Lavry Black DA-10 X Benchmark DAC-1

[Torg]

The price is exactly the same for both.

Are they in the same league ? Anyone had the chance to compare?

For monitoring purposes.

Which one would you choose? (not only soundwise, any other feature/reason comments also appreciated)

thank you

[grandmasters]

Originally Posted by Torg

The price is exactly the same for both.

Are they in the same league ? Anyone had the chance to compare?

For monitoring purposes.

Which one would you choose? (not only soundwise, any other feature/reason comments also appreciated)

thank you

Already discussed at length, just do a search but I'm sure can be updated with new opinions.

For me, The benchmark was better for rock, and pop and the lavry for jazz and classical but only marginally and not across the board.

In my honest opinion, do minne miney mo, either one will work for you as they are both awesome.

Noah

[macc]

I haven't tried the Lavry, but Benchmark is great - and you may be more likely to get on second hand...? The headphone amp is really nice too.

I got mine for about half retail price, second hand, top condition - a bargain!

[Torg]

Originally Posted by grandmasters

Already discussed at length, just do a search but I'm sure can be updated with new opinions.

using the search all i could find was:

benchmark x blue
HEDD192 x black x blue
benchmark x mytek
blue x black
etc....

Most of those are usually more expansive than the ones in question(black x benchmark), so these comparisons are not really on the same price level.

If there is already a thread like this as you mention please post the link. I would be happy to take it from there.

also like you said, "I'm sure can be updated with new opinions"

[thermos]

Also check Brad Blackwood's forum over at PSW Recording Forums: Welcome to the forum.

It seems like more people prefer the Lavry as it doesn't use src, and thus sounds more natural (?). Whatever, I have the black, the headphone amp is nice and I love the digital switch for gain.

[kjg]

You might be interested in this thread...

Lavry DA10 vs Benchmark DAC1: DEATHMATCH! - Topic Powered by eve community

[jdg]

i liked the black more then the benchmark when i had mytek vs black vs benchmark shoot out.

judging a DA is kinda weird.. it comes down to what you like to here.

the attenuation is done via an up/down switch on the front, that drove me nuts. but, once its set, i didn't have to change it as i use a passive attenuator before my amp.

good luck!

[grandmasters]

BTW I've got a Benchmark DAC-1 with Rack Kit for sale. PM me if interested.

[Trakworx]

Originally Posted by Torg

The price is exactly the same for both.

Are they in the same league ? Anyone had the chance to compare?

For monitoring purposes.

Which one would you choose? (not only soundwise, any other feature/reason comments also appreciated)

thank you

I had one of each to compare. Both are nice. I bought the Benchmark. Smoother, less fatiguing sound. I prefer the knob to the switch, both functionally and sound-wise.

[tengu]

The Benchmark has a somewhat veiled sound IMO.

From my limited experience with the Lavry it seemed more "accurate".

[macc]

those last two posts show exactly how subjective all this is!

One man's 'smooth' is another man's 'veiled'...

[arf]

Originally Posted by macc

those last two posts show exactly how subjective all this is!

One man's 'smooth' is another man's 'veiled'...

Not only subjective, but dependant on rooms, monitors, amps...

GS polls hardly ever favor any single entry, but scanning various threads on DAC1-DA10 shoot outs show the DA10 to be far in the lead.

[Torg]

Originally Posted by macc

those last two posts show exactly how subjective all this is!

Well put.

That is exactly how i felt after the replys started to come up.

Unfortunately i am unable to try them out.

These kinds of gear are not available here and i have no other way than to go "blind".

Originally Posted by arf

but scanning various threads on DAC1-DA10 shoot outs show the DA10 to be far in the lead.

thats what it seems to me as well.

But funny thing is that i have a hard time remembering even ONE mastering house that has the Lavry Black and it is very commom to see benchmarks around.

Also... i read both manuals and the benchmark one is pretty convincing as it clearly describes the unit and explains a bunch about it showing tests, etc.... (ok this doesnt mean much and i would never choose a piece of gear by looking at the manual, but thats all i have to compare at this time)

It seems you cant go wrong with any.

