Recorder for DSD with 5.6 MHz

[Adebar]

Is there a recorder with SDIF input that supports DSD 5.6 MHz?

We have the Meitner converters and think a AD-DA conversion with DSD 5.6 sounds slightly better than AD-DA with DSD 2.8.

Is there a recorder that supports 5.6 MHz?

The Tascam only makes 2.8 and the Korg MR-1000 has no DSD input for 5.6.
At the Genex webpage i couldn´t find info if 5.6 is possible.

[Cellotron]

The Korg MR2000S can record DSD at 5.6MHz - Korg - Product Details

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[reynaud]

the Korg only has an SPDIF input which goes up to 192k PCM. the Korg units don't seem to be targeted at people with DSD converters.

cheers,
Reynaud

[Adebar]

Originally Posted by Cellotron

The Korg MR2000S can record DSD at 5.6MHz

Thanks Steve, but I´d like to use the Meitner als external converter.

What about Genex Series 9000? Didn´t find SDIF inputs in the specifications.

[zenmastering]

The Genex 9000 does not support 128fs DSD. Things may have changed with Genex building the new DSD-recording gear for LiveNation but I haven't anything about 128fs.

Merging Technologies (Pyramix) have considered adding this feature, but it's pretty low on their priority list. Otherwise, you could always find someone to hack the Korg recorder for you ;->


Graemme

Originally Posted by Adebar

Thanks Steve, but I´d like to use the Meitner als external converter.

What about Genex Series 9000? Didn´t find SDIF inputs in the specifications.

[Adebar]

Thanks for the replies. Seems there is really no way to record 128 FS DSD.

Strange situation, isn´t it? There are converters for it but no chance to store the data.

Wonder why Korg or Tascam don´t see it.

[wado1942]

Well, they have other issues with their recorders that are much more important that bumping up the sample rate, like headroom. TASCAM's highest end DSD recorder barely cuts it in the headroom department and none of Korg's portable units even come close. If they won't spend an extra $3 on some proper opamps, why would they spend a bunch of RND $ for a format nobody can interface to anything else?

[Adebar]

Originally Posted by wado1942

Well, they have other issues with their recorders that are much more important that bumping up the sample rate, like headroom.

Can you tell more about this headroom issue?

Thanks.

[bcgood]

Originally Posted by wado1942

Well, they have other issues with their recorders that are much more important that bumping up the sample rate, like headroom. TASCAM's highest end DSD recorder barely cuts it in the headroom department and none of Korg's portable units even come close. If they won't spend an extra $3 on some proper opamps, why would they spend a bunch of RND $ for a format nobody can interface to anything else?

Have you had a Korg MR2000S in your studio to test?

[Lucas_G]

Originally Posted by zenmastering

Merging Technologies (Pyramix) have considered adding this feature, but it's pretty low on their priority list.
Graemme

It is very strange indeed, because it is not only about better sound quality (5.6 does sound a bit better) but it would give DSD the edge since all those problems about each delta sigma processing creating artefacts would vanish.

With 2.8 MHz the high frequency polution builds up in the 30 to 60 kHz region, but with 5.6 MHz it would all shift into the 60 to 120 kHz region; well out of our way!

Repeated DSD processing would become really harmless...

Why is nobody paying attention to this? We would finally work with the perfect DSD format, and harddrives become larger and cheaper... No excuse there!

I think Merging should go public with this, include it into their Pyramix DAW and convince the manufacture that it is time to implement it in their hardware.

[Lucas_G]

Originally Posted by bcgood

Have you had a Korg MR2000S in your studio to test?

Some who tested both think that the MR 1000 sounds a bit better than the MR2000S, but it lacks any digital I/O other than the USB connection.

I own a MR1000 and I really like its sound, except for the mic preamps which sound rather cheap. On line level however, you get an excellent recorder.

[Petrus]

Originally Posted by Lucas_G

Repeated DSD processing would become really harmless...

Why is nobody paying attention to this? We would finally work with the perfect DSD format, and harddrives become larger and cheaper...

How do you work with DSD as it can not be edited?

[Lucas_G]

Originally Posted by Petrus

How do you work with DSD as it can not be edited?

Well ,there are a few DAW's that can edit DSD, among them Pyramix.
However Pyramix is not yet 5.6 mHz capable...

[acorneau]

Originally Posted by Lucas_G

Well ,there are a few DAW's that can edit DSD, among them Pyramix.

Pyramix uses DXD (32-bit, 352.6kHz) for editing/processing, not true DSD.

From the Pyramix website:

Pyramix is the first system with enough processing power and resolution to handle in real time a complete digital mixing console capable of operating in 32 bit floating point at 352.8 kHz, which is the minimum requirement to preserve all the intrinsic original quality of 1 bit 2.8MHz DSD signals.

[zenmastering]

In Pyramix, there is also an 'in-between' mode that allows you to do edits and only the crossfades in those edits will be converted to DXD. The rest of the audio is copied from the source files used in the particular edit while rendering them to a file in non-real-time.

This mode is occasionally very useful for SA-CD productions where you might just be assembling performances without the need for further processing.

True DSD editing is possible (according to the engineers I spoke with at Philips) but isn't implemented in any commercially available DAW.

Graemme

Originally Posted by acorneau

Pyramix uses DXD (32-bit, 352.6kHz) for editing/processing, not true DSD.

From the Pyramix website:

[mr.farkendorfer]

how does just regular dxd sound? anybody use it?

[Lucas_G]

Originally Posted by zenmastering

In Pyramix, there is also an 'in-between' mode that allows you to do edits and only the crossfades in those edits will be converted to DXD. The rest of the audio is copied from the source files used in the particular edit while rendering them to a file in non-real-time.

This mode is occasionally very useful for SA-CD productions where you might just be assembling performances without the need for further processing.

True DSD editing is possible (according to the engineers I spoke with at Philips) but isn't implemented in any commercially available DAW.

Graemme

Channel Classics for instance works in this mode. They just do the editing of takes in this mode, so the rest of the file stays within DSD format all the time.

Jared is one of the few who makes his mixes at the time of the recording sessions and then stays purely in DSD. His recordings usually sound very good.

When recording in 5.6 Mhz each DSD to PCM conversion and vice versa would not add any siginificant problems with high frequency polution.

[Lucas_G]

Originally Posted by mr.farkendorfer

how does just regular dxd sound? anybody use it?

I have never been above 196 kHz since my Prism converter is limited to that.

However, I do not think that going higher does make an audible influence when recording, but as a means for handling DSD the higher sampling rate does not hurt. Is is a way to make sure that not much sound quality is lost within those very short moments of connecting takes in a crossover fade.