Adjusting the mix(master) for SoundCloud

[Arthur Stone]

Originally Posted by sat159p1

Post audio files for what?

I'm just sayin' if you make strong statements on an audio site like GS then it makes your opinion more valid if you post audio files in support. A poster claimed Soundcloud audio 'sucks' - my opinion is that it's no better or worse than similar sites - so I asked him for an example...nothing wrong with that.

Originally Posted by sat159p1

Man, take a wave file, upload it on SC, the BC and listen and compare to the original...

Here: The Soundcloud Challenge

Originally Posted by sat159p1

...Maybe you like SC more because of that "extras" they're "adding"...

Yeah - I like the 'extras' and the 10 million+ community; but as well as looking good and being great for social networking I prefer the audio to other services I've used. Maybe it's familiarity but to me SC sounds musical...it's got a great vibe.

Originally Posted by sat159p1

...The topic was discusses here on GS many times, search.

I know. I've participated in most of the threads and they're in my 'posts' list. Interestingly, in all those threads, no-one has ever been able to post audio samples which demonstrated that SC streaming audio is of a worse quality than similar services. Of course, some will have that opinion.

[mrwonderful]

I put throwaways on Soundcloud for this reason. I love the community but the quality that it encodes at is a turn off. I stick with soundclick for my finished products. Just makes more sense. Hope that may put some kind of an id into ya head op !

[LynFresh]

I used to have the same problem with certain sounds clipping harshly in soundcloud. I found that when I stopped using limiters on my music the artifacts would not appear. Idk if you're using a limiter or not, but if you are, try removing it and then check your sound quality on sc.
Peace

[Arthur Stone]

Originally Posted by LynFresh

I used to have the same problem with certain sounds clipping harshly in soundcloud. I found that when I stopped using limiters on my music the artifacts would not appear. Idk if you're using a limiter or not, but if you are, try removing it and then check your sound quality on sc.
Peace

I'll often upload a track, have a listen, then adjust some EQ, etc. and re-upload. I have a similar method with video; the compression crushes the dynamic range (of light/colour) so I live with it for a while and re-adjust.

I guess that Sonnox decoder plug-in is a godsend for busy producers.

[dubmunkey]

Originally Posted by jrhager84

Let's see:

Box, dropbox, pure volume, band camp, tunecore...

Shall I continue?

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Wow, someone has his angry shoes on! :thumbup:

[jrhager84]

I hate when people ask questions, you provide an answer, then some bozo asks for all this proof. You have an answer, test it for yourself to see if you feel the same. Hand holding time is over! Lol

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[Arthur Stone]

Originally Posted by jrhager84

I hate when people ask questions, you provide an answer, then some bozo asks for all this proof. You have an answer, test it for yourself to see if you feel the same. Hand holding time is over! Lol...

IMO you haven't provided any audio file examples (of SC 'sucking' in comparison to similar sites) because what you claim is incorrect. Other people have provided files or done independent tests but these have shown little difference (good or bad) between sites - so I don't think you would be able to.

The Soundcloud Challenge

[jrhager84]

Nobody can speak with ultimate authority. That's the point: collect opinions, and pursue your own knowledge... Don't sit there with your nose up asking for empirical evidence. I've heard it personally, and that's enough for me. I've shared my personal experience, and won't tolerate being berated or disrespected for it. If you disagree, fine. I couldn't care less...

For instance:

Bounce some waves (sine waves) in octaves (or 1/3 octaves if you're feeling brave) from 20hz to 20khz . Hell, bounce some pink or white noise....Upload to SC... Hear it rape your waveforms...

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[stinkyfingers]

this is my square wave
the top one is soundcloud
the bottom one is bandcamp
if you make squares waves, maybe soundcloud is better for you
who knows
not me

[dubmunkey]

What does looking at the visual representation prove? we did a test a while ago and all sc does is compress to 128, a tune at around -12dbfs was still at that level after sc had processed it

I honestly dont care either way and actually prefer the way bc lets you navigate and play a tune simultaneously

[Arthur Stone]

Originally Posted by jrhager84

Nobody can speak with ultimate authority. That's the point: collect opinions, and pursue your own knowledge... Don't sit there with your nose up asking for empirical evidence. I've heard it personally, and that's enough for me. I've shared my personal experience, and won't tolerate being berated or disrespected for it. If you disagree, fine. I couldn't care less...

I'm sorry if you feel disrespected - that isn't my intention, after all it's your debateable comment on a public forum that I'm challenging not you personally.

I've got the right to express my opinion too; IMO there is nothing wrong with empirical evidence - in fact it's responsible for much of the technological world that enables us to communicate and make music. I see lot's of threads on Gearslutz full of audio file comparisons, hardware and software, so I don't see an issue with extending that to streaming algorithms.

Originally Posted by jrhager84

For instance:

Bounce some waves (sine waves) in octaves (or 1/3 octaves if you're feeling brave) from 20hz to 20khz . Hell, bounce some pink or white noise....Upload to SC... Hear it rape your waveforms...

If you've done the test yourself already then feel free to post the files in the Soundcloud Challenge thread.

[jrhager84]

I only get so many minutes, dude. I use it as a scratch track demo page because I'll tell ya what, aside from the steam quality, they've got it.

Also, MY opinion was anecdotal. Yours only questioned and challenged mine. Think about that for a second...

PS, somebody before me posted a square wave. Take a gander.