But it looks that the benchmark is more like on the safe side and with lavry is like not really being sure about it, despite the forum threads results.(not always reliable)

Thanks to all who posted so far.

please add more if you can.

[arf]

Originally Posted by Torg

But funny thing is that i have a hard time remembering even ONE mastering house that has the Lavry Black and it is very commom to see benchmarks around.

The DA10 just came out within the last year. Established houses would already have the DA side covered, so this is not really an indicator.

Having listened to Gold, Black, and Blue, IMO, the DA10 is impressive.

[Trakworx]

Hey Torg, what coverter are you currently monitoring through?

[Torg]

Originally Posted by arf

so this is not really an indicator.

I agree with your point of view.

But actually, it kinda is.

Seeing benchmarks around is like "ok, its been tested and approved by many"

Not seeing lavry and taking into consideration it is a new product is like "ok, its too early to expect people to have them, BUT will they actually buy it in the future?"

What im trying to say is one has been approved and the other still being "tested".

I didnt mean to say it was not good because i dont see it around.

arf, what do you have to say about black x blue ?

[Torg]

Hey jdub.

Dont flame me, but i have motu and RME.

im not one of the big ones. working hard here to set/improve my room.

lavry or bench would be an upgrade for me.

But what does this relates to the thread ? any advice ?

[Trakworx]

Originally Posted by Torg

Hey jdub.

Dont flame me, but i have motu and RME.

im not one of the big ones. working hard here to set/improve my room.

lavry or bench would be an upgrade for me.

But what does this relates to the thread ? any advice ?

No

I only asked because sometimes it helps to know what you are comparing to. When I demo'ed those converters, I was comparing to my 192 I/O. In my room the Lavry sounded pretty similar to the 192, and I liked the difference I heard with the Benchmark. I think you will be happy with either.

[Cellotron]

With converter testing one way it can be made less purely subjective is to start with an analog source (i.e. vinyl or analog reel) - and then compare the sound of this feed direct to your monitor controller with that of a loop back of adc>dac - and then listen for what gives you closer to the original source. In general the dac that sounded closer to the original source would be more preferable choice even if it didn't sound as "pleasant" (unless you were choosing something for the send to the process chain where you wanted to deliberately introduce some colorations).

Otherwise if dealing with how a DAC reproduces a digital source - without a loopback of an extra adc>dac stage to at least a/b against it as to what additional colorations are being added by the loopback - then you're basing judgements on what works better for that particular source - in which case an overly sharp source will sound better with a DAC that has slower transient reproduction, a veiled source will sound better with a brighter DAC, etc. etc.

Anyway - fwiw I really like my Lavry Blue DAC's (better than my Apogee's or Lucid) - and I'm pretty sure the Lavry Black would not disappoint.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[peeder]

I use the DA10, though I have never tested the Benchmark.

The complaints, in this forum, about the volume switch on the DA10 mystify me.

Can you say, "REPEATABLE VOLUMES"???

Repeatable volume is so intrinsically desirable in mastering applications that I would be stunned for any ME to choose against it.

There are a couple other things to know about the DA10.

Firstly, you want to use "Crystal" mode. You might initially like one of the other modes, they do sound different, but you will soon see the benefit of internal sync upon further listening. It really is where the converter performs best.

Secondly, the polarity (aka "phase") invert switch got mixed up on my unit, and maybe all of the units. "Invert" is actually pin 2 hot on my unit...test yours to see, and you might end up leaving it on Invert as I do. This can be dismissed as a flaw in labelling...it won't compromise the sound at all as long as you set it right.

[macc]

Personally Torg, while all this is great advice, if you're coming from MOTU/RME you can't go wrong

I'd say, bearing in mind chats we have had before, look out on the 2nd hand market and get whichever comes up in a good deal thumbsup

If you're going to buy new, then you may as well get the Lavry as it seems to be a slightly better choice - but really you can't go too far wrong.

[peeder]

Originally Posted by macc

I'd say, bearing in mind chats we have had before, look out on the 2nd hand market and get whichever comes up in a good deal thumbsup

A stronger argument could be made for the one people refuse to sell!

