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consensus on best time strech/compression software?
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Mr XY
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26th June 2011
Old 26th June 2011
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consensus on best time strech/compression software?

do you golden eared mastering types have any thoughts on the best software for speeding up audio a few bpm. I've been trying with PT elastic audio but am thinking the mastering world may know of some esoteric magic software I'm not aware of? Many thanks for any ideas you may have..
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26th June 2011
Old 26th June 2011
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Ableton did it first, but I'm pretty sure Pro Tools and Logic copied the same algorithms. I'm not too familiar with time stretching in Pro Tools or Logic although I have done it. In ableton they give you more choices on what youre time stretching so when the software stretches it, it knows what it's trying to conserve (i.e. gives you the option to stretch by beat, pitch, and a few other options)

Be aware you are posting on a Pro Tools board... and I can guarantee you that most of them are going to swear by PT just because they don't want to leave their comfort zone.
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26th June 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr XY View Post
do you golden eared mastering types have any thoughts on the best software for speeding up audio a few bpm. I've been trying with PT elastic audio but am thinking the mastering world may know of some esoteric magic software I'm not aware of? Many thanks for any ideas you may have..
The best with regards to sund quality is to varipitch the audio, via sample rate conversion, for example. Provided you can live with a ptich change, that is.

If you don't want pitch to change, the best I've heard so far is the time stretching algorithm in Wavelab 7.
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26th June 2011
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26th June 2011
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Haven't tried the new Wavelab one or the Serato one, but I think that Izotope Radius is pretty good on small doses.
Have used it to slow down a portion of a song at the clients request, and all were really happy with the results.
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26th June 2011
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thanks for the replies! - I've just demoed the x-form audiosuite plug which seems to sound a lot better than using x-form in elastic audio...mmm.- odd. Apparently x-from IS izotope radius under license. Going to try and demo pitch and time and see how that fares. I was hoping someone like CEDAR or TC did something super high-end i was unaware of. Unfortunately vari-speeding is not an option - makes the singer sound too high pitched as it is already right at the top of his range.
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If I had to choose just one timestretch algorithm, it'd be X-form. Ideally though it's paired with something different such as Pitch and Time. X-form is generally more transparent, but when you can't escape noticeable artefacts, the slight blurring of Pitch and Time can be much more forgiving.

Like so much else, one size doesn't fit all and time stretching / shrinking stereo masters is such a rotten thing to do to audio that I like to audition at least a couple of different algorithms when doing so. Some waveforms just seems to rub certain algorithms up the wrong way. Believe it or not, I even had a situation where the original Digidesign Timestretch plug-in beat everything else I have hands down.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allstar View Post
Like so much else, one size doesn't fit all
Agree!

Sometimes also, beat sensitive methods such as Recycle or certain modes of Ableton can work out much better than a 'pure' stretch - particularly on electronic music.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 24-96 Mastering View Post
If you don't want pitch to change, the best I've heard so far is the time stretching algorithm in Wavelab 7.
WL6 is great as well.


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If there would be a consensus on GS the server would explode and a black hole would appear and suck all topics.
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27th June 2011
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I did a shootout about a year ago and was surprised to find that Waves SoundShifter won by quite a margin provided that I up-sampled from 48k to 96k for the processing. I almost hadn't included it because it's so old.
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Mr XY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
I did a shootout about a year ago and was surprised to find that Waves SoundShifter won by quite a margin provided that I up-sampled from 48k to 96k for the processing. I almost hadn't included it because it's so old.
wow - will have to check that out. Thanks for the tip Bob! I have that and didn't even think to try it...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
I did a shootout about a year ago and was surprised to find that Waves SoundShifter won by quite a margin provided that I up-sampled from 48k to 96k for the processing. I almost hadn't included it because it's so old.
That would be my vote too - I always thought it was very good.

Not heard the Wavelab 7 one though.
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I always found Prosoniq's Timefactory very usefull...
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I used Speed from Soundtoys very succesfully a few times, even on a commercial project for Sony, where I had to turn a 105 bpm song's parts to 90 & 125 bpm for downtempo and uptempo remixes. Tried Radius algos, but the results were quite awful compared to Soundtoys stretch.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbell View Post
Ableton did it first, but I'm pretty sure Pro Tools and Logic copied the same algorithms.
They are all quite different! Ableton is good for realtime stretching of solo instruments and voices, while PT is also capable of handling complex mixes. PT has several algorithm options, including X-Form based on iZotope Radius.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24-96 Mastering View Post
If you don't want pitch to change, the best I've heard so far is the time stretching algorithm in Wavelab 7.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Reierson View Post
WL6 is great as well.
Wavelab 6, 7 are based on Prosoniq DIRAC. My personal (maybe biased) opinion is that it's not as good as the latest Radius, at least not in Wavelab, - it makes all transients "chirpy". I've seen a better implementation of DIRAC in Time Factory 2.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Waltz Mastering View Post
See if you can get a demo of Pitch 'n Time Pro | Serato.com
It's pretty outdated. May be good for very soft material, but listen what it does to drums and other transients. Radius should work better in most cases.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr XY View Post
I've just demoed the x-form audiosuite plug which seems to sound a lot better than using x-form in elastic audio...mmm.- odd. Apparently x-from IS izotope radius under license.
They may be based on different versions of Radius. Elastic Audio in latest versions on PT should have the latest Radius in it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
I did a shootout about a year ago and was surprised to find that Waves SoundShifter won by quite a margin provided that I up-sampled from 48k to 96k for the processing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kosmasepsilon View Post
I used Speed from Soundtoys very succesfully a few times, even on a commercial project for Sony, where I had to turn a 105 bpm song's parts to 90 & 125 bpm for downtempo and uptempo remixes. Tried Radius algos, but the results were quite awful compared to Soundtoys stretch.
I'd appreciate if you share a sample.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexey Lukin View Post
Wavelab 6, 7 are based on Prosoniq DIRAC. My personal (maybe biased) opinion is that it's not as good as the latest Radius, at least not in Wavelab, - it makes all transients "chirpy". I've seen a better implementation of DIRAC in Time Factory 2.

I'd be interested to try it; is there a stand alone version of Radius or a Radius based algorithm?
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Robin, there's no standalone version of just Radius, but it's available in:
Adobe Audition CS5.5,
iZotope RX 2 Advanced (has a standalone demo),
Pro Tools 8 Elastic Audio (reduced set of controls).

If you use it for scaling solo instruments/voices, use Solo mode, otherwise use Mix mode. The Pitch Coherence parameter tunes the algorithm for more solo or more complex material (similarly to DIRAC's Time and frequency localization parameter).

I'd be interested to hear your opinion and failure cases!
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I always use Serato Pitch n' Time. Blows away TCE and X-Form/Elastic Audio.

I might have to try Sound Shifter for rhythmic stuff...
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Quite opposite of what I found. Would you like to post an example?
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If I have time to do a test at the studio I'll post an example between the two.
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Serato Pitch n Time and waves soundshifter are the best I've heard. I keep my tc/e tool assigned to one of them. Haven't found anything else that sounds better for what I do. X-form sounds ok but is unbelievably slow.
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Ever tried processing a drum loop or a vocal track in Serato?
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There's a Radius version for Logic too.
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Looking for an update on this topic, specifically opinions on the BEST Time Compression. I have a song that I need to speed up (track by track... not a stereo file).

Thanks!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animalcloset View Post
Looking for an update on this topic, specifically opinions on the BEST Time Compression. I have a song that I need to speed up (track by track... not a stereo file).

Thanks!
Elastic audio works 100% on individual sources with correct setting for speeding up
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