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Renoized
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8th July 2012
Old 8th July 2012
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Burning a Master CD

Hey guys,

quick one for you: When finishing your redbook master and burning it to CD do you use dedicated gear for it?

For example, do you buy special CDs and have a CD burner that you checked out extensively? I have a standard USB external CD/DVD writer and a spindle of your average off-the-shelf-in-a-supermarket CDs, if I use this combination and send it off for duplication will it be good enough? (I do plan to run error checking to make sure that the final burn is okay)
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I personally stick with a proven combination of Plextor PX-760A's or Premiums - using JVC (formerly Taiyo Yuden) unbranded ink-jet printable 52x compatible silver/blue media - and error check after burns using Plextools 3.16XL.

Best regards,
Steve Berson
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Ditto what Steve said.
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Ditto what Rick said.
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Ditto what Dropd9 said.
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ditto what ORC said (only non plextor drive with taiyo yuden media and opti drive control for checking, instead of plextools).

might be cheaper for you to hire a real ME than trying to do it all yourself?
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Ditto what Babaluma said, but all Plextor (Premium, Premium II, 760) on specially ordered Taiyo Yuden media at the burn speed our tests found gave lowest errors in those particular burners.

Each and every CD-DA master goes through a PlexTools QC as well as a top to bottom listen.

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9th July 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renoized View Post
, if I use this combination and send it off for duplication will it be good enough? (I do plan to run error checking to make sure that the final burn is okay)
Probably fine, and an error test will tell you for sure. I've been using an inexpensive LG CD/DVD drive for the past few months and getting error rates on par with my Plextor Premium.
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Adam Dempsey
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And then of course you'd want the read speed of the error tests to be the same as that used by the plant, in order for the test to be as meaningful as possible.
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Chris Bauer
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9th July 2012
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Plextor and Taiyo Yuden here too.

PlexTools is useful for error checking.
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Vintage Plextors and TY media here as well.

Perhaps there oughta be a FAQ sticky for all these often asked questions.

"Best" burner (and speed

"Best" media.

"Best" DAW app for Mac.

"Best" limiter plug-in.

How do I get it loud?

How come DIY "mastering" doesn't sounds as good as the Pros?

Etc. Etc. Etc.

: - )

Best, JT
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Last edited by Jerry Tubb; 9th July 2012 at 06:38 PM.. Reason: Added "and speed" !
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What's everyones thinking on burn speeds these days? I use TY cdr's with my macs built in burner at 4x speed. They seem fine although i've never found any software for the mac that can verify them. Occasionally they won't play in old cd players.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dug Wolfsohn View Post
What's everyones thinking on burn speeds these days?
On my system Sadie/Plextor/TY I've found 8x to be optimum.
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Any idea how i can find out what is optimum for my system. Mac G5, apple internal burner, TY discs?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dug Wolfsohn View Post
Any idea how i can find out what is optimum for my system. Mac G5, apple internal burner, TY discs?
Maybe there's a GS member in the UK that can run a Plextools test on some discs that you have burned.
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8x or 16x TY on the PX-716 seems about the same, no critical errors.

Best, JT
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So am i wrong in thinking that slower is always better? Thats why i've always used 4x speed. But if 8 or 16 will do then i can save myself some time!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dug Wolfsohn View Post
So am i wrong in thinking that slower is always better? Thats why i've always used 4x speed. But if 8 or 16 will do then i can save myself some time!
The discs available these days are formulated for high speed burning so 8x or 16x are still conservative speeds compared to the maximum ratings. I gotta admit though, I still have the old habits and always use a very conservative 8x on anything critical even though I have checked 16x and agree with Jerry that I can find no real difference between 8 and 16. Heck, I cut masters at 2x for 10 years on my Sonic so now 8x seems like a blink in comparison.

Old habits die hard!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Sutton View Post
Maybe there's a GS member in the UK that can run a Plextools test on some discs that you have burned.
You can send us a couple of discs to check on Plextools and Optidrive if you like. Email me for the address.
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How about some good old Verbatim CD-R 700MB 52x Disc's?

These are practically the only ones[that I've been able to find]that come in 100 pack spindles around here-Sth. Adelaide.

Also I find no difference[almost?],wether I'm using the basic DVD/CD+-RW GT32N writer in my April 2011 dell xps laptop,or the LGE BH10LS30 BluRay lightscribe writer on my desktop.

