Adobe Audition 1.5....

[mrsteaks]

Fellow Slutz - I've been using Adobe Audition 1.5 for mastering and master CD burning. Lately, I've noticed a degradation in quality, mainly in that my masters don't have the sheen and depth that the original (88.2/24) recording does. I'm thinking I have a dither problem - either it's set wrong or something else is going on.

Help??? Suggestions??? Replace Adobe with something else, like Wavelab or Samplitude?

Or - add CD Architect to the DAW as CD mastering software?

[Andy Krehm]

Originally Posted by mrsteaks

Fellow Slutz - I've been using Adobe Audition 1.5 for mastering and master CD burning. Lately, I've noticed a degradation in quality, mainly in that my masters don't have the sheen and depth that the original (88.2/24) recording does. I'm thinking I have a dither problem - either it's set wrong or something else is going on.

Help??? Suggestions??? Replace Adobe with something else, like Wavelab or Samplitude?

Probably the built-in sample rate conversion isn't so good.

[mrsteaks]

Originally Posted by Andy Krehm

Probably the built-in sample rate conversion isn't so good.

I'm hoping that isn't so. It allows many variables on dither, shaping, etc. I may not have the right choices for 88.2 to 44.1 It did fine going from 48 to 44.1

Anyone use AA 1.5 and know some secrets or tricks?

[jdg]

audition 2 doesn't "look" so good:
SRC Comparisons

but maybe you're ears are backing up that the SRC isn't that great.

maybe just try getting r8brain free and doing the SRC in that instead of audition.
or avoid SRC in general by capturing at 44.1.

im pretty sure its not your dither, but the SRC that you are hearing.

[mrsteaks]

Originally Posted by jdg

audition 2 doesn't "look" so good:

im pretty sure its not your dither, but the SRC that you are hearing.

Hmmm. Possible. Actually, compared with PT, it looks pretty good. However, I'm hearing something I wasn't hearing when capturing at the lower rate.

Any experience withe the SRC in Wavelab 6 - anyone?

[sleepwalker]

Audition's SRC is actually about as good as any of the DAWs get. Are you looking at the graph with "no pre/post filter" as the option? Obviously the aliasing will be bad without pre-filtering, but it should sound and "look" just fine with the filtering options turned on.

I only know this because on Peak's white paper, only Peak and Audition came out looking OK. I haven't seen this other site you're referencing.

Originally Posted by jdg

audition 2 doesn't "look" so good:
SRC Comparisons

but maybe you're ears are backing up that the SRC isn't that great.

maybe just try getting r8brain free and doing the SRC in that instead of audition.
or avoid SRC in general by capturing at 44.1.

im pretty sure its not your dither, but the SRC that you are hearing.

[mrsteaks]

I didn't want to quibble, but I also thought the SRC for Adobe looked good. I suspected I could be reading the graph incorrectly!

Does anyone use Adobe for mastering? If so, what settings for dither do you use? The BIG question - is Adobe suitable, good enough, accurate enough, for mastering?

I know little about Wave and their L1 through L3 plug ins. I do know, from the little I've read, that they seem to be well received. This brings up another question - will they work with Adobe?

[lucidwaves]

I use audition 1.5 and have had no problems with the SRC on the highest setting. As for dither I use the mbit+ from ozone most of the time but when I've used the standard TPDF from Audition it seemed fine.

BTW Audition 2's interface is horribly clunky and the demo I tried would crash easily. Syntrillium knew what they were doing then Adobe ruined it. Needless to say I wont be "upgrading" anytime soon.

[Franco]

Originally Posted by mrsteaks

I've noticed a degradation in quality, mainly in that my masters don't have the sheen and depth that the original (88.2/24) recording does.

I think you're supposed to notice this; you are in fact downgrading the quality, and if you can point me to a dithering algorithm that can make a 16/44.1 file sound exactly the same as say a 24/88.2 file in terms of depth and clarity, I'll take 2.

[mrsteaks]

Originally Posted by Franco

I think you're supposed to notice this; you are in fact downgrading the quality, and if you can point me to a dithering algorithm that can make a 16/44.1 file sound exactly the same as say a 24/88.2 file in terms of depth and clarity, I'll take 2.

I'd take two, as well!

I expect some degredation, too, but the not amount I'm actually getting. I don't expect to get stellar results, but I've heard better results on finished CDs from folks who use a similar chain to mine. I'm trying to identify where I'm going wrong. I suspect the DAW, maybe the CD burner, because I know my recordings sound a lot better than the final product would suggest. It's a bit frustrating, actually....

[mrsteaks]

I downloaded the demo version of Wavelab 5. It sounded markedly different than Adobe. Better, yes - more open, spacious, smoother, etc. So, I climbed into the nooks and crannies of Adobe and discovered that dither was TURNED OFF. Turning it on, setting sample size to .5 bits, triangular - new Adobe! Sounds identical to Wavelab. Downsampling and burning shows it does that sonically identical to Wavelab, too.

Problem solved!

I hope....

[combover]

As a side note, the various dither settings in Audition can vary significantly in tonality. A couple years back I grabbed screencaps of the noise shaping options set at 1 bit (LSB) applied to digital silence (24 bit). The flat line below -144 indicates noise floor at 24 bit, and the blue area indicates the result when dithering to 16 bit. They're linear scale along the frequency axis, as most of the shaping is weighted towards the high end anyway.

