Title Fight Drawmer S3 or Tube Tech SMC 2B

[roc]

What's up guys, these 2 Optos have to duke it out , what do you think, please stay on topic.
here we go
(WIth ring annoucer voice)
Welcome, to the Multi band Opto Tube title fight

In the blue corner we have THE Tube Tech SMC 2B
and
In the Red corner we have The Drawmer S3

What would you get 1st Drawmer S3 or Tube Tech SMC 2B.

please tell why and your experience if any

BTW I do mostly Dance Electronica, Techno,Deep House, Jazz.

Good Luck

[Riccardo]

Out of curiosity as we are talking strictly about a mastering application (as opposed to mixing) do you get more Dance Electronica, Techno,Deep House, Jazz jobs than other types of music?

[roc]

Originally Posted by Riccardo

Out of curiosity as we are talking strictly about a mastering application (as opposed to mixing) do you get more Dance Electronica, Techno,Deep House, Jazz jobs than other types of music?

Yes with lots of bass, hi hats, rhodes and vocals. Would love to do more rock stuff but that time has not come yet.
Thanks

[William Bowden]

Well the S3 I got for a review in Audio Tech mag was a dog, couldn't get it to null, HF was elevated, pots fiddly. I wanted to do a shootout too, but couldn't get past the lack of calibration. I heard later that they'd had a bad batch of pots, but that didn't leave me confident about their quality control. It was nicely laid out, looked good, had bypass on each band, so it ticked a lot of boxes in a way and the sound of the amps was quite pleasing, but it was so far out of whack, ABs didn't work because for eg the top band boosted the highs about 1.5 db, so you had to change the gain back down each time you put it in circuit - hopeless.

I hope they've fixed it since then, all the pots were continuously variable though, so I think a 2BM would be the safest bet so far.

But who knows, a stepped S3 properly working could be awesome!

The King

[Ben F]

I had a dog of a tube-tech multi band for a demo once. Similar problems- not calibrated, excessive HF lift, poor stereo balance. It didn't sound like the tube-tech I used to use at 301.

I'd be more interested in hearing the Maselec multi band against the tube-tech. I like the idea of having a 3 band compressor that can also act as a single band, or just a 2 band which would be perfect for most applications. For now, the Weiss DS-1 with the selectable frequency compression ticks most boxes followed by analogue broadband compression. I do tend to prefer more precise multi band compression such as what the Weiss offers, because it's generally just used to tame a frequency that is popping it's head out and EQ will not tame it without detriment to the music.

[roc]

Originally Posted by William Bowden

Well the S3 I got for a review in Audio Tech mag was a dog, couldn't get it to null, HF was elevated, pots fiddly. I wanted to do a shootout too, but couldn't get past the lack of calibration. I heard later that they'd had a bad batch of pots, but that didn't leave me confident about their quality control. It was nicely laid out, looked good, had bypass on each band, so it ticked a lot of boxes in a way and the sound of the amps was quite pleasing, but it was so far out of whack, ABs didn't work because for eg the top band boosted the highs about 1.5 db, so you had to change the gain back down each time you put it in circuit - hopeless.

I hope they've fixed it since then, all the pots were continuously variable though, so I think a 2BM would be the safest bet so far.

But who knows, a stepped S3 properly working could be awesome!

The King

How long ago was that ?
Sounds like the demo units for both where out of wack.

[turtlerock]

Originally Posted by roc

How long ago was that ?
Sounds like the demo units for both where out of wack.

i concour.. it seems everybody sends all the out of whack stuff down under and uses it as demo stock for us to try out .

i thought you guys were on drugs when i tried out the tubetech ...
is this what you all thought is so great ...?
months later i hear back from the wholesaler he has a better one i can try out ... which i didnt so i am no help on this thread.. :(
but ben what do you think of the weiss dyn eq for multiband tricks ?
i seem to have turned into quite the weiss fan

[Ben F]

Originally Posted by turtlerock

i thought you guys were on drugs when i tried out the tubetech ...
is this what you all thought is so great ...?
months later i hear back from the wholesaler he has a better one i can try out ... which i didnt so i am no help on this thread.. :(
but ben what do you think of the weiss dyn eq for multiband tricks ?
i seem to have turned into quite the weiss fan

You probably had the same demo tube-tech. Last I heard the Christians used it to master their latest release, I had to pick it up from them. Maybe it became possessed.

