Replace bm6a for mastering

[buschfsu]

All
My track/mixing studio really needs my bm6as so I'm thinking of moving them and my krk sub from my mastering room ( treated and pretty flat) and replacing with more mastering friendly monitors. I use a duet but that will be upgraded in time. Anyway I can only spend aboout 1-1.5 k usd. Can I get a better mastering monitor or should I stay with the dynaudios. Business is picking up in both areas so I need to make a choice

[manman]

1.5 k??? why not to add another $600 and get B&W from audiogon.com

Also consider Adam P22
Sell BM6 because they have built in limiter at amplifier stage.

[buschfsu]

Thanks
Are 805s the only affordable bw choice

[manman]

I did not say 805, i meant 802s the mastering standard.

I saw them for 2200 some time ago.

Before buying monitors, go to mastering Facility where you live and listen to quality of speakers they have basically:

1. Mastering speakers have open midrange, firm highs and firm lows.
2. Most likely they will have seprate amp.
3. What matters is the built quality of the whole speakers, components.
4. Usually Mastering speakers are 3 way, but you can master on 2 way too.

[buschfsu]

Thanks

Closest would be bob Katz place and he'll have awesome monitors that will sound great and I can't afford. I'll try to find 802 s

[dietrich10]

You will need great amp to match the 802s as well. Consider that in the budget.

Moving to a 2nd hand pair of higher level Adams or Focals will make a huge upgrade from the bm6 as well

[ORC]

1.5 k wont get you anywhere near the price of a used air of 802's. You might be able to get into some 805's for that ammount. These of course will need to be powered by a good amplifier. The 805's will obliterate anything Dynaudio makes except possibly the C4's. I AM NOT A DYNAUDIO FAN! A nice pair of passive tannoys would work well too. Remember, you're not looking for a apeaker that sounds flattering, but rather one that is startlingly accurate. The 805's sound a little bit pretty on top, so you need to take this into account when mastering with them.

[buschfsu]

so i see in the 800 series there are matrix and nautilus. would the matrix series give acceptable performance for mastering?

[MASSIVE Master]

Definitely looking at the Matrix 802's in that price range.

They're good. They're not Nautilus... But they're not bad. Might want a sub and you'll still need a capable amp with a little extra juice.

I have a pair of Nautilus 802's for sale if you can triple your budget by any chance...

[Waltz Mastering]

801's

[buschfsu]

budget considerations forced me into a pair of mint Matrix 805s at $700 a pair. Ive heard others master with these (dave bazan's new album) and i believe they got good results. onto the power amp and sub. currently considering bryston 2b or 3-4b if i can afford it. any other considerations? also would it be better to use a krk $400 sub with its crossover (probly not great) or no sub at all.

btw the studio is loving the dynaudios so i made the right call i just have to work with what i have now.

[manman]

You dont understand Matrix 805s has different midrange than other 802 series.

[buschfsu]

so your saying they are worthless for monitoring because they have different midrange respone? that doesn't line up with the many references ive seen to successful mastering done using these. the impression i get is that they are very usable with a sub albiet a bit inefficient. (hence the request for a suitable power amp recommendation)

i just couldnt swing 2000+ for the 802s

[buschfsu]

Went with a bryston 3bst Hopefully I'll be ok with bass response in a small treated room otherwise I'll look for a better sub. Thanks all

[Shy]

Originally Posted by buschfsu

Business is picking up in both areas so I need to make a choice

Too late now (above post), but I'd have kept using the BM6A, because they're fantastic for mastering for the exact same reason they're fantastic for mixing - the results translate properly everywhere. If I wanted to change anything in the mentioned setup, I'd replace that KRK sub with a BM14S.

[buschfsu]

not too late as they all belong to me. ill try the 805/bryston combo for a bit and see how my masters turn out. hopefully the dyns plus good ears produce better mixes to start with

[Adler]

I use a pair of BM6As and a BM12S subwoofer fed from a custom crossover (with a gentle low pass filter starting at 120 Hz) for both mixing and mastering and the tracks always translate well across different systems. In a properly treated room these speakers are pretty damn accurate. There has been some talk about a slight exaggeration in the 1 kHz region of the BM6As, but either I have not heard it or I am already compensating for it.