I think this is a subject where many,would like a solid answer[computer burners]as to wether theyr'e really good enough?

As long as user error,can more or less[?] be ruled out.

RK
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Old drive porsche by lacie, and at 8x or 4x with SB HD 2.0 not complains but depends the batch of Tayio Yuden and I check errors with a Plextor 755.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit View Post
How about some good old Verbatim CD-R 700MB 52x Disc's?
Verbatim's quality is a bit variable. The know how to make good discs but they often don't. Look out for Datalife Plus discs as they're usually better than the plain Datalife discs.

James.
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QC

Let me just clarify that, ideally, you'd really want to establish a relationship with a replicator, in which case they can test a bunch of master discs on their Eclipse system, at their read speed, and you'd fine-tune things from there, changing just one variable at a time of course.
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This thread leaves me wondering if a vintage Plextor drive is truly needed or is it just a proven method by engineer's that have been in the industry for a while..

I come from a pc enthusiast back ground and I remind myself how fast every thing updates in the pc industry .. almost every year there are leaps in pc hardware and software.. You can get a OEM sata dvd drive for 15$ now.. Not saying an 15$ drive is a good choice, But rather the manufacturing process in drives is old, proven and common..


So I wonder, shouldn't a good quality Sony, Samsung, or lg drive perform the same if not better as a vintage PC drive.. Speed means a lot when burning the disk and is a important factor..

Considering how fast computers age.. Usually Vintage PC parts are only good for museum displays..


Is everyone just playing it safe? What happens when the vintage drives are gone..

Last edited by Umulamahri; 29th April 2013 at 05:28 AM.. Reason: Typo Changed "the most" to "a important factor"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Umulamahri View Post
This thread leaves me wondering if a vintage Plextor drive is truly needed or is it just a proven method by engineer's that have been in the industry for a while..

I come from a pc enthusiast back ground and I remind myself how fast every thing updates in the pc industry .. almost every year there are leaps in pc hardware and software.. You can get a OEM sata dvd drive for 15$ now.. Not saying an 15$ drive is a good choice, But rather the manufacturing process in drives is old, proven and common..


So I wonder, shouldn't a good quality Sony, Samsung, or lg drive perform the same if not better as a vintage PC drive.. Speed means a lot when burning the disk and is the most important factor..

Considering how fast computers age.. Usually Vintage PC parts are only good for museum displays..


Is everyone just playing it safe? What happens when the vintage drives are gone..
The Plextors will let you use PlexTools to be able to quality check your burnt CDs so that you can be confident in what you are sending out. Plenty of other drives burn fine, but for mastering it is good to be able to check your product for errors prior to sending it out to the plant, especially where deadlines are involved. A rejected master at a plant could push back a pressing up to a couple of weeks and would leave your customers not trusting your work.

I generally use my Mac SuperDrive (I think it's a rebranded Sony from memory) for the bulk of my burning, and it performs every bit as well as my plextor drives, but you would never know unless you have the ability to test your discs, and plextor is still the best way to do this in a mastering studio environment in my opinion.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Umulamahri View Post
Speed means a lot when burning the disk and is the most important factor..
Why do you say that?
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Just a quick plug for OptiDriveControl, I think written by the same person as Plextools, and works on most drives (not just Plextor). Cheap and still updated.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Babaluma View Post
Just a quick plug for OptiDriveControl, I think written by the same person as Plextools, and works on most drives (not just Plextor). Cheap and still updated.
Just a quick note from my experience, I started with opti drive control and one of the compatible lite-on drives and it consisterly gave me incredibly low error counts and always passed my discs. I had a master pass on opti drive control then get knocked back by a pressing plant.

I eventually moved to a plextor drive with PlexTools and the results I got with this set up was more realistic and consistent with what the pressing plant would report back to me. I am sure if you work at finding the right drive and computer combination with opti drive control you could get accurate. It is good to develop a relationship with a pressing plant and ask them to report their eclipse test results back to you, to confirm that your set up is working accurately and consistently.

I would much rather have more discs fail QC than pass and have it knocked back by the pressing plant.
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Duly noted! Did you report your findings to Erik at OptiDriveControl with your findings? He's been great and speedy at communicating and updating the software when I've been in touch with him.

The trouble with Plextor drives and Plextools is that the good drives are no longer being made, and the software is no longer being updated, so it's doomed at some stage in the future (although so are CDs, I think!)
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