How Can i make the chorus/hook on a beat stand out ? (Production Wise)
TychoStar
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#1
15th June 2010
Old 15th June 2010
  #1
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Thread Starter
How Can i make the chorus/hook on a beat stand out ? (Production Wise)

I been having trouble with developing chorus for beat i make and is there any advice?

Can a good mix & mastering help me get my chorus/hook sounding like an actual Chorus/hook.


By the way i do pop records like max martin & Dr. Luke.
RTR
#2
15th June 2010
Old 15th June 2010
  #2
RTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TychoStar View Post
I been having trouble with developing chorus for beat i make and is there any advice?

Can a good mix & mastering help me get my chorus/hook sounding like an actual Chorus/hook.


By the way i do pop records like max martin & Dr. Luke.
NO......your chores should stand out even if the mix is bad...it should stand out if you are just singing the song with an acoustic guitar.
Red Mastering
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#3
15th June 2010
Old 15th June 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RTR View Post
NO......your chores should stand out even if the mix is bad...it should stand out if you are just singing the song with an acoustic guitar.
yes and no....
actually I do it quite often, to edit verses/choruses to give chorus impact
of course it should exist in first place (production/mix),
but during mastering it's quite simple trick to cut verse 0.5dB-1dB down just before chorus to give it more impact,
some delicate automation on EQ to give more oomph (example) during chorus
but it all depends on song,
different approach to different song
#4
15th June 2010
Old 15th June 2010
  #4
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Yeah, if they don't stand out on their own, forcing them to can sound unatural.

It's worth trying if you think it's important, but usually doesn't work out so well.
Red Mastering
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#5
15th June 2010
Old 15th June 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TychoStar View Post
I been having trouble with developing chorus for beat i make and is there any advice?

Can a good mix & mastering help me get my chorus/hook sounding like an actual Chorus/hook.


By the way i do pop records like max martin & Dr. Luke.
as mixing production advice, best idea is to have a bridge before chorus, when you can make 'drop' or sth else, just to give chorus more 'weight'

adding extra hihat, or/and another clap/rim/snare on top could do as well
hihat's playing 16th notes instead of 8th....
there are plenty options,

generally chorus needs 'more' attitude comparing to verse,
but then it depends on song
#6
16th June 2010
Old 16th June 2010
  #6
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CJ Mastering's Avatar
 

Quote:
Can a good mix & mastering help me get my chorus/hook sounding like an actual Chorus/hook.

Your final mastered audio reflects your mix. A bad mix will result in a bad master.
You need to get these sorta things right in the mixing stage. The mastering stage is not the place for making your hooks sound good.
Cj
TychoStar
Thread Starter
#7
16th June 2010
Old 16th June 2010
  #7
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Thread Starter
Thanks for all the help. I really appreciate it guys.

The reason why i asked is the songs i hear in todays pop/dance music. its seems there not a lot going on in the hook but they sound awesome. lol
Catchy lyrics does help out a lot i guess.
#8
16th June 2010
Old 16th June 2010
  #8
Gear nut
 

Couple of tips..

Automate your stereo bus, Rick Rubin does this.

Have you set up a drum bus?
Are you using parallel compression?
If so you could try a little more PC on the chorus.

Vocals wise, have a different effect / eq on the chorus to the rest of the track.
Adam Dempsey
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#9
16th June 2010
Old 16th June 2010
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ Mastering View Post
Your final mastered audio reflects your mix. A bad mix will result in a bad master.
You need to get these sorta things right in the mixing stage. The mastering stage is not the place for making your hooks sound good.
thumbsup Although I'd go further and perhaps look to the arrangement stage.
Then, later, having options in mixing generally pays off, eg stripping the mix back a tad for verses if needed, rather than always adding things elsewhere. Whatever it takes. But strive to break the mold, not make it into "the" mold.
Table Of Tone
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#10
17th June 2010
Old 17th June 2010
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tresperros View Post
yes and no....
actually I do it quite often, to edit verses/choruses to give chorus impact
of course it should exist in first place (production/mix),
but during mastering it's quite simple trick to cut verse 0.5dB-1dB down just before chorus to give it more impact,
some delicate automation on EQ to give more oomph (example) during chorus
but it all depends on song,
different approach to different song
If a chorus doesn't build enough from the mix alone, I'll ride it by hand, in the analogue domain.
#11
17th June 2010
Old 17th June 2010
  #11
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I wouldn't try to mix a chorus to stand out. You can nudge it in a mix, but it really needs to stand out compositionally (not a real word) first. Instead of turning up the volume, try introducing a new instrument into the chorus, or removing one from the preceding verse. A new sound will usually do a good job at perking up one's ear. Give yourself somewhere to go before you actually get there, if you know what I mean.
Table Of Tone
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#12
17th June 2010
Old 17th June 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Sound View Post
I wouldn't try to mix a chorus to stand out. You can nudge it in a mix, but it really needs to stand out compositionally (not a real word) first. Instead of turning up the volume, try introducing a new instrument into the chorus, or removing one from the preceding verse. A new sound will usually do a good job at perking up one's ear. Give yourself somewhere to go before you actually get there, if you know what I mean.
In an ideal world, the chorus would be musically exciting or uplifting.

Sometimes that's not the case though!
#13
23rd June 2010
Old 23rd June 2010
  #13
Gear addict
 

Is volume and EQ automation really used on the master track? It's a very different approach. I may have to give it a try..
Ged
#14
24th June 2010
Old 24th June 2010
  #14
Ged
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Table Of Tone View Post
In an ideal world, the chorus would be musically exciting or uplifting.

Sometimes that's not the case though!
eh sooo true!
#15
26th June 2010
Old 26th June 2010
  #15
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Ruud Unit's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Sound View Post
I wouldn't try to mix a chorus to stand out. You can nudge it in a mix, but it really needs to stand out compositionally (not a real word) first. Instead of turning up the volume, try introducing a new instrument into the chorus, or removing one from the preceding verse. A new sound will usually do a good job at perking up one's ear. Give yourself somewhere to go before you actually get there, if you know what I mean.
compositionally is a real word and you used it correctly.
#16
7th December 2010
Old 7th December 2010
  #16
Arrangement, arrangement, arrangement.

Nothing is ever fixed in mixing or mastering. Writing and arranging does it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TychoStar View Post
I been having trouble with developing chorus for beat i make and is there any advice?

Can a good mix & mastering help me get my chorus/hook sounding like an actual Chorus/hook.


By the way i do pop records like max martin & Dr. Luke.
#17
8th December 2010
Old 8th December 2010
  #17
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by breakbeat-cafe View Post
Are you using parallel compression?
If so you could try a little more PC on the chorus.
thumbsup One of my favourites. Automated PC on the choruses - slow attack/mid-fast release. Gets it hyped and bangin', good and proper.

SK
#18
9th December 2010
Old 9th December 2010
  #18
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CJ1973's Avatar
 

Join a band and learn how dynamics work in music. If you don't play an instrument, then don't waste your time. To depend on mixing and mastering for a great song is rediculous. Write the song well. THen see how the dynamics work for the song. That alone would make the chorus stand out. Then once you have a fantastic song delivered well, perhaps take some of the above ideas given and enhance what you have.
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