 80s, so many diverse new movements, artists, sounds and genres emerged from that decade that you wouldn't really know where to start writing a list.
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#327
5th May 2009
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Originally Posted by combfilter View Post
No offense, but I think that generalizing and saying things like "'80s music sucks", "I hate the '80s" and so on maybe denotes a bit of musical ignorance.

Really. So much great music was created in the 80s, so many diverse new movements, artists, sounds and genres emerged from that decade that you wouldn't really know where to start writing a list.
Sure, there just seems to be a lot of "what were they thinking" from that decade more so than most others, in terms of sounds and styles.

I think that for the most part, whenever you take things so far out of realism with mechanical-sounding effects and outlandish-sounding techniques, you end up cornering yourself deeper into a time period. At the same time, I can see how the music was very much a reflection of the attitudes of the decade. Somehow I can see how a person who'd drive a candy red Ferrari and wear a gold watch someone who'd also like big synthetic drums and screaming vocals.

But then again you have today's Ferrari drivers listening to synthetic drums of a different genre. Coincidence?
#328
10th May 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batchainpuller78 View Post
One could start a thread why so many of todays hits sound like crap.
Yup. It's all in the ears of the beholder(s).

This thread is long.

also, can I add Dire Straits' "Brothers in Arms" to the awesome eighties records?

Also Black Crowes and Lenny Kravitz were doing amazingly well in the nineties and their sound/production did not suck... could be more than one reason. One of which is... their music is great?
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#329
12th May 2009
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Originally Posted by 2N1305 View Post
Yup. It's all in the ears of the beholder(s).

This thread is long.

also, can I add Dire Straits' "Brothers in Arms" to the awesome eighties records?
Yes you may. Great record, "Ride Across The River" is one of the better mixes of any era. Was made back when dynamics were still fashionable.
#330
12th May 2009
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