Vol. Automation on the master fader in pop music?

[Mr. Liszt]

Can any MEs talk about using volume automation on a mix that has been bounced down to a single audio file? Besides the obvious situations, such as fade ins/outs, how often will an ME automate volume for various sections of a track? Is it common to increase the volume for different sections such as a big chorus for example? If so, how much in terms of dBs would one typically allow for within a single standard commercial pop song? Most times it will be a case by case, song by song thing but I am looking for any quasi-standard procedures that some GS MEs might be able to offer.

[MAzevedo]

I do this all the time, especially when someone has gone crazy with buss compression on their mix and now the acoustic breakdown is louder than the chorus. I usually cut the pieces into regions and change the segment gain rather than mess with master fader automation, but it's the same end result.

As to how much, well, as much as it takes. I generally will make these changes in the source files before I add my compression. Usually all it takes is 1-3dB changes but there have been times I have moved things much more than that. Like most things in mastering, if it sounds right it is right.

[Mr. Liszt]

Originally Posted by MAzevedo

I do this all the time, especially when someone has gone crazy with buss compression on their mix and now the acoustic breakdown is louder than the chorus. I usually cut the pieces into regions and change the segment gain rather than mess with master fader automation, but it's the same end result.

As to how much, well, as much as it takes. I generally will make these changes in the source files before I add my compression. Usually all it takes is 1-3dB changes but there have been times I have moved things much more than that. Like most things in mastering, if it sounds right it is right.

Thanks for the reply!

Okay, so by "buss compression" you mean that your client has given you a single audio file that he/she/they had mixed in a DAW and added a ton of compression onto the master fader?

And you say that you cut the file into separate regions to adjust volume. By that do you mean you cut the sections of the original audio file and put those new regions onto separate tracks for independent adjustment? Like putting the lead vocal in a song onto different tracks according to song structure, intro-verse-chorus-bridge whatever?

[MAzevedo]

I do mean mixes that were heavily compressed on the mix buss during mixdown.

When I cut the song up to make level changes, I keep it all on the same track. I just find it faster/easier to cut the song into regions and set levels section-by-section than to much about with breakpoints on an automation curve. Not all DAW's let you work like that, so your milage may vary.

[Jerry Tubb]

Originally Posted by Mr. Liszt

Can any MEs talk about using volume automation on a mix that has been bounced down to a single audio file? Besides the obvious situations, such as fade ins/outs, how often will an ME automate volume for various sections of a track?

Sure quite often I use automation in PT HD or Sonic soundBlade. But witn no master fader.

Both for turning sections up or down... as usual it just depends on the music.

Consider the Power Ballad that starts very quiet and gradually builds to a roar on the chorus. Boosting the quiet intro and first verse is sometimes needed. Or pulling down the loud chorus a touch instead.

I actually had a version of Ravel's Bolero recently to master. As you may know it starts super quiet ppp and ends super loud fff. So I had to do some automation in the beginning so it would fit in the the rest of the record (normal acoustic folk rock music ), & the listener wouldn't think the first two minutes were silent, esp if they were listening in the car or other noisy environment... a practical rather than a purist approach.

Occasionally use automation to fix a word or chord that's sung or played too loud or soft. Even used automation a few times to do a reverse fade, when someone has gotten a little too anxious with a fade out in the mix. So for me automation has a lot of uses, in lieu of resorting to heavy compression.

JT

[Mr. Liszt]

Originally Posted by Jerry Tubb

I had to do some automation in the beginning so it would fit in the the rest of the record (normal acoustic folk rock music )

Yes, I am very familiar with that piece. And, wow! Ravel getting a cut on a rock music album?! I can't imagine the thing.

[sanddigger1]

I'm using volume automation during mastering, for similar reasons as described above. It is usually in a 1 - 4 dB range. sometimes more, but it is exceptional. It is very useful.