what does itunes do??

[wildplum]

Situation:
Import music to itunes (from a mixer, or even a CD, etc.) on a computer as a .wav file, so as to burn a CD.

My understanding (and perhaps incorrect) is that in this situation, itunes does something during the import- changes EQ or something. It is not a straight transfer to disc. It is also at 16 bit (i.e.., does not create a 24 bit wav file).

If my understanding is correct, I would like to tell clients in simple language why they should not do this. So, what is it that itunes does when creating a wav file from some source?

[swaff]

An audio CD has 16 bit files on it, not 24, anyways. So the fact that it imports 16 bit doesn't implicate any loss of quality on that aspect. I have never heard anything about it changing EQ for wav importing, but would love to hear any information if this is so.

Swaff

[Table Of Tone]

If you open a 24 bit wav file with itunes it will stay that way until you put it on a CD.
At that point it will truncate the audio to 16 bit.

When you import a CD into itunes it will automatically change the audio to whatever the itunes preferences is set to.

First of all, go into preferences/playback and uncheck the boxes that say crossfade (crossfades between tracks), sound enhancer (MS widener set half way up as default) and soundcheck (plays back audio at average volume so if you have mixes and masters it will reduce the volume of the masters and normalize the mixes)

This will now get itunes playing back audio as it should be!

If you then go back to itunes preferences before importing the CD and go into import settings you will see a menu.
Set the audio file resolution to Aiff Encoder and then import the CD.
This will stop it from compressing the audio data on import so that you can make a copy of the CD at the same quality as the original.

Hope this helps

[ONDRAY]

in the iTunes preferences, there is a check box that's "Audio Enhancement". I beleive this is just for playback, I can't see it doing it on a straight burn.

[carlsaff]

My understanding (not a big iTunes user here) is that iTunes is set up by default to import *all* music as M4A. And so when you import WAV or AIF audio, regardless of it's resolution, it gets converted to M4A during import. Then, when you burn those files from the iTunes database to CD, you are actually burning compressed audio, not the original, lossless audio. And so the quality of the burned disc is equivalent to an MP3.

iTunes can be configured to not convert imported high-resolution audio to another format, but I believe the default behavior is as above... and that's why I advise my clients to use other burning software whenever possible: I just don't have all day to teach people how to configure iTunes to burn the audio losslessly!

Many of the audio CDs I receive for mastering that feature audio with obvious MP3 artifacts turn out to have been burned from iTunes, and I usually come to find that the situation outlined above is exactly what transpired.

EDIT: Oops... Table of Tone basically said this already...

[tomdarude]

Another weird thing:

Rip a CD onto the desktop...

import in iTunes, play, listen......

import in Sonics "soundBlade", play, listen.....




someone tell me what you hear!!!...am I deaf, dumb, blind ??

[Table Of Tone]

Originally Posted by tomdarude

Another weird thing:

Rip a CD onto the desktop...

import in iTunes, play, listen......

import in Sonics "soundBlade", play, listen.....




someone tell me what you hear!!!...am I deaf, dumb, blind ??

Are we talking, itunes with those three playback boxes unchecked?

[Rick Sutton]

Originally Posted by carlsaff

Many of the audio CDs I receive for mastering that feature audio with obvious MP3 artifacts turn out to have been burned from iTunes

I've seen that quite a few times also. I've got one client that takes the studio mixes home and runs them through his Itunes (or equivalent) and brings them back to me maybe a year later and we use them as beds for new singers etc. The first time he did this the songs sounded like they had a phaser added to them! It took a while, but I finally convinced him to change his methods and now it sounds a lot better.

[just.sounds]

Itunes has a asrc on by default for obvious reasons. Only it is a bit dirty

Benchmark media has a wiki page about these things.

ITunes-QuickTime for Mac - Setup Guide - Benchmark

Also look for sonic studio amarra

[WBM]

That anyone know other program than itunes to rip the tracks?

So how show up all the data when you open a track in itunes?

[Lagerfeldt]

Originally Posted by tomdarude

Another weird thing:

Rip a CD onto the desktop...

import in iTunes, play, listen......

import in Sonics "soundBlade", play, listen.....




someone tell me what you hear!!!...am I deaf, dumb, blind ??

No, but you probably forgot to set the preferences correctly in iTunes.

[tomdarude]

Nope, everything unchecked...still sounds different!!

Why would there be things like Sonic Studio "Amarra"...I´ll check this one out soon and report later...

[Table Of Tone]

Originally Posted by tomdarude

Nope, everything unchecked...still sounds different!!

Why would there be things like Sonic Studio "Amarra"...I´ll check this one out soon and report later...

I know!

Which do you like the sound of the most?
itunes or sB?

[Table Of Tone]

Originally Posted by Lagerfeldt

No, but you probably forgot to set the preferences correctly in iTunes.

I took it one step further.

I bounced a mix, in realtime from logic as a 24 bit/48k wav (same res as the actual recording) and then setup a zinman loopback from the mix session in logic.

I ran playback from the mix session through my outboard mastering chain and captured it on a new stereo track in the same session.
The CPU load was pretty low because all reverbs were actual rooms captured from ribbon mics and all instruments were real and well mic'd, so there were very little plugins being used.
The buffer size was set to 1024 for playback.

I then opened soundblade and imported the mix I had bounced from logic earlier.

I ran a zinman loop on soundblade, through the same outboard chain, with the settings untouched.
The soundblade capture sounded more defined!

[Chaellus]

Originally Posted by tomdarude

Nope, everything unchecked...still sounds different!!

Why would there be things like Sonic Studio "Amarra"...I´ll check this one out soon and report later...

Nope your Defintly not alone on that one as i too hear this only when listing to itunes or quick time....any other media player doesnt seem to mess with the audio or sound...this is with lossless i might add.....play the same file somewhere else and its back to normal.. i know that all the other programs dont have a sound but for some reason...Itunes does....which kind of bugs me a bit.

[just.sounds]

The asrc is async sample rate converter. Is that not enough damage?sonic claims they know better math and the volume control has more bits.

[Chaellus]

Originally Posted by just.sounds

The asrc is async sample rate converter. Is that not enough damage?sonic claims they know better math and the volume control has more bits.

is that the culprit behind the sound of itunes?

[omasciarotte]

Originally Posted by WBM

That anyone know other program than itunes to rip the tracks?

Don’t have a comprehensive list but I use iTunes w/error correction enabled for undamaged discs and Max from sbooth.org for damaged discs.

BTW, when preferences are set correctly and your DACs sample rate matches a file's sample rate flag, iTunes will produce bit perfect output, for what that’s worth.