Metering Out Of The Box

[pmx]

at the moment i use spectre and ixl, but i find that i desire something that's just presenting good level information and doesn't show any fancy funky and mainly distracting analyzing diagrams. i can always fire one up when needed...

i've been looking at dorrough meters, and want to hook a 40aes up to my avocet using its digital metering output. additionaly, i could add analog metering just before going into the a/d....

does anyone here measure in both the analog and digital domain at those points in the signal chain? is there any reason not to measure at the avocet but earlier? any thought on measuring in the analog domain?

[Adam Dempsey]

VU meters on the console fed from the monitor select, always. No substitute. (in our case, the meter bridge of the Manley console).
Peak program meters on the A-D convertor. Other within the DAW if needed.

[turtlerock]

we have more outboard meters then usual and for good reason maybe some of our chain would help you ..? ( and yes i am actually leaving some extra meters we use out for clarity !)

out of playback daw (weiss da ) converters > sony dig meters and dig mytek (i like the sony better but they dont do 96k) this tells us what it coming off the playback before anything happens which is extremely useful when something is kooky
(like the mixes are down 2db on one side ! )


the input to the parkside mastering console has sifam vu meters before the signal chain starts
then an mini analog NTP goniometer and an analog ntp peak bar meters for level corrected analog program which lets us set the analog part of the chain to run at a sane (ie the sweet spot -level) instead of running it super hot which makes a HUGE difference to the tone
of the analog chain

followed by another set sifam vus and a sifam phase meter at the end of the analog feed set to ovu=-14db which lets us run into the ad converters at a workable vu meter level which is perfect for getting it into the converters in a controllable manner - no clipping the ad converters or clipping anything for that matter around here

then after the A>D converters and some more digital processing we feed and apogee uv-1000 matrix which feeds another set of external sony dig meters and the mytek dig meters into the sadie daw

that signal and a bunch of others feeds an avocet which feeds the final and most important set of meters
the external parkside monitoring meter bridge which holds a large analog ntp gonimeter a digital dorrough meter and a large set of sifam vu meters with
variable stepped pad on them usually set to attn 6 db so it tracks the same as the mastering console meters even though the final monitor/master signal is louder then the reference analog chain because of the digital processing (limiters etc) and that also feeds a couple of klark technic spectrums which frankly are just there mostly for show


now this set up reads complicated but it is very elegant it allows true digital and analog metering at the start , middle and end of the chain , gives perfect left , right balance reference at all times and
at all points in the chain , and the goniometers ...well
i have no idea how anybody masters loud records without them the digital versions of these boxes just dont work, and we have collected a stash of tubes to keep them running for another twenty years

the bottom line is i can glance from left to right in a millisecond and see that nothing is clipped everything is straight and most importantly the chains level working the way it should ie right in the sweet spot.

this system gives us the perfect constant reference so i can just close my eyes and listen to the music instead of "chasing things around "

i guess my question is i know most guys dont have this luxury but do most of you run your analog chain at O=-14db (which means it is usually attn from the digital source which as we know is nearly always cooked before we see it )
or do you run your analog boxes hot and hope /know they can handle it ..?

how do you meter this ..?

[jdg]

i run one dorrough 280d right before the DA of my analog chain, and another 280d multed from my monitor DA

[skuttbergsveen]

I know this is off topic, but...

Have anyone trued the new Dorrough-meters from Waves?
Did you like them? How are they compared to the outboard ones?

Thanks!

[Cellotron]

I use a 6 channel Logitek LED PPM/VU meter. They run cheaper than the Dorroughs but still do the job nicely - and have the advantage of some of them being in a compact (but still easy to read) 1RU design. Logitek: Products

The first two channels I have fed from my Coleman monitor controllers meter out so that I can see the level of whatever I have chosen as input. Nice for making sure the levels going into the process chain are set correctly, or for quickly checking level of a reference CD a client brings in without having to load it into the DAW first.

The next two channels are fed from the secondary outputs on the DAC (it has both XLR and TRS balanced outs that are fed the signal simultaneously) that is fed from my capture DAW so that I can see whatever final level I have set without looking at the DAW.

And the final channels are fed by the secondary outputs my turntable pre (which has both XLR and RCA outs going at the same time). Lets me compare levels on test records that clients bring in - not that this happens much - but I wasn't using the 5/6 channels until I hooked this up as I don't ever do any surround.

As far as digital metering - the Sonoris Meter makes a nice cheaper alternative to the Waves Dorrough - Meter - Sonoris Audio Engineering

Best regards,
Steve Berson

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[mpdonahue]

As far as metering in the box goes, I find them way to slow and typically a little behind the program. Not of very much use.
My metering setup is as follows:
I have a Sony DMU30 and the meters on the HDCD model 1 (in Ave/PK mode) set to what the DA is playing. This allows me to meter whatever I am monitoring.
I also have a set of 3 big API 561 VU meters for the L-C-R and 3 smaller Sifam VU meters for the LS-RS-LFE and a Sifam correlation meter. These are all fed from the monitor selector from the Crookwood surround console. I've got pads for the meters that get me in the working range of the analog meters. The Crookwood allows me to choose virtually anything (Transfer Source, Input to the AD, Output of the DA and Monitor select).
All the best,
-mark

[pmx]

thanks guys, that's some interesting setups...

my current setup is

aes out >
eq1 + ds1 >
d/a >
analog chain >
a/d >
ds1 >
dac2 just for getting aes into firewire >
aes out to avocet

i use the dac2's d/a to feed an analog dk msd100 (now that's some gearsluttin'), but want to measure digital before hitting the analog loop d/a too, and at the avocet too, with a 40-aes or something like that.

the logitek stuff looks good too, thanks steve. it would be nice to be able to have both "before analog chain" and "after analog chain" next to each other in a 1 rackspace. the size of dorrough 40's is appealing as well though.