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[jrhager84]

Originally Posted by dubmunkey

What does looking at the visual representation prove? we did a test a while ago and all sc does is compress to 128, a tune at around -12dbfs was still at that level after sc had processed it

I honestly dont care either way and actually prefer the way bc lets you navigate and play a tune simultaneously

Nobody is saying it doesn't have it's merits. What is being said, is soundcloud (to me) has a very profound, and very negative impact on my tunes...

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[schmuck]

The highest peak of the audio should be at -0.3 and then the SC compression should leave your audio more or less alone.

[anabolique]

Originally Posted by schmuck

The highest peak of the audio should be at -0.3 and then the SC compression should leave your audio more or less alone.

I never go above -0.3 anyway ... in fact I even tried -3... then settled for -0.5

Originally Posted by Arthur Stone

I'll often upload a track, have a listen, then adjust some EQ, etc. and re-upload. I have a similar method with video; the compression crushes the dynamic range (of light/colour) so I live with it for a while and re-adjust.

I guess that Sonnox decoder plug-in is a godsend for busy producers.

Yeah, I am also doing it... but thats the first track i uploaded to soundcloud.. so I thought that i could use some "shortcut" -advice from people who delt with this many times already... Is there some things that you do on a "regular basis" when bouncing the track with SoundCloud's 128kbps mp3 in mind..

[schmuck]

Sorry I need to correct myself. It is -3 db headroom, not -0.3 that is needed.

I tried it out with a track last week that had a solo bass part on which the SC distortion/compression was very audible. After I reduced the volume to peak at max -3, it was fine (just the normal bad 128 mp3 sound).

[mikeg09]

Originally Posted by schmuck

Sorry I need to correct myself. It is -3 db headroom, not -0.3 that is needed.

I tried it out with a track last week that had a solo bass part on which the SC distortion/compression was very audible. After I reduced the volume to peak at max -3, it was fine (just the normal bad 128 mp3 sound).

Oh really? I did not know that thanks! So if I put a limiter on my mix and lower the ceiling to -3, it should be fine? Or should I not put a limiter and just have the song peaking at -3 before uploading to SC?

[jrhager84]

If you do that and only that, you're killing 3db of headroom.

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[Nealatosis]

Originally Posted by jrhager84

If you do that and only that, you're killing 3db of headroom.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're suggesting turning down the main out volume to give the extra head room, not squashing it with a limiter right?

[jrhager84]

Originally Posted by Nealatosis

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're suggesting turning down the main out volume to give the extra head room, not squashing it with a limiter right?

Yes.

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[dubmunkey]

Originally Posted by jrhager84

Nobody is saying it doesn't have it's merits. What is being said, is soundcloud (to me) has a very profound, and very negative impact on my tunes...

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Fair enough, i must have missed where you explained what this profound negative impact is and will have to and reread as that is quite a strong statement

[Ecktronic]

I say YouTube has the best quality free audio streaming.

[schmuck]

Originally Posted by mikeg09

Oh really? I did not know that thanks! So if I put a limiter on my mix and lower the ceiling to -3, it should be fine? Or should I not put a limiter and just have the song peaking at -3 before uploading to SC?

you can do both, but if it was already limited for the zero dbs it will obviouisly be too squashed if you add 3db more limiting. For trying it out I just reduced the overall volume by -3 db. For music that is already limited/compressed, it makes less of a difference (in perceived volume) than one might think. I guess that the "feeling" of loudness comes mainly from the amount of compression than how "loud" it is in dbs (but don't want to start an argument in THIS subforum about this ;-).

Surely I am happier with a track that sounds more or less as I intended it (but with a bit less volume) than the full volume and certain passages are heavily screwed.

[Nealatosis]

Originally Posted by schmuck

you can do both, but if it was already limited for the zero dbs it will obviouisly be too squashed if you add 3db more limiting. For trying it out I just reduced the overall volume by -3 db. For music that is already limited/compressed, it makes less of a difference (in perceived volume) than one might think. I guess that the "feeling" of loudness comes mainly from the amount of compression than how "loud" it is in dbs (but don't want to start an argument in THIS subforum about this ;-).

Surely I am happier with a track that sounds more or less as I intended it (but with a bit less volume) than the full volume and certain passages are heavily screwed.

Thanks for your advice, I'm going have to put it to use next time I upload a song.

[coyotekells]

Originally Posted by Nealatosis

So you're saying that no matter what form I upload my file as it will be a 128 mp3 in the soundcloud player?

I would imagine so. However, I can bet an 128 mp3 created from a 320 mp3 would sound marginally worse than an 128 mp3 encoded directly from a Wav

[mikeg09]

Originally Posted by schmuck

you can do both, but if it was already limited for the zero dbs it will obviouisly be too squashed if you add 3db more limiting. For trying it out I just reduced the overall volume by -3 db. For music that is already limited/compressed, it makes less of a difference (in perceived volume) than one might think. I guess that the "feeling" of loudness comes mainly from the amount of compression than how "loud" it is in dbs (but don't want to start an argument in THIS subforum about this ;-).

Surely I am happier with a track that sounds more or less as I intended it (but with a bit less volume) than the full volume and certain passages are heavily screwed.

Thanks!

[cuebism]

Originally Posted by anabolique

The problem is following:
I uploaded a track and I noticed that hi hats are harsher, thinner

Interesting. I noticed something similar in this forum:

When a user uploads an interesting topic to Gearslutz, it often starts to sound harsh and fatiguing after a while.

Reading the first page of this thread has been an unpleasant experience, although the original question was very interesting.