[bionic]

I have had the Benchmark for a few years now. Loved is when I bought it - am looking to upgrade to a Dangerous Monitor soon though - they sound amazing.
One thing I have noticed with the DAC1 is the mids are a little pronounced - not much but a little and this does affect some eq'ing decision obviously. you get used to it but it is one of those "if I do this in here it will sound like this out there" things which can be annoying. It is only subtle though and I have only noticed it after a using it for a while.
I haven't had the chance to try the DA10 - Lavry make great stuff though.

[thermos]

Originally Posted by peeder

I use the DA10, though I have never tested the Benchmark.

The complaints, in this forum, about the volume switch on the DA10 mystify me.

Can you say, "REPEATABLE VOLUMES"???

Repeatable volume is so intrinsically desirable in mastering applications that I would be stunned for any ME to choose against it.

There are a couple other things to know about the DA10.

Firstly, you want to use "Crystal" mode. You might initially like one of the other modes, they do sound different, but you will soon see the benefit of internal sync upon further listening. It really is where the converter performs best.

Secondly, the polarity (aka "phase") invert switch got mixed up on my unit, and maybe all of the units. "Invert" is actually pin 2 hot on my unit...test yours to see, and you might end up leaving it on Invert as I do. This can be dismissed as a flaw in labelling...it won't compromise the sound at all as long as you set it right.

Invert is pin 2 hot on all Da10s, fwiw. A key thing to know.

[macc]

Originally Posted by peeder

A stronger argument could be made for the one people refuse to sell!

This is dependent upon finances of course, which is why I mentioned it

I haven't heard the Lavry, but if money is a consideration and a DAC-1 is going for £4-500 while the Lavry is going for pretty much double that new... I know what I'd be doing. It's not like this thread has been vehemently conclusive, 'forget the DAC1, it is a heap of shit' etc etc

But I know, I know... this is gearslutz

[Coyoteous]

Pardon the offshoot, but is the Mytek in the running with these?

I'd like to upgrade my home studio conversion - currently using an RME ADI-2. I keep bouncing around between these 3 (DA-10, DAC-1, Stereo 96 DAC), a suitable ADC companion, or going whole hog for a Mytek 8X192 AD/DA (or similar).

I do all kinds of audio work here and in other studios, but my focus is on a futuristic, yet old-school concept, electronic/electro-acoustic music lab. I'd like somewhere between 2X2 and 8X8 channels of "beyond reproach" conversion.

[arf]

Originally Posted by Coyoteous

Pardon the offshoot, but is the Mytek in the running with these?

I'd like to upgrade my home studio conversion - currently using an RME ADI-2. I keep bouncing around between these 3 (DA-10, DAC-1, Stereo 96 DAC), a suitable ADC companion, or going whole hog for a Mytek 8X192 AD/DA (or similar).

I do all kinds of audio work here and in other studios, but my focus is on a futuristic, yet old-school concept, electronic/electro-acoustic music lab. I'd like somewhere between 2X2 and 8X8 channels of "beyond reproach" conversion.

IMO, the Mytek 8x192 is in the running with the best.

[staudio]

Originally Posted by arf

IMO, the Mytek 8x192 is in the running with the best.

I agree, it is a superb converter.

[Torg]

Can anyone give more explanation/insight on the narrow, wide and cristal in the DA10 ? ("Ultra low jitter modes" according to them)

also about the DAC-1 feature UltraLock™. (they claim 100% interface jitter immune, that it is "in a topology outperforms two-stage PLL designs")

[tengu]

Originally Posted by macc

those last two posts show exactly how subjective all this is!

One man's 'smooth' is another man's 'veiled'...

Not enritely correct. I would also describe the DAC1 as smooth yet it is ALSO veiled.

The Lavry seems to retain transients better, this is possibly why people find it "fatiguing".

I owned the Benchmark for quite a while. I liked it's bass extension but after doing some loop test with it and other converters it was apparent to me that it was doing something to the sound. What I would describe as "veiled".

My next purchase is going to be a Mytek DA96.

YMMV.