I'd really like to try the weiss dyn eq but we don't have that card unfortunately.

[turtlerock]

Originally Posted by Ben F

You probably had the same demo tube-tech. Last I heard the Christians used it to master their latest release, I had to pick it up from them. Maybe it became possessed.

I'd really like to try the weiss dyn eq but we don't have that card unfortunately.

you know 301 are currently selling all their tubetechs and neve mastering limiters?
weird .

Daniel Weiss is coming to sydney to launch some new stuff we are involved with at the trade show in a few weeks , make sure you come along it will blow you mind .

[Ben F]

Originally Posted by turtlerock

you know 301 are currently selling all their tubetechs and neve mastering limiters?
weird .

Daniel Weiss is coming to sydney to launch some new stuff we are involved with at the trade show in a few weeks , make sure you come along it will blow you mind .

Interesting. Those tube-techs were modified with an external 240v power supply and 'bypass' switch on each band. Would be a good buy depending on the price.

If you could send me a PM before the trade show I would like to come along.

[turtlerock]

Originally Posted by Ben F

Interesting. Those tube-techs were modified with an external 240v power supply and 'bypass' switch on each band. Would be a good buy depending on the price.

.

yeah , the email from 301 i got was for a bunch of mastering stuff and definately along the lines of "we are open to all offers "
it seems times are tough in the land of plenty

[inlinenl]

Originally Posted by turtlerock

i seem to have turned into quite the weiss fan

Hi Turtlerock, could you describe what made you turn into a weiss fan, where does is shine/work out the best for you ....

Still digging deep into the DS1 ... awesome unit ... where limiting mode and the delay time can gentle control the high's , or running in parallel mode with a ratio of 10:1 .. almost parallel limiting .. well I backed it off to 3.33:1 ... tutt

cheers Wim

to the OP ... tubetech .. handsdown ... well it's like one casey stoner riding a ducati , or getting a guy from texas to try the same .... p.s you can even put an italian on a japanese bike ... you'll see it's the driver not the car ...

[Ben F]

Originally Posted by turtlerock

yeah , the email from 301 i got was for a bunch of mastering stuff and definately along the lines of "we are open to all offers "
it seems times are tough in the land of plenty

They are buying 2 Maselec multi bands and selling the Tube-techs to fund the purchase. So...perhaps the Maselec is a contender.

[pmx]

the maselec isn't listed one the prism website anymore. it's not a new unit right or at its end of life, right?

[Waltz Mastering]

Originally Posted by pmx

the maselec isn't listed one the prism website anymore. it's not a new unit right or at its end of life, right?

I think it's relatively new, maybe over a year or 2. It's at the maselec site.

[dave-G]

Here's the Maselec: MLA-3

FWIW, even though I've heard good things about that Maselec, it's hard to get terribly excited about any multiband compressor. I seldom like the sound of it, and my eyeroll is overworked by the sadly widespread misconception that MB compression is mastering.

-dave

[roc]

Originally Posted by dave-G

Here's the Maselec: MLA-3

FWIW, even though I've heard good things about that Maselec, it's hard to get terribly excited about any multiband compressor. I seldom like the sound of it, and my eyeroll is overworked by the sadly widespread misconception that MB compression is mastering.

-dave

In the Dance world Multi-band compression is gold for mastering the bass and keeping
the highs nice and sparkly. Bass can sometime be a wild beast that need to be tamed for the NYC Dance Clubs. I agree that most of the work should be done in the mix stage.

I really wish we could hear from someone who has worked with a good working Drawmer S3. I do know that the S3 has 10 tubes (transformer) and each band has a bypass.The tube tech does not have bypass on each band but this may or may not be a major issue.

[RobAcid]

i have the S3 here, and i am happy...

its the first multiband comp that i like to use, i never liked them bevor.


using it mainly for mastering....

[roc]

Originally Posted by RobAcid

i have the S3 here, and i am happy...

its the first multiband comp that i like to use, i never liked them bevor.


using it mainly for mastering....

Hey Rob, just heard some of your work, its..... dope man, dope......
How is the sound of the S3 can you hear and feel the tubes ?
I know you deal with heavy bass dance music, how is the S3 with that ?
Does it add air and openness to the highs ?
does it add nice tube warmth to the mids ?
Does it add finished record glue and sound?

Thanks luv your work

peace

[Ben F]

Originally Posted by roc

In the Dance world Multi-band compression is gold for mastering the bass and keeping
the highs nice and sparkly. Bass can sometime be a wild beast that need to be tamed for the NYC Dance Clubs.

A decent single band compressor with side chain filter is all you should need if the mix is good. Most of the time hardly any compression at all, just the sound it imparts. I kind of like an optical or VCA compressor followed by a tube vari-mu.

If Rob gives the thumbs up to the drawmer, then you can't get much better advice!

[roc]

Originally Posted by Ben F

A decent single band compressor with side chain filter is all you should need if the mix is good. Most of the time hardly any compression at all, just the sound it imparts. I kind of like an optical or VCA compressor followed by a tube vari-mu.

If Rob gives the thumbs up to the drawmer, then you can't get much better advice!

Hey Ben thanks for that.

[RobAcid]

mostly i compress the mids with the S3, around maybe 1db.... but befor that i allready doing my compression chain, with other comps as well.

so as a extra portion platinum, the S3.

i like the sound of the drawmer when you drive it hot, then it gets something

[roc]

Originally Posted by RobAcid

mostly i compress the mids with the S3, around maybe 1db.... but befor that i allready doing my compression chain, with other comps as well.

so as a extra portion platinum, the S3.

i like the sound of the drawmer when you drive it hot, then it gets something

1 thing I have notice is that there is no ratio knob on S3.
Not sure how that woks.

[RobAcid]

its a opto comp, so why you need a ratio ?

[roc]

Originally Posted by RobAcid

its a opto comp, so why you need a ratio ?

Tube tech smc 2b is also opto but it has ratio .
I could be missing something but Im only 3.
http://www.tube-tech.com/filer/hrespics/SMC%202B.jpg

[Waltz Mastering]

Roc, Where are you located?

It's most likely that if you go through a dealer, you can get the S3, SMC 2b or MLA-3 to test drive, or at least 2 out of the 3. When your spending that kind of money it's worth it.

It's been mentioned in the thread to that sometimes you can get a unit that not quite dialed in, so if your liking the unit your demoing, It might be worth it to buy that particular one. Sometimes these pop up on the used market as well.

[Ben F]

It's a shame you can't use a side-chain filter on the tube-tech single bands. The link is for a control voltage only, not a side chain filter. It's probably an easy mod with a couple of capacitors but they won't tell me where to put them!

[roc]

Originally Posted by Waltz Mastering

Roc, Where are you located?

It's most likely that if you go through a dealer, you can get the S3, SMC 2b or MLA-3 to test drive, or at least 2 out of the 3. When your spending that kind of money it's worth it.

It's been mentioned in the thread to that sometimes you can get a unit that not quite dialed in, so if your liking the unit your demoing, It might be worth it to buy that particular one. Sometimes these pop up on the used market as well.

I'm in NJ/NYC
Thanks Walt, I'm trying to put something together now.

[William Bowden]

Originally Posted by turtlerock

yeah , the email from 301 i got was for a bunch of mastering stuff and definately along the lines of "we are open to all offers "
it seems times are tough in the land of plenty

Yeah, just ask Jacqui Espie!!

I wouldn't mind coming down to the show to see your latest wunderkind, I gave up on the dyn cause of the price frankly but maybe now there's something better...?

Re Roc - yes it was a few years back and the demo model they sent was no good unfortunately - as from what I remember the sound was quite punchy and the compression was faster than the cruisey tubetech vibe. I knew it was a lemon though, so back it went with no review... Shame.

Ben F - looks like tuesday, I forgot monday is my birthday and you can imagine what 'er indoors had to say about that!

The King

[turtlerock]

Originally Posted by William Bowden

Yeah, just ask Jacqui Espie!!

I wouldn't mind coming down to the show to see your latest wunderkind, I gave up on the dyn cause of the price frankly but maybe now there's something better...?

The King

hey will
i am unaware of what if any changes are happening at weiss or the standard weiss line

but the thing Daniel is coming downunder again to show and tell about is mind blowing
to sat the least , its kinda the way things should be done but just arent.

well it blew my mind and my accountants .


i wish i could post pix but until the show its just secret vapor ware
i hate trade shows but it seems i am hooked up there for the whole three days
i'll see you there