Of course, these aren't useful for making comparisons without listetning, but can give you a rough idea of which ones to try for a particular purpose once you have an idea of which you like. I usually find myself using C1, D, or E.

Anyway, here they are. if I weren't lazy, I'd put up a nice page with an index and thumbnails, but i'm sure you'll do fine...

http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_ns44.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_ns48.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_ns96.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...dition_nsA.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...dition_nsB.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_nsC1.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_nsC2.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_nsC3.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...dition_nsD.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...dition_nsE.png
http://www.capitalstudios.net/pics/a...ition_nsE2.png

[mrsteaks]

I am lazy, and I've never checked the various "noise functions" dither can give you! Thank you for that. VERY useful, indeed!

[Sam Lord]

Dunno if this matters to you, but I (not an ME!) switched from Audition 2 to Samplitude because a partition housing Audition cannot be defragmented, whereas Samp can, no problem. Had to reformat in fact, defragging Audition results in BSOD.

[sleepwalker]

Weird. I've got 1.5 and 2.0 and have successfully defragged all drives using both windows built in utility and diskkeeper 10. Not doubting you at all, just mentioning that it's not a problem for me.

I'm curious what's going to be in the next version of AA. I'm hoping for more spectral editing stuff. That's where they're doing something unique.

Originally Posted by Sam Lord

Dunno if this matters to you, but I (not an ME!) switched from Audition 2 to Samplitude because a partition housing Audition cannot be defragmented, whereas Samp can, no problem. Had to reformat in fact, defragging Audition results in BSOD.

[lucidwaves]

Originally Posted by Sam Lord

Dunno if this matters to you, but I (not an ME!) switched from Audition 2 to Samplitude because a partition housing Audition cannot be defragmented, whereas Samp can, no problem. Had to reformat in fact, defragging Audition results in BSOD.

Not a problem here either. Audition 1.5 and I defrag at least once a month.

[huub]

Try r8brain, it's free, might make a difference, you never know..

[Sam Lord]

Originally Posted by sleepwalker

Weird. I've got 1.5 and 2.0 and have successfully defragged all drives using both windows built in utility and diskkeeper 10. Not doubting you at all, just mentioning that it's not a problem for me...

Sleepwalker and lucidbrains, thanks for the feedback. Now, I use Raxco for defragging, and perhaps the issues exist only with that...but I *really* like Raxco PerfectDisk.

I got slammed with endless BSODs after defragging the Adobe Creation Suite, but only had problems with Audition and Premiere Pro, others worked fine. I had imaged and restored with Acronis TI 10, so I did multiple tries at defragging.

I finally called ADK, *great* folks who this year built my laptop DAW (Intel T7600, 2GB, etc.), and they told me (later, argh...) specifically that Audition and PP cannot be defragged without problems. They had installed Adobe CS2, upgraded from older versions in my desktop, in my machine and the programs had been working fine until first defrag.

Perhaps the "Smart Placement" feature of Raxco is the culprit? I'll look into this because I still own the whole Adobe CS and hope to use it again. Thanks fellas.

[lucidwaves]

Originally Posted by Sam Lord

Sleepwalker and lucidbrains

LOL, thanks

[Sam Lord]

Luckybrains do yourself a favor and don't grow old, you'll live longer and you won't put on a jungian slip like I just did...

------------------------
Deaf to puns!

[lucidwaves]

Originally Posted by Sam Lord

Luckybrains do yourself a favor and don't grow old, you'll live longer and you won't put on a jungian slip like I just did...

------------------------
Deaf to puns!

I'd try not to but the thing is I'm looking forward to having such wit

[delaost]

whats up i am hoping someone can help me out idk were to post or what to do to get answers so im replying on this i know people say there is no certain way to get pro vocals but d pryde says he has a way and he uses the samson c01u and cool edit pro and it sounds amazing and he supposedly gave his settings to a guy named young savior aka owen ness and he now has good quality but he uses a different mic and he kind of shows a little of how he does it can you guys help me out to get good vocals on with the samson and cool edit pro here the link to the way youngsavior records edits and the quality he gets YouTube - cool edit pro secrets and recording a whole track with Young Savior

[editronmaximon]

FWIW, its TPDF dither @ 2 lsb. That's the drill.

[delaost]

ok so what does dithering do does it make it harder on the loud parts or what? and could maybe changing some settings in cool edit pro improve the audio quality

[delaost]

how can i get that d pryde studio processed vocal i like how the comp sound id like to get my vocals harder and sharper like when u turn up the speakers that its almost earpiercing

[RasCricket]

Originally Posted by sleepwalker

Weird. I've got 1.5 and 2.0 and have successfully defragged all drives using both windows built in utility and diskkeeper 10. Not doubting you at all, just mentioning that it's not a problem for me.

I'm curious what's going to be in the next version of AA. I'm hoping for more spectral editing stuff. That's where they're doing something unique.

You guys are saying "defrag". Well, I uninstalled Sonar 7 and immediately got a BSOD - any connection there? Do some DAWs cause bsod on uninstall?

[Petrus]

When I did SRC from 24/96 to 16/44.1 with Audition 1.5 there was a strange imbalance between the L and R in HF area, where one side noise level was strangely much higher then the other when checked with the spectrum analyzer supplied with Audition. Has anybody else noticed this?

Now I use iZotope or Sox for SRC. Peace of mind. And often return to Audition for the clear statistical analysis it offers.