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Mackie Big Knob sucks so bad?
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solidstate
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#1
20th October 2006
Old 20th October 2006
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Mackie Big Knob sucks so bad?

Hi,
i know that this topic it's been widely dicussed in this forum, but after reading a few post i'm even more confused then before..
I've got premium converters(therefore not much left into my bank account for a premium monitor control system:-), apogee Rosetta 200. I was looking for an uncolored(passive) monitor control system. I was going to get presonus central station, but i can't because it doesn't have universal voltage(115-230). The only option left in that price range it's the mackie big knob. Looks cool and it has a voltage selector switch. But i've heard many different opinions in this forum. Some people sayd that can introduce some artifacts to the DA conversion.. Can someone be a lil' more specific please?
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20th October 2006
Old 20th October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solidstate View Post
Hi,
i know that this topic it's been widely dicussed in this forum, but after reading a few post i'm even more confused then before..
I've got premium converters(therefore not much left into my bank account for a premium monitor control system:-), apogee Rosetta 200. I was looking for an uncolored(passive) monitor control system. I was going to get presonus central station, but i can't because it doesn't have universal voltage(115-230). The only option left in that price range it's the mackie big knob. Looks cool and it has a voltage selector switch. But i've heard many different opinions in this forum. Some people sayd that can introduce some artifacts to the DA conversion.. Can someone be a lil' more specific please?
its not a digital device...
solidstate
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20th October 2006
Old 20th October 2006
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What you mean?
ODZ
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20th October 2006
Old 20th October 2006
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the BK does not have any digital connections on it at all, so it won't have any bearing on your DA converters. it is a pretty clean little box. The only thing you may find hindering if you are in a situation that requires communication with cue mixes is the TB feature. the CR does not DIM when you engage the TB. you can always depress both the DIM and TB buttons simultaneously, but I have heard people butching about that one.
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#5
20th October 2006
Old 20th October 2006
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I had one in the studio for 6 months or so. It does what it does within a certan budget. It's not as bad as people like to say it is. If you don't have the coin for something better right now that's ok, it's not going to stop you from making great records. Besides running the rossetta through it will sound better than lesser converters running through the central station or the spl unit! If it matters I did't hear a HUGE difference between the attenuater in the dac-1 compared to the big knob.

By the way I eventually moved up to the central station which I think is quite transparent and also within my budget. Upgrade when you can, and always try to have fun.
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20th October 2006
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You stated you needed passive.. the BK is not passive... and i HATE what is does to audio. we tried a few monitor controllers.. the mackie was WAY down on the list.
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20th October 2006
Old 20th October 2006
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Lightbulb

geez i waz just about to get one
#8
21st October 2006
Old 21st October 2006
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He dosn't NEED passive, but he would preffer it. Yes the big knob is not passive but I'd say it's better than the m-patch which is passive. For 3 bills it ain't BAD, but you do get what you pay for in this industry.... YMMV

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21st October 2006
Old 21st October 2006
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Have you looked at used audiophool stereo preamps?



-tINY

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21st October 2006
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This is a perfect time to DIY and to spend some dollars on parts

Instead of a Big Knob, a person could DIY a step-attenuator level controller, with a left-right pair of 46-step 4-deck Shallco balanced ladder attenuators. If it's good enough for mastering, it's good enough for Low End (and preparing to step up).

Yes, they are expensive, but not like a Phat Toob Mic Pre.

Karl
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21st October 2006
Old 21st October 2006
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Yo, just get the Presonus central station.

The power supply is external.

I have a 230v euro model, but when i go to the states you can just buy a 110v powerbrick to work in the US and all will be fine...

That's what presonus told me anyway....

Cheers
jdg
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21st October 2006
Old 21st October 2006
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#13
21st October 2006
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We have a Big Knob in our B studio and I like it a lot.

I've heard the Central Station is better but I think it sounds fine.
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#14
21st October 2006
Old 21st October 2006
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Tried out the Big Knob and the Central station, kept the Central Station and returned the Big Knob !! I paid $349 for a new sealed box CS at GC, a no brainer at that price.
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21st October 2006
Old 21st October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdg View Post
Thats a very nice Elma switch for the level control, but that input selector is a very cheap and nasty 50 cent open frame switch that will clap out sooner than later - wonder why they used it? I suppose it can be replaced easily enough.

Apart from that, they don't come anymore passive that this!

Tim
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solidstate
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22nd October 2006
Old 22nd October 2006
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Ehy guys, thanks for the great feedback!

Beatsmith:

That's weird.. I asked them about it.. They sayd that each unit is wired for the specific voltage it was built for and my only option is to purchase a unit with the electrical rating i require. However i'll email them again. Thanks for your help man!


Jdg:

That's a really cool box(a bit expensive though). You own one?


I see there are many different opinions about the big knob.. Active or passive it's not that important, all i need it's a clean and transparent box. Of course i don't aspect the BK to perform like the SPL but i don't want coloration either. Otherwise what's the point on get good converters?
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solidstate View Post
Ehy guys, thanks for the great feedback!

Beatsmith:

That's weird.. I asked them about it.. They sayd that each unit is wired for the specific voltage it was built for and my only option is to purchase a unit with the electrical rating i require. However i'll email them again. Thanks for your help man!
Hey man

Here's what i said to them:

Quote:
Hi there

I have a Central Station + Remote and currently reside in the UK. I
may have to move to the USA for a year and will be taking my studio
with me - will the Central Station work over there? Obviously the
version i have is the 230v version, is it possible to switch it to
work on 110v?

Many thanks
Here's the reply:

Quote:
Hi Eddie

The voltage in US is 110V. You can't use your 220V power supply in US
because there is no switch 110V to 220V or vice versa on Central Station
power supply. You can buy the 110V power supply in US.

Best regards,

Ky Pham

PreSonus Audio Electronics
and also:

Quote:
Hi,

We sell the domestic 110v supplies here on our webstore (see our
website under sales/online shop), so once you're over here it's as easy as
placing an order on our web shop. Thanks!

Chad Kelly
Customer Support Manager
PreSonus Audio Electronics, Inc.
Seems to me like it should be fine?

Cheers
#18
23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EUPHONEVENIX View Post
geez i waz just about to get one
If you want one - get one.

Their great - they do nothing significant to the audio. Many professionals use them, who can afford better (The Matrix production team for one)

Take opinions on this board with a pinch of salt. (therefore that includes mine)
but all thse people who say the BK damages the audio - boy I'd LOVE to blind A/B test them in my studio.

I love mine and would be lost without it. I did lot's of A/B testing - converters straight into the actives and then through the BK.

Let's say there was a lot of egg on a lot of my freinds faces - no-one could consistanly pick the difference.

A/B A/B A/B A/B it's the only way. Forgot opinions, total waste of time.

Peace

Trebor
solidstate
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Beatsmith i really think that presonus should get you a free T-shirt or something! They might have sold a CS because of you !LOL!

However i'd have lil' side question. I could decrease or increase the input sensitivity on my Mackie HR 624 to control the volume from the analog output of the rosetta?

Once again, thanks folks!
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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How about the A-design ATTY ? passive,cheap,suppose to be fairly uncolored.
Cons:doesnt support multiply Sets (the new ATTY2D approches this "issue")
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Was just about to suggest the ATTY and there it is.

Totally passive and should work great. The Big Knob just ruins the audio. Talk about collapse of stereo image and a blanket thrown over the audio.

Central Station would be good too, definitely does not muck with the audio as much as the Big Knob.

I use the Dangerous ST controller, but at $1,800 isn't really viable to suggest in this forum. Having just got the ATTY for other purposes I'm interested to test it's sound quality against that of the Dangerous for comparison. Or maybe I really don't want to know...
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Quote:
The Big Knob just ruins the audio. Talk about collapse of stereo image and a blanket thrown over the audio.
I'd wanna beleive that too - if I'd spent $1800 on a volume knob ;-)

Trebor
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Warren View Post
The Big Knob just ruins the audio. Talk about collapse of stereo image and a blanket thrown over the audio.
that kind of hyperbole is just unwarranted....
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23rd October 2006
Old 23rd October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toolskid View Post
that kind of hyperbole is just unwarranted....
You and your fancy words..

Toolskid sucks so good.

Gustav
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24th October 2006
Old 24th October 2006
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I own and NHT pro and also recently baught a central station. The CS maintains the stereo image at lower levels much better than the NHT. Both are completely passive, so dont let the word 'passive' fool you into thinking that all passive attenuaters are created equal.
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24th October 2006
Old 24th October 2006
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If you've reversed the left and right channels of the att'r and verified that that is the culprit (and not an input or output impedance mis-match on something), then you can change the offending resistors, or add a few in parallel.

That's the advantage of stepped resistor att'rs.

Besides, they claim a tracking accuracy of 1/2dB if it doesn't measure up, send it back for repair.

Jeeze.



-tINY

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24th October 2006
Old 24th October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toolskid View Post
that kind of hyperbole is just unwarranted....
Is "hyperbole" even better than the Superbowl?

I tried Big Knob, Central Station and the SPL MTC2381.
I ended up going for the 2381.

I would have preferred a rackmount but without going into the thousands (for Dangerous, Cransong etc) the SPL had the best features and sound.
My stereo imaging has dramatically imporved- I was using a Mackie LM3204 previously.
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24th October 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toolskid View Post
that kind of hyperbole is just unwarranted....
Yeah I don't know what a hyperbole is except maybe something I may have smoked many years ago...

But I do know that there's no way you're going to stuff all of those buttons, switches, and knobs along with all those electronics and 27 quarter inch jacks into that Big Knob chassis, make it in China, and then sell it for $250 bucks here and it's going to sound transparant, accurate, and true to the source??

Yeah okay, and I've got some prime swampland, I mean 'real estate', I'd like to sell you down in Florida.

Bottom line: You want a volume controller to mess around with audio production in your bedroom and make some demos, cool, Big Knob has your name written all over it, right next where it says 'Made In China'. You actually make records and want to accurately monitor your audio, buy something (just about anything) else. You'd be better off wiring a stereo volume pot from radio shack for $3.29 than getting the Big Knob.
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25th October 2006
Old 25th October 2006
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So, if you don't pay a fortune for it, it CAN'T sound good? Maybe I should go into business making expensive stuff for Austin studios. I could have the sub assemblies made in Juarez and integrate them in the USA. I'll mark them up by 25x so that they are expensive enough to sound good......

I think maybe the heat or the BBQ has gone to your head, Texan.



-tINY

#30
25th October 2006
Old 25th October 2006
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Trebor Flow is offline
Quote:
Bottom line: You want a volume controller to mess around with audio production in your bedroom and make some demos, cool, Big Knob has your name written all over it, right next where it says 'Made In China'. You actually make records and want to accurately monitor your audio, buy something (just about anything) else. You'd be better off wiring a stereo volume pot from radio shack for $3.29 than getting the Big Knob.
You don't really beleive that do you?

The bit about "I make records so the BK not good enough for me" that's just plain silly.

I could spend the next 2hrs listing "gear made in china" that has provided the signal for many many records that have sold in millions. Hell everything Focusrite make now, is made in Chine - so all those people using Liquid Channel's like Sting and Paul Carrick etc are all using crap gear made in China?

The Matrix production team - who have literally sold millions use a Big Knob - better PM them and let them know they can't do that, coz there "making records"

I've got a £6000 vocal path and a £250 volume knob - I have no problem with that.

Trebor
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