I suggest buying a better subwoofer, if you have not done so already.

Chris

[Alécio Costa]

1K bump with the BM6As? Sorry.. No way...
There might be something missing around 2.5k - 4k, or a little excess around 250 and 110...

Pretty good monitors. I have mastered over 100 albums with them.

[buschfsu]

thanks, good feedback. yeah ive been using them and liked them but wanted something a little different. the bw 805 matrix speakers are so detailed, moreso than the dyns. i need a bw sub though. bryston 3b st is also amazing.

[Mark D.]

I've got a few monitoring systems I use in mastering, but for nearfields for mixing, the Dynaudio BM6a have been my choice for a few years, teamed with a customized sub, and botique cable. There's a piston-like impact to the lows on those that gives 3D quality to sound unlike other monitors. Not so much 'flattering' as you can hear into the mix. Dynamic music, especially well mixed Jazz or late-70s Steely Dan (The Royal Scam, Aja, Gaucho, Fagan's Nightfly) is incredible. But the overcompressed lower quality mixes and masters show up horribly on them, as they should. They do really help you judge what works from what doesn't.

Plus, I can lower the highs 3-4 db (about 2-3 db now) as I'm hypersensitive to highs. The result is mixes that translate. The only monitor with lows that hit as fast, and highs so good I don't need to roll them off, that I'd consider upgrading them to, if I went with another brand (vs. maybe the BM15a, now that would be a great upgrade) would be the PMC TB2S-AII. I heard those at AES and they set the bar higher for 3D detail and fatigue-free sound like nobody else. Different price range of course. But you may even prefer them to the B&Ws you've considered. These are upgraded speakers with new audiophile amps driving them.

[aleatoric]

I was just looking at the specs for those BW 805 matrix speakers out of curiosity.

"Frequency response: 35Hz-22kHz ±6dB"

Wow, that is pretty horrible. I know specs only say so much but if they are really rated at that I see no way these could be considered a neutral or accurate enough speaker for mastering (or even mixing for that matter). I am sure they sound great and all but ±6dB is a very skewed response for audio production applications.

FWIW I use to use Dynaudio BM6'a MK1's. They are OK but to my ears always lacked some detail and have a bit of a low end bump. I have since upgraded to the Focal Solo 6 Be's, I find them incredibly neutral, accurate and detailed. They tell me everything I need to know about the music and translation is excellent.

[manman]

get Adam ANf10 they are very high quality speakers

[Ben F]

The BM6as are an excellent monitor, but I find the 150-250Hz region on them to be the weak spot. Hard to get right. I have a few clients that use them, as well as having them as a second set to reference in the studio, and invariably I'm cutting the low mids or subs when listening on the ATC SCM50s for mastering.

[Kayo]

Originally Posted by manman

get Adam ANf10 they are very high quality speakers

Big fan of ADAM’s on the whole. The ribbon really does make a bravura difference, but, using ADAM ANF10, as mastering speakers would not be my first choice, unless, I had to work within some sort of constraint or restrain of sorts etc..

KAyo

[manman]

Another suggestions is PMC TB2 with Metal tweeter, not soft dome.

Put them like 1.5 meter away, because lots of people use it as nearfiled, i think PMC sound great from little far so you can hear bass better.

[Adler]

Regarding the low end response of the BM6As, these speakers definitely translate more accuarately when used in conjunction with a powerful subwoofer. In addition to the benefit of low frequency response extension, using a subwoofer also allows you to monitor at louder volumes with less risk of triggering the built in limiting protection circuit on the BM6As.

Chris

[Shy]

Originally Posted by Adler

In addition to the benefit of low frequency response extension, using a subwoofer also allows you to monitor at louder volumes with less risk of triggering the built in limiting protection circuit on the BM6As.

This is completely false. Only the high frequency amplifier in the BM6A has an optical limiter, which protects from excessive continuous power (and not from transients).

[Adler]

Originally Posted by Shy

This is completely false. Only the high frequency amplifier in the BM6A has an optical limiter, which protects from excessive continuous power (and not from transients).

Sorry, my bad. I was misinformed.

Chris