Dithering chain

[masterizer]

Originally Posted by skiroy

I also posted this else where but it came to me that this forum is probably more appropriate.
Okay so I do all my tracking and mixing in Sonar in 24bit. But I like to use Adobe audition to limit it to zero. Their analysing statistics option and their hard limiter just takes the guess work out for me and thats how I like to do it.

But my question is on when to dither and I also use Waves L2 for dithering only and Im havent ever tried to use third party plugs in adobe yet so someone enlighten me. But anyways should I mix the project in sonar from to 24 to 24bit and turn it dithering off then limit it in adobe and then apply dithering? Does it really matter? Im just concerned that if I dither and mix down to 16bit from sonar and then limit it and resave it with adobe that Im might degrade the signal?

Any insight?

Dither is one of the last steps in mastering, you want all your fades ect to be completed before dithering. You add dither before you convert your word length from 24bit to 16bit. If you're using the L2 as a limiter and dither use it last. You're better off using a better quality file when you throw it into a brick wall, the end result will be damaged no matter what but hopefully not as badly.

[skiroy]

Originally Posted by masterizer

Dither is one of the last steps in mastering, you want all your fades ect to be completed before dithering. You add dither before you convert your word length from 24bit to 16bit. If you're using the L2 as a limiter and dither use it last. You're better off using a better quality file when you throw it into a brick wall, the end result will be damaged no matter what but hopefully not as badly.

Im not seeing my plugs come up in adobe audition. Do you know if you can use third party plugs in adobe?

And if you cant should I mix down from sonar as 24bit, limit it in adobe as 24bit,then bring it back into sonar as a stereo track so I can then put the L2 on the master to dither it to 16bit? Will all this Daw to Daw transfer degrade my sound?

[kjg]

Originally Posted by skiroy

I also posted this else where but it came to me that this forum is probably more appropriate.
Okay so I do all my tracking and mixing in Sonar in 24bit. But I like to use Adobe audition to limit it to zero. Their analysing statistics option and their hard limiter just takes the guess work out for me and thats how I like to do it.

But my question is on when to dither and I also use Waves L2 for dithering only and Im havent ever tried to use third party plugs in adobe yet so someone enlighten me. But anyways should I mix the project in sonar from to 24 to 24bit and turn it dithering off then limit it in adobe and then apply dithering? Does it really matter? Im just concerned that if I dither and mix down to 16bit from sonar and then limit it and resave it with adobe that Im might degrade the signal?

Any insight?

whatever limiter or app you prefer, stay at 24 bit until all processing is done and then dither as the last step before truncating to 16 bit.

so either stay in sonar for all processing, then dither, then export to 16 bit

or

sonar > 24 bit export > adobe > dither > 16 bit export

[skiroy]

Originally Posted by kjg

whatever limiter or app you prefer, stay at 24 bit until all processing is done and then dither as the last step before truncating to 16 bit.

so either stay in sonar for all processing, then dither, then export to 16 bit

or

sonar > 24 bit export > adobe > dither > 16 bit export

Im sorry I might be naive but when you put the L2 on the master you do not need to do a seperate dithering step do you? Isnt it done during the exporting process in all DAWs when you have your dithering plugins on the master fader?

[kjg]

Originally Posted by skiroy

Im sorry I might be naive but when you put the L2 on the master you do not need to do a seperate dithering step do you? Isnt it done during the exporting process in all DAWs when you have your dithering plugins on the master fader?

indeed. if you enable dither on the L2, you don't have to do a separate dithering step. you only have to export to the right bit depth.

processing > L2 + dither > export to 16 bit.

on the L2 dither section set quantize to 16 and dither type and noise shaping to taste.

best,
kjg

[masterizer]

Originally Posted by kjg

indeed. if you enable dither on the L2, you don't have to do a separate dithering step. you only have to export to the right bit depth.

processing > L2 + dither > export to 16 bit.

on the L2 dither section set quantize to 16 and dither type and noise shaping to taste.

best,
kjg

You can also choose "no-dither" on the L2. Whatever you are using Audition for you can probably accomplish in Sonar. Theoretically you should be able to transfer a file from one DAW to another without degrading it. Realistically it will probably take its tole, let your ears be the judge.

[kjg]

Originally Posted by masterizer

You can also choose "no-dither" on the L2.

that's what I said. set dither type and noise shaping to taste. you probably do want to evaluate these decisions by setting truncate to the value you are exporting to. it is always good to know what distortion you are actually committing to because this guy on the internet said you could go without dither.

Exporting without loss between these two DAWs is as easy as exporting to 32 bit float. But if exporting after using the L2, consider dithering at 24 bit level. It truncates.

[masterizer]

Originally Posted by kjg

that's what I said. set dither type and noise shaping to taste. you probably do want to evaluate these decisions by setting truncate to the value you are exporting to. it is always good to know what distortion you are actually committing to because this guy on the internet said you could go without dither.

Exporting without loss between these two DAWs is as easy as exporting to 32 bit float. But if exporting after using the L2, consider dithering at 24 bit level. It truncates.

You can go without dither if you like the sound of unicorns taking shits on your audio.