mastering at home studio

[cmike9783]

Hello everyone.

I have a mac pro tower, yamaha xs8 and the rest plugins. (east west, omnisphere) I'm wondering what else I need to have my music sounding crisp. It seems these plugins are already very clear sounding.

For my reverb (for vocals and plugins) I am going to get bricasti.


Correct me if I'm wrong. I still need something that can give punch and crispness to my music?

Would something like Tube-Tech SMC 2BM be good to use?

I also was thinking of getting a sound card -- the apogee duet to be exact. I have the most expensive mac tower. Does the mac tower already have a good enough sound card? or should I still go with the duet?

If I get these 2 or 3 products would this be enough to have my music finalized and ready to CD ?

Thanks Everyone for your input!
Cmike

[fourvector]

Have you got accurate, full range monitor speakers? Not much point trying to do 'mastering' at home if you don't.

[Darwin James]

Haha.

Don't waste your time. Hire a professional.

[ONDRAY]

Originally Posted by fourvector

Have you got accurate, full range monitor speakers? Not much point trying to do 'mastering' at home if you don't.

Untill you have $10k saved up for proper mastering monitors and amps, plus the room to support them, I think proper commercially released music can be mastered on none 3-way full range montitors. A name that comes to mind is David Kutch's setup.. I strongly beleive that if your room is WELL treated and YOU KNOW your speakers and room, you can turn out great masters... regardless of the tools you use. If you hear it, you can change it.

P.S. that doesn't go with out say, that the moment I get a larger room, I will be getting some nice big ass full range monitors. I've been in large commercial mastering studio with the BOMB monitor setups and it DOES make the decision translate allot easier. But if you know how your room translates in the outside world

[fourvector]

That's the thing though...A lot of the more affordable monitors may only go down to 50hz or so. If there are any problems at 25hz, you're likely to miss them.

[Ben F]

I'll answer your post for you. As others have said, room and monitoring are no 1.

To use external hardware you will need more outputs than the duet offers, as the signal has to run to the gear then back again to be recorded. You could have 1 input but you require 2 outputs (1 for the signal to the gear and 1 for monitoring).

Logic Pro and waveburner would be fine for mastering.

The tube tech is very good but for stereo mixes I'd be more inclined to go with the CL 2A. You only really require multiband for fixing problem mixes, or for creative compression which works for some styles of music.

[mdoelger]

Have yozu got the ears? Have you got the room? Have you got the ****ing equipment?

THINK...and go to a professional!

EDIT: Forget about gear and room! HAVE YOU GOT THE EARS?

[bass man]

Originally Posted by Darwin James

Haha.

Don't waste your time. Hire a professional.

Gee what an attitude . Then we all should stop doing what we do and hire the professional to **** our wives too ,is that what you are saying ?

[Darwin James]

Originally Posted by bass man

Gee what an attitude . Then we all should stop doing what we do and hire the professional to **** our wives too ,is that what you are saying ?

If you have problems pleasing your wife, that is your "problem". Hire a doctor or seek medication for that.

The OP clearly doesnt know how to master. Which is just fine. If he did he wouldn't ask the questions he did or bring up the things he did. Nothing wrong with not knowing how to master.

If he is referring to preparing for distribution of his music when saying "ready to CD" he should just hire a pro. Otherwise he will waste a lot of time and money and then say, "I should have hired a pro, why didn't someone tell me" down the line. If he is releasing CDR's to friends, family, self, then sure do it yourself and don't even bother with the things he is thinking of buying. If he is wanting to learn how to master, that's different.

If more people hired professionals to do work for them, then the industry would be able to sustain and the end product would be better off. That is what I am saying. If he can afford a Bricasti, which has absolutely nothing to do with mastering, he can afford to hire someone.

What the OP should focus on is getting the "punch and crispness" he desires in the mix phase.

[WAVERUNNER]

If anyone needs their wife done by a master, I am only $!OO an hour.

[bass man]

Originally Posted by WAVERUNNER

If anyone needs their wife done by a master, I am only $!OO an hour.

Is your room good treated ?

[Joe_caithness]

Originally Posted by bass man

Is your room good treated ?

wipe down surfaces?

[Table Of Tone]

Originally Posted by bass man

Gee what an attitude . Then we all should stop doing what we do and hire the professional to **** our wives too ,is that what you are saying ?

One really valid reason for hiring a professional and not trying to master your own stuff, is that you are already too close to it!

I think that Darwin has the RIGHT attitude and is making a good point by saying that you would have to spend a lot of money and gain years of experience to be able to do it justice!

He's just had his album mastered by a professional and it sounds to me like he's happy with that decision!

[bass man]

Originally Posted by Table Of Tone

One really valid reason for hiring a professional and not trying to master your own stuff, is that you are already too close to it!

I think that Darwin has the RIGHT attitude and is making a good point by saying that you would have to spend a lot of money and gain years of experience to be able to do it justice!

He's just had his album mastered by a professional and it sounds to me like he's happy with that decision!

Sending your mix to a great ME is a clear subject and always the best thing to do after you spent weeks tracking and mixing your album -that's clear .
Experimenting with mastering is a great thing to do too and very creative work , so why not experimenting - that's the great way to learn things .
We are blessed to have all this great ME`s here to help us get better in what we do and this board when its on the educational side of the moon is one of the greatest thing on web ,especially for young people .
Unfortunately this board and especially Mastering Forum ,with few exceptions, became more and more a place for advertising - so "Don't do it at home by yourself let the Pro do it for you" is not always stated with best intentions if you know what i mean.
Every time somebody ask for help here it is impossible to get straight help without " forget it dude hire me ill do it for you " kind of attitude and it sucks .
Cheers

[macc]

Originally Posted by Joe_caithness

wipe down surfaces?

Proper LOL

[Tarekith]

My thoughts on how to master your own work:

..:: Mastering ::..

Sending it to a pro is best of course, but not everyone can or will, so hopefully this helps some.

[Joe_caithness]

Originally Posted by macc

Proper LOL

no really, it really knocks out that 2hz problem

[silverking]

Seriously though, get me.........seriously, get me mon?

Phat beats at home with screaming high end crispness..........seriously though, get me blood?

Get me mon, seriously, get me?

[cmike9783]

ok i agree, hire a professional. I just thought that since my plugins were high quality sounding (along with duet sound card) maybe I could get by with mastering at home.

But I will hire a professional to master.


But to make music and just record at home, i will use these products.

great plug ins

Mac pro tower

apogee duet

bricasti reverb

some sort of processor

logic

yamaha keyboard.

good speaks speakers

I guess my main question is , am I missing any other "square box" pieces of equipement (i.e apogee duet, bricasti reverb, and a music compressor) to make good music at home???

[Darwin James]

Originally Posted by cmike9783

ok i agree, hire a professional. I just thought that since my plugins were high quality sounding (along with duet sound card) maybe I could get by with mastering at home.

But I will hire a professional to master.


But to make music and just record at home, i will use these products.

great plug ins

Mac pro tower

apogee duet

bricasti reverb

some sort of processor

logic

yamaha keyboard.

good speaks speakers

I guess my main question is , am I missing any other "square box" pieces of equipement (i.e apogee duet, bricasti reverb, and a music compressor) to make good music at home???

I'm concerned about how you would use the outboard reverb and compressor with that setup? The Duet is a great choice of gear, but as Ben F stated it cannot be used with external gear in that method.

For your purposes, I would recommend staying in the box 100%, and look into Altiverb by Audio Ease for reverb, and consider the API/SSL plugs from Waves for compression. Then put the money saved into a better pre-amp and mic, and of course, room treatment. Or consider a different interface from the Duet and then consider outboard pieces if that is your interest. Just a suggestion.

[RTR]

Originally Posted by cmike9783

ok i agree, hire a professional. I just thought that since my plugins were high quality sounding (along with duet sound card) maybe I could get by with mastering at home.

But I will hire a professional to master.


But to make music and just record at home, i will use these products.

great plug ins

Mac pro tower

apogee duet

bricasti reverb

some sort of processor

logic

yamaha keyboard.

good speaks speakers

I guess my main question is , am I missing any other "square box" pieces of equipement (i.e apogee duet, bricasti reverb, and a music compressor) to make good music at home???

Everyone has to learn...the people telling you to "Hire a Professional" Obviously had to learn to....if every one thought that way there would be no professionals to hire, they all would be looking for someone that don't exist instead of learning!!
On the other hand..if you are trying to release something right away without taking the time to learn..then YES..you should hire a professional!!

[Table Of Tone]

Originally Posted by bass man

Sending your mix to a great ME is a clear subject and always the best thing to do after you spent weeks tracking and mixing your album -that's clear .
Experimenting with mastering is a great thing to do too and very creative work , so why not experimenting - that's the great way to learn things .
We are blessed to have all this great ME`s here to help us get better in what we do and this board when its on the educational side of the moon is one of the greatest thing on web ,especially for young people .
Unfortunately this board and especially Mastering Forum ,with few exceptions, became more and more a place for advertising - so "Don't do it at home by yourself let the Pro do it for you" is not always stated with best intentions if you know what i mean.
Every time somebody ask for help here it is impossible to get straight help without " forget it dude hire me ill do it for you " kind of attitude and it sucks .
Cheers

The thing is, there is no straight answer for most of the questions posted by people trying to learn how to master on this or probably any other mastering forum.

Most of the answers you will get however, will probably be saving you time and money and possibly warning you off buying tons of the latest, wrong plugins that we know for sure, won't get you where you wanna be!

I think that most of the pro guy's (and girls) that post here are extremely helpful and an absolute world of knowledge.

I have no shame in admitting I've learn't a hell of a lot about what stuff does and how it's best used, from these guys so I'll say "Cheers" and raise a glass to em!

I personally feel that there is very little of the "Hire me, I'll do it" attitude up here!

[bob katz]

Should I put salt or pepper on my scrambled eggs? Please tell me, I want to know!

[Table Of Tone]

Originally Posted by bob katz

Should I put salt or pepper on my scrambled eggs? Please tell me, I want to know!

A little pepper, but only if you like it?
Not too much salt though, it's not good for ya!
Maybe some chilli?

[bass man]

Originally Posted by bob katz

Should I put salt or pepper on my scrambled eggs? Please tell me, I want to know!

Hi Bob

Nice that you are here too !

You are exactly that kind of person we should be proud to have privilege to meet here on the web .
Bob is always here to help with the rightest answers and i really appreciate his attitude . Thanks Bob!!!
Salt or pepper - i don't know its a matter of taste but for sure not " **** the scrambled eggs and go to professional" ....
My moto is : "Do your best and then go to professional"

[bob katz]

Originally Posted by bass man

Hi Bob

Nice that you are here too !

You are exactly that kind of person we should be proud to have privilege to meet here on the web .
Bob is always here to help with the rightest answers and i really appreciate his attitude . Thanks Bob!!!
Salt or pepper - i don't know its a matter of taste but for sure not " **** the scrambled eggs and go to professional" ....
My moto is : "Do your best and then go to professional"

Thanks bass man. It IS possible to master yourself at home, but as others have pointed out, you lose valuable perspective, and you also lose the experienced advice of a professional. Over time you can learn how to master. Reportedly George Massenburg has been doing some of his own mastering when the budget doesn't allow him to go to his favorite mastering engineer. But George has been participating in mastering sessions for years (20-30 of them!); he knows whether he wants salt or pepper, how to choose the right salt and pepper and at least how to stay out of trouble!

[bass man]

Originally Posted by bob katz

Thanks bass man. It IS possible to master yourself at home, but as others have pointed out, you lose valuable perspective, and you also lose the experienced advice of a professional. Over time you can learn how to master. Reportedly George Massenburg has been doing some of his own mastering when the budget doesn't allow him to go to his favorite mastering engineer. But George has been participating in mastering sessions for years (20-30 of them!); he knows whether he wants salt or pepper, how to choose the right salt and pepper and at least how to stay out of trouble!

I totally agree with you Bob .
I am saying that if somebody wants to learn something, get some skills and became a master of what he does , that this guy needs to start somewhere, don't you think so ? I am sure your first album Bob wasn't the best one you ever did , or maybe i am wrong but hopefully you get my point.
I like to learn about mastering like the OP and we all have questions we need to ask and get some answers to at least be able to understand better what is mastering and to hear the difference between good and not so good Master etc ....
But Bob trust me , every time somebody ask a question on this forum even if it is about re sampling or fade out on the end of the song question, there is a guy " Mastering Online for 0,99$ per song " web site owner who's going to say "Don't even try to do it, send it to Pro"
Sorry Bob but i don't really care about this guys and their posts .

Cheers

[bob katz]

Originally Posted by bass man

I totally agree with you Bob .

snip

But Bob trust me , every time somebody ask a question on this forum even if it is about re sampling or fade out on the end of the song question, there is a guy " Mastering Online for 0,99$ per song " web site owner who's going to say "Don't even try to do it, send it to Pro"
Sorry Bob but i don't really care about this guys and their posts .

Cheers

It's only the insecure people who somehow feel their job threatened that protest or won't give advice. Fortunately there are a number of comfortable (or at least not insecure!) mastering engineers participating in this forum who will give you help and advice. But I think it should be an FAQ that mastering is an art learned through long experience, musical and technical ability and that it's a small cost to go to a specialist to ensure that your music will be heard as best as possible. Nevertheless, we all encourage you to experiment, learn, try it yourself as well. I have a running "game" with one of my clients to see if he can produce mixes which don't need any audio mastering at all. He's a pretty remarkable mix engineer and many of his mixes have been so good that I could not find a thing to do to improve the sound. So sometimes all I have to do is assemble, check relative levels between tunes, and create the master!

[bass man]

Originally Posted by bob katz

It's only the insecure people who somehow feel their job threatened that protest or won't give advice. Fortunately there are a number of comfortable (or at least not insecure!) mastering engineers participating in this forum who will give you help and advice. But I think it should be an FAQ that mastering is an art learned through long experience, musical and technical ability and that it's a small cost to go to a specialist to ensure that your music will be heard as best as possible. Nevertheless, we all encourage you to experiment, learn, try it yourself as well. I have a running "game" with one of my clients to see if he can produce mixes which don't need any audio mastering at all. He's a pretty remarkable mix engineer and many of his mixes have been so good that I could not find a thing to do to improve the sound. So sometimes all I have to do is assemble, check relative levels between tunes, and create the master!

Bob , its always pleasure to read your posts . The amount of enthusiasm and positive energy in your posts is just incredible .
Respect

[fourvector]

I was just pleased to discover that Bob posts here. Last year by chance I picked up the "the art and the science" book at a library (I guess it looked interesting), and learned a huge amount reading it. So it's great to read these further pearls of wisdom